Anonymous wrote:If this is the case, FCPS RIP. Middle class and upper middle class parents will flee like rats off a sinking ship.

Sure, white flight. Like when they fled into FCPS from "urban" areas. Same as it ever was, same as it ever was.

Anonymous wrote:This comes up every year. I am a FCPS teacher and I assure you if your daughter is in Biology, World History 1 or Algebra 1 class they will have 20-21 year old boys in the class. An ESOL student takes biology and World 1 their third year in a team taught class where half the students are non esol and the other half are. If you don't want your 14 year old daughter in a class sitting next to a 21 year old man make sure they sign up for honors classes.

Why is this an issue? Last time I checked sitting next to an adult make did not automatically endanger you. Unless you believe that "they're not sending us their best people," and every Latino ESL student poses a threat to all females, simply because of their county of origin.

You guys are unbelievable.

Rapists are rapists, and they come in all shapes, sizes, and colors and we have no way to identify them prior to their criminal act. You do realize that your daughters have a far greater chance of being raped by a drunk frat boy at some point during their college years than they do by an immigrant who sits next to them in freshman Biology, right?

If this is the case, FCPS RIP. Middle class and upper middle class parents will flee like rats off a sinking ship.

It only varies school to school depending on the ESOL population. But if a kid is 17 and moves here with no credit he is a freshman at level 1. In his 3rd year he will be a 20 year old junior and that is when he will take biology and World 1 which are freshman classes.

Anonymous wrote:This comes up every year. I am a FCPS teacher and I assure you if your daughter is in Biology, World History 1 or Algebra 1 class they will have 20-21 year old boys in the class. An ESOL student takes biology and World 1 their third year in a team taught class where half the students are non esol and the other half are. If you don't want your 14 year old daughter in a class sitting next to a 21 year old man make sure they sign up for honors classes.

This varies somewhat from school to school, but it's pretty true.

This comes up every year. I am a FCPS teacher and I assure you if your daughter is in Biology, World History 1 or Algebra 1 class they will have 20-21 year old boys in the class. An ESOL student takes biology and World 1 their third year in a team taught class where half the students are non esol and the other half are. If you don't want your 14 year old daughter in a class sitting next to a 21 year old man make sure they sign up for honors classes.

I don't care what color the adults are. If you don't get your diploma by 19 you'll need to leave. Perhaps that will also stop the redshirting. Classes should be grouped by age. If you're not within 2yrs of the appropriate age group you should have to go to an alternative class or school.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the maximum age for a middle schooler? Because I see kids who are obviously a few years older, and have heard about kids being held back. These are not necessarily immigrants or ESOL.

Is there an alternative middle school setting for those who have had academic and/or disciplinary issues at the current middle school?

I commented on another thread but it's relevant here- I am a sixth grade teacher and once had a class with students aged 10,11,12,13 AND 14. It was a disaster for so many reasons.

This was also an ELL class made of new arrivals, primarily from DR but also Puerto Rico and some Central America . Most years that was a great class but the age mix that year didn't work and the older student was involved with gangs and a terrible influence all around. School couldn't do anything (it said) and said he had to stay there because he had failed the year before. This is NYC. I am at a new school now.

Do parents in general have ANY idea that their children are in classes with adults? This is absolutely astonishing to me and I've been deeply involved in our schools via the PTA, School Board races etc... for nearly two decades. I'm shocked. Truly. I thought these "adult children" went to an alternative school. My gosh, I'm going to recommend EVERY new home buyer study a school's ESOL percentage before purchasing a home - OR plan to go to private school.

Private school is not necessarily any better. My DC attend private school and more then half the boys in my DD class are over 1.5 years older. There are only 8 boys in her classroom and 4 are over 2 years older then the rest of the class. I find private school have more parents practice red shirting. Most of the parents tell me how they send their kids to kindergarten in public and then repeat kindergarten the following year in private. That's why their kids excel in the beginning years. The need for kids to be 1st has increased the average ages in every classroom. It's even worse in my younger child's class where both girls and boys are red shirts.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the maximum age for a middle schooler? Because I see kids who are obviously a few years older, and have heard about kids being held back. These are not necessarily immigrants or ESOL.

Is there an alternative middle school setting for those who have had academic and/or disciplinary issues at the current middle school?

I commented on another thread but it's relevant here- I am a sixth grade teacher and once had a class with students aged 10,11,12,13 AND 14. It was a disaster for so many reasons.

This was also an ELL class made of new arrivals, primarily from DR but also Puerto Rico and some Central America . Most years that was a great class but the age mix that year didn't work and the older student was involved with gangs and a terrible influence all around. School couldn't do anything (it said) and said he had to stay there because he had failed the year before. This is NYC. I am at a new school now.

Do parents in general have ANY idea that their children are in classes with adults? This is absolutely astonishing to me and I've been deeply involved in our schools via the PTA, School Board races etc... for nearly two decades. I'm shocked. Truly. I thought these "adult children" went to an alternative school. My gosh, I'm going to recommend EVERY new home buyer study a school's ESOL percentage before purchasing a home - OR plan to go to private school.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How are ages verified for those claiming to be under 18?

How are ages verified for any of the "undocumented" (illegal) immigrants?

It is difficult. I posted about the 15 year and 364 day old 7th grade student. We had our doubts that he was ONLY that old. He had an extremely mature physique, which happens sometimes, but his facts about his age didn't really add up.

We need better answers about how we are going to group children in schools. If we are using age, which we do as evidenced by the focus on birth dates at the K and 1st grade entry points, then we also need to be looking at age for the older children, too, when they are placed in to an older grade level. Our process now, where there are huge disparities between the average age of the students and the age of the older new students, is fraught with problems.

Anonymous wrote:How are ages verified for those claiming to be under 18?

How are ages verified for any of the "undocumented" (illegal) immigrants?

How are ages verified for those claiming to be under 18?

Anonymous wrote:What is the maximum age for a middle schooler? Because I see kids who are obviously a few years older, and have heard about kids being held back. These are not necessarily immigrants or ESOL.

Is there an alternative middle school setting for those who have had academic and/or disciplinary issues at the current middle school?

I commented on another thread but it's relevant here- I am a sixth grade teacher and once had a class with students aged 10,11,12,13 AND 14. It was a disaster for so many reasons.

This was also an ELL class made of new arrivals, primarily from DR but also Puerto Rico and some Central America . Most years that was a great class but the age mix that year didn't work and the older student was involved with gangs and a terrible influence all around. School couldn't do anything (it said) and said he had to stay there because he had failed the year before. This is NYC. I am at a new school now.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Last week's horrific and violent rape in a MOCO HS got me wondering about FCPS's policies with regards to illegal Adults who register for public education services. Do they go to An alternative HS or are they mainstreamed with regular students? All the recent MS 13 gang activity makes me wonder who is mingling with our kids. Anyone from FCPS who can share insight into the policies? And in which High Schools are these unaccompanied minors and 18 yo's being placed?

FCPS has two Adult High Schools for students 18-22, both of which include ESOL education. There's also a Transitional HS ESOL program for students age 18+ who test into grades 9-12 at various schools throughout the county. My guess is that at least the guy who is 18 would have been in one of those two programs and not in a regular classroom setting. The other one probably would have been in a regular school setting but in the ESOL program if he did not speak much English.

He was probably 17 when he enrolled. Both of them had been here 6-7 months so probably enrolled at the beginning of the school year.

Being 18 in high school is not unusual, although obviously being 18 in 9th grade is. My rich white kids were both 18 when they graduated from high school, as were probably 3/4s of their classmates (given a 9/1 age cutoff for kindergarten entry and a June graduation date, the majority of the seniors should have had their 18th birthday by graduation).

PP here. I can see FCPS letting the older guy enroll in regular classes (or ESOL at a regular high school, anyway, depending on his English proficiency), but I have serious doubts they'd put him in with the 9th grade class. I'm on my phone and can't look it up easily but I am curious how that works. I fully support adult ESOL and educating all students regardless of their immigration status, but don't think it's a good idea to put 18 year olds in a freshman class for any reason.

I took a very advanced foreign language class as a freshman with a bunch of seniors in FCPS. I don't think we can simply segregate by age like that. Also, they were in a hallway - it's not like they keep the ninth graders separate all the time. In this case three things must happen at bare minimum with the unaccompanied minors coming in: 1) background checks and 2) sexual harrassment training and 3) PDA on school property (kissing) needs to be eliminated as it leads to worse behavior

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Last week's horrific and violent rape in a MOCO HS got me wondering about FCPS's policies with regards to illegal Adults who register for public education services. Do they go to An alternative HS or are they mainstreamed with regular students? All the recent MS 13 gang activity makes me wonder who is mingling with our kids. Anyone from FCPS who can share insight into the policies? And in which High Schools are these unaccompanied minors and 18 yo's being placed?

FCPS has two Adult High Schools for students 18-22, both of which include ESOL education. There's also a Transitional HS ESOL program for students age 18+ who test into grades 9-12 at various schools throughout the county. My guess is that at least the guy who is 18 would have been in one of those two programs and not in a regular classroom setting. The other one probably would have been in a regular school setting but in the ESOL program if he did not speak much English.

He was probably 17 when he enrolled. Both of them had been here 6-7 months so probably enrolled at the beginning of the school year.

Being 18 in high school is not unusual, although obviously being 18 in 9th grade is. My rich white kids were both 18 when they graduated from high school, as were probably 3/4s of their classmates (given a 9/1 age cutoff for kindergarten entry and a June graduation date, the majority of the seniors should have had their 18th birthday by graduation).

PP here. I can see FCPS letting the older guy enroll in regular classes (or ESOL at a regular high school, anyway, depending on his English proficiency), but I have serious doubts they'd put him in with the 9th grade class. I'm on my phone and can't look it up easily but I am curious how that works. I fully support adult ESOL and educating all students regardless of their immigration status, but don't think it's a good idea to put 18 year olds in a freshman class for any reason.

If they have no credits from their country, they are freshman no matter how old they are. I teach ESOL and I have kids from ages 14-20 in my classes. It is not ideal, but that's the way the system works right now.

Another teacher. A few years ago I had a student as old as 15 and 364 days in 7th grade. Once he hit 16 our assistant principal was finally able to move him to an alternative placement for the remainder of the year. It was a real problem to have a 4-5 year age span in the classroom since I also had some young (11 years old) 7th grade students at the same time.