Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think your only hope is state schools. State schools are lower cost, and therefore less affluent people do not need as much aid to go there. And that aid is partially spread out over the entire tax paying population, while at private schools, the cost for the less affluent is put all onto the small number of wealthier students, income from the endowment, and alumni donations.

I frankly do not understand why schools with huge endowments like Princeton still insist on punishing the wealthy by charging high tuition. They have plenty of money from endowment interest to subsidize the poorer students without this. I think it just makes them feel righteous to be able to punish people who have saved their entire lives.

Actually at my SLAC, the endowment subsidizes even wealthy people. When I was still in school, the true cost of educating per student was 2x the sticker price.

OP thinks that her family is subsidizing poor students, but I think she's wrong if she's looking at top schools.

With her DD's stats, she is not looking at top schools. Sure, if your kid has a 4.0 unweighted and 1600 SATs, it doesn't matter what your income is. But what if your kid is solidly in the 80th percentile and you are upper middle class? I guess you just bankrupt yourself and put your kid into a ton of debt. there is no choice.

3.8 and 1250 stats can still get you in a highly rated college with a large endowment. Sure, the kid is likely not to get into the most prestigious college, but you do not have to bankrupt yourself to get your kid a good education.

Can you name a school that would accept such a kid and cost less than $50k/year full pay? That totals 200k over 4 years, which is a typical home (and most even upper middle class people would need a 30 year mortgage plus the tax breaks that come with that mortgage)

Op you should look at schools with big merit awards although with those stats it's likely second and third tier schools. You can then decide on the relative value vs cost. In state is probably a better option if you are in VA because the second tier schools are generally better than the second tier in MD.

If you want merit aid it may be worth trying to bring the SAT scores up.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think your only hope is state schools. State schools are lower cost, and therefore less affluent people do not need as much aid to go there. And that aid is partially spread out over the entire tax paying population, while at private schools, the cost for the less affluent is put all onto the small number of wealthier students, income from the endowment, and alumni donations.

I frankly do not understand why schools with huge endowments like Princeton still insist on punishing the wealthy by charging high tuition. They have plenty of money from endowment interest to subsidize the poorer students without this. I think it just makes them feel righteous to be able to punish people who have saved their entire lives.

Actually at my SLAC, the endowment subsidizes even wealthy people. When I was still in school, the true cost of educating per student was 2x the sticker price.

OP thinks that her family is subsidizing poor students, but I think she's wrong if she's looking at top schools.

With her DD's stats, she is not looking at top schools. Sure, if your kid has a 4.0 unweighted and 1600 SATs, it doesn't matter what your income is. But what if your kid is solidly in the 80th percentile and you are upper middle class? I guess you just bankrupt yourself and put your kid into a ton of debt. there is no choice.

3.8 and 1250 stats can still get you in a highly rated college with a large endowment. Sure, the kid is likely not to get into the most prestigious college, but you do not have to bankrupt yourself to get your kid a good education.

Anonymous wrote:IP is engaging in what is called "opportunity hoarding" and if you believe the things coming out of the Brookings Institue is a contributing factor to growing income inequality in America.

My college education was financed by scholarships. There are plenty of opportunities for hardworking and/or talented kids. I don't fault OP for seeking out best value schools.

Anonymous wrote:IP is engaging in what is called "opportunity hoarding" and if you believe the things coming out of the Brookings Institue is a contributing factor to growing income inequality in America.

It is not "opportunity hoarding" to question a system that requires upper middle class Americans to have superhuman self control, so that they can save several times the net value of their home (which they needed a 30 year mortgage to afford) in order to send their kinds to college, when they don't even know in advance if their kid will be college material. Other nations don't do that. Look at Canada, which has a great low-cost public university system and almost no private universities. Most advanced countries are like this. We also used to have much cheaper state universities, but most state schools are "public" in name only, using tuition for the bulk of their revenue. Why does the US cling to what are clearly inferior ways of financing public goods like education and health care when there are plenty of examples of ways of doing it better.

IP is engaging in what is called "opportunity hoarding" and if you believe the things coming out of the Brookings Institue is a contributing factor to growing income inequality in America.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think your only hope is state schools. State schools are lower cost, and therefore less affluent people do not need as much aid to go there. And that aid is partially spread out over the entire tax paying population, while at private schools, the cost for the less affluent is put all onto the small number of wealthier students, income from the endowment, and alumni donations.

I frankly do not understand why schools with huge endowments like Princeton still insist on punishing the wealthy by charging high tuition. They have plenty of money from endowment interest to subsidize the poorer students without this. I think it just makes them feel righteous to be able to punish people who have saved their entire lives.

Actually at my SLAC, the endowment subsidizes even wealthy people. When I was still in school, the true cost of educating per student was 2x the sticker price.

OP thinks that her family is subsidizing poor students, but I think she's wrong if she's looking at top schools.

With her DD's stats, she is not looking at top schools. Sure, if your kid has a 4.0 unweighted and 1600 SATs, it doesn't matter what your income is. But what if your kid is solidly in the 80th percentile and you are upper middle class? I guess you just bankrupt yourself and put your kid into a ton of debt. there is no choice.

Anonymous wrote:I think your only hope is state schools. State schools are lower cost, and therefore less affluent people do not need as much aid to go there. And that aid is partially spread out over the entire tax paying population, while at private schools, the cost for the less affluent is put all onto the small number of wealthier students, income from the endowment, and alumni donations.

I frankly do not understand why schools with huge endowments like Princeton still insist on punishing the wealthy by charging high tuition. They have plenty of money from endowment interest to subsidize the poorer students without this. I think it just makes them feel righteous to be able to punish people who have saved their entire lives.

Actually at my SLAC, the endowment subsidizes even wealthy people. When I was still in school, the true cost of educating per student was 2x the sticker price.

OP thinks that her family is subsidizing poor students, but I think she's wrong if she's looking at top schools.

Anonymous wrote:Thank you PP. The whole college admission process seems like a maze. We are considering Flagship state school but wanted other options.

What state are you in? In VA, your DD's stats will not get her into UVA, WM or VT Engineering. I don't get the impression they will get her to UMD, but MD folks know better. They will also not get her into a top OOS flagship (a UC, UNC, U of M etc).

Anonymous wrote:I think your only hope is state schools. State schools are lower cost, and therefore less affluent people do not need as much aid to go there. And that aid is partially spread out over the entire tax paying population, while at private schools, the cost for the less affluent is put all onto the small number of wealthier students, income from the endowment, and alumni donations.

I frankly do not understand why schools with huge endowments like Princeton still insist on punishing the wealthy by charging high tuition. They have plenty of money from endowment interest to subsidize the poorer students without this. I think it just makes them feel righteous to be able to punish people who have saved their entire lives.

I think we make a mistake by generalizing all of the schools like this. Princeton is actually one of the Ivies that has a very generous financial aid package. Our HHI is 195K and we would qualify for some financial aid. Harvard is similar - Brown not as much and note their endowment is much smaller.

OP your best bet is to apply widely and apply to schools that give merit aid where your kids stats are at the top of the pile. If you look at the common data sets for schools you can see the GPAs and test score ranges for students admitted last year. You would not just be limited to state schools. In fact OOS tuition is subsidizing a lot at many state schools and for some like the UC system you can't event get the classes you want and there is major overcrowding and kids don't get out in four years. Basically CA has been underfunding their college system and allowing OOS to fill the gap. So be careful about making generalizations about state schools.

Apply widely if you are chasing merit aid. Check out the blog and webinars at the www.collegesolution.com. That woman (lynn shaugnessey) knows what she is talking about when it comes to figuring out how to afford college.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:what a stupid way to pick schools...

Talk to me in 10 years when we've been able to either pay for grad school or give her a big house downpayment.

yeah, but your kid has a pretty nice safety net in life no matter where she goes to college. I'd just go ahead and let her attend the best school she can get into that she also wants to attend.

Anonymous wrote:Is there a guide (i.e. Listing of common data set in one place) where you can find the net tuition as a percentage of gross tuition? I'd be more than happy to pay more for my DD to get better instruction and smaller classes etc. So I'd probably start with schools where students pay closest to sticker at least for the ones that are good for my DDs stats?

I think you can get this information at http://www.nacubo.org/Research/NACUBO_Tuition_Discounting_Study.html for $750. If anybody is wealthy enough to buy it and share that information here

Anonymous wrote:what a stupid way to pick schools...

Talk to me in 10 years when we've been able to either pay for grad school or give her a big house downpayment.

Anonymous wrote:what a stupid way to pick schools...

The OP wants the best value education per dollar. Don't we all?

While expressed poorly, that is exactly the right calculation.

OP apparently puts a low value on socioeconomic diversity, so it does not figure into their value function. For others, that would receive a high weight.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is there a guide (i.e. Listing of common data set in one place) where you can find the net tuition as a percentage of gross tuition? I'd be more than happy to pay more for my DD to get better instruction and smaller classes etc. So I'd probably start with schools where students pay closest to sticker at least for the ones that are good for my DDs stats?

The "net tuition" thing isn't going to apply to you with those financial numbers. You're going to be full pay.

The net tuition numbers are certainly applicable to me as I'll avoid schools that are within my DDs stats but offer too much financial aid as you are right we won't get any.