Anonymous
12/28/2016 23:47
Subject: Re:Block Schedules
Anonymous wrote:Teacher here. This is my experience as well. If a kid is absent it's even worse because the kid can go six days without seeing his/her teacher/class. For example, if a kid is absent on a Thursday, he misses his Spanish/Geometry class. He will not go to Spanish/Geometry until the next Monday. The last time he was in class was the previous Tuesday. These are classes where practice and reinforcement are essential.
Are you seriously counting the weekend as days missed? In that case, move school to 7 days per week because if a kid is absent on Friday, it's a full 3 days before he's back in class. While you're at it, get rid of holidays and the winter break as well. Regardless of the number of days since his last class, the kid has only missed one day of class.
Three is half of six. And it's not just that. Having five days in a row of practice is more important in some subject areas. People who become master musicians or become good at anything are instructed to practice every day. There's a reason they don't tell them every other day.
Can't their homework be to practice everyday? Like, musicians do that anyway, particularly those interested in becoming master musicians. And they don't have to be in class everyday in order to practice. Most master musicians take lessons just 1 (maybe 2, which is a stretch) times per week and practice every other day.
Anonymous
12/28/2016 23:45
Subject: Re:Block Schedules
Anonymous wrote:All the people saying that this will help the kid get organized, well, that's a nice thought. But if a kid has organizational issues (and the parents are not able to help the kid), you have just given him academic ones as well. Are you willing to let his academics go by the wayside as you wait for him to mature and become better at organizing? Just something to ponder.
I just don't understand this concern. Not sure how block scheduling worsens a disorganized child more academically than a traditional schedule. If my lack of organization causes me to be a poor student, it won't matter if I have a class every day or every other day.
You're right that you don't understand.
Yup! I think block scheduling is amazing!
Anonymous
12/28/2016 22:29
Subject: Re:Block Schedules
I like the idea of having an anchor day with block scheduling.
Anonymous
12/28/2016 21:56
Subject: Block Schedules
I have an ADHD kid in a FCPS MS that switched from traditional to block this year (between 7th and 8th for D.C.). I was concerned that we would have issues with D.C. not having the same routine everyday, but she loves it, and we have not seen a drop in grades. In fact, she now gripes every Monday morning that it is anchor day, and she has to drag all of her books plus instrument to school. Plus she says it is the most stressful exhausting day of the week, because she just gets settled in, and is switching classes over and over. I can see a downside if DD was taking a language. Besides that, we see only positives. Even math has not been a problem.
Block works well for HS aged D.C., too. It allows him to generally have a couple days heads up on homework assignments, and do the assignments in bigger chunks, with more control over timing. He also prefers it to the traditional MS schedule.
Block works well for HS aged D.C., too. It allows him to generally have a couple days heads up on homework assignments, and do the assignments in bigger chunks, with more control over timing. He also prefers it to the traditional MS schedule.
Anonymous
12/28/2016 21:37
Subject: Block Schedules
When people criticize music education and block scheduling, and have data to back it up, they are generally looking at a 4x4 schedule. 4 classes per semester times 2 semesters a year, and not an A day/ B day schedule. So, kids either need to sign up for a double block-- one each semester, or only play one semester a year. That is a problem. But not a problem with the A/B or A/B/ Anxhor day scheduling in FCPS.
Of course, if your kid wants to make significant progress in their instrument, they do have to practice outside of class. And nothing about a block schedule keeps my kids from practicing a half hour a night, 5-6 days a week. And they would certainly have to practice a lot more if they were serious musicians. Like almost anything, a big piece of succeeding at something is putting in the practice time of class and formal lessons.
Of course, if your kid wants to make significant progress in their instrument, they do have to practice outside of class. And nothing about a block schedule keeps my kids from practicing a half hour a night, 5-6 days a week. And they would certainly have to practice a lot more if they were serious musicians. Like almost anything, a big piece of succeeding at something is putting in the practice time of class and formal lessons.
Anonymous
12/28/2016 21:13
Subject: Re:Block Schedules
All the people saying that this will help the kid get organized, well, that's a nice thought. But if a kid has organizational issues (and the parents are not able to help the kid), you have just given him academic ones as well. Are you willing to let his academics go by the wayside as you wait for him to mature and become better at organizing? Just something to ponder.
I just don't understand this concern. Not sure how block scheduling worsens a disorganized child more academically than a traditional schedule. If my lack of organization causes me to be a poor student, it won't matter if I have a class every day or every other day.
You're right that you don't understand.
Anonymous
12/28/2016 21:11
Subject: Re:Block Schedules
Teacher here. This is my experience as well. If a kid is absent it's even worse because the kid can go six days without seeing his/her teacher/class. For example, if a kid is absent on a Thursday, he misses his Spanish/Geometry class. He will not go to Spanish/Geometry until the next Monday. The last time he was in class was the previous Tuesday. These are classes where practice and reinforcement are essential.
Are you seriously counting the weekend as days missed? In that case, move school to 7 days per week because if a kid is absent on Friday, it's a full 3 days before he's back in class. While you're at it, get rid of holidays and the winter break as well. Regardless of the number of days since his last class, the kid has only missed one day of class.
Three is half of six. And it's not just that. Having five days in a row of practice is more important in some subject areas. People who become master musicians or become good at anything are instructed to practice every day. There's a reason they don't tell them every other day.
Anonymous
12/28/2016 20:58
Subject: Block Schedules
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:A colleague did his dissertation on block vs traditional schedules in VA. All kids take the same SOLs, so it was easy to compare schools across the entire state. He accounted for things like school size, location and percentage of free/reduced meals.
Traditional schedule had significantly higher achievement.
Do you have a link to the thesis?
It's pointless to debate the research. Very little of it exists for middle schools, and what does exist generally shows no benefit, and possibly some harm for block scheduling in MS. But what works for one school may or may not work for another. So, it's hard to extrapolate too much.
What is clear is if you're going to do this, you need complete buy-in from parents and teachers, who need to be taught how to teach it. Double lectures are a horrible use of block scheduling time...
In terms of subjects, block can be good for science, social studies, and English. It's bad for sequential disciplines like languages and math. Unfortunately in this area, languages and many math classes are taught for high school credit, so if you screw things up by moving kids to block, it has a real-world effect on their academic paths. (Spanish 1, French 1, etc. are taught in 7th grade in many middle schools here.). So, the stakes are kind of high. And generally language and math teachers oppose block scheduling.
Block kills music programs. And it will cut back on the number of minutes in IEPs, etc.
I don't think block scheduling kills music programs. We have one MS kid in orchestra and one HS kid in band. Both prefer block. They love not having to drag the instruments to school every day. And it is more efficient, since so much time in a 47 minute period is spent putting the instruments together, warming up/turning and then taking them apart/ putting them away (especially in band). The music teachers in our MS say they prefer it, and we have not noticed a drop in participation/ class size since the move to block for the MS a couple years ago. In fact, I wish MS DD's orchestra class was smaller. They have 60+ kids in the highest orchestra for her grade (and there are more than one per grade).
They absolutely kill music programs. I'm glad your MS teachers say they prefer it, but they're the exception, not the norm. It may depend on the length of the class period and the type of block schedule used. A block that is 1 hour is very different than one that is 90 minutes. The 90-minute blocks in an A/B block schedule with an anchor day are terrible for music programs because it doesn't allow for daily instruction/practice. This is actually one of the few well-established negative externalities acknowledged about block scheduling.
The MS and HS my sons went to, also both had block schedules, and their music teachers (band for one son, orchestra for another) and the music programs at all levels thrived. In both cases, when block schedules came on board, the music teachers and science teachers were the biggest proponents of block scheduling. I am not sure where you found info to back up your claim that it is actually "one of the few well established negative...acknowledged..." Truly, when it came on board in a few MS's and HS's at the same time, all the music teachers were ecstatic due to the issue of trying to get kids in the room, instruments out and tuned, and to actually play/practice in a 40 min-45 minute time-frame had been very difficult. Students can and should still practice daily, regardless of block scheduling/"traditional" scheduling. I am actually kind of blown away that music teachers in your scenario don't like it.
Yeah. Not getting problem with block for music, either. You don't lose an elective slot. If your kid is serious about music they are practicing every day at home as part of homework. And if it is more for fun and they are blowing off practice, they are still playing 2-3 times a week for a longer chunk of time, even with no outside practice. They get more actual music instruction in, because so much of the time and the beginning and end of an instrument based class is wasted. For my band kid who has to assemble, disassemble, tune and clean an instrument each time it is used, probably an extra hour of class time a week on block plus an anchor day (5 x25 minutes vs 25 minutes plus 2x one hour). For certain both my kids' private music teachers prefer them to be on block schedule at school.
Whatever, your issues with block scheduling, music, like science, stands the most to gain. I would love to see a link to block schedules that don't decrease elective periods (drop from 7 to 6 classes) killing music programs.
Anonymous
12/28/2016 18:04
Subject: Re:Block Schedules
Teacher here. This is my experience as well. If a kid is absent it's even worse because the kid can go six days without seeing his/her teacher/class. For example, if a kid is absent on a Thursday, he misses his Spanish/Geometry class. He will not go to Spanish/Geometry until the next Monday. The last time he was in class was the previous Tuesday. These are classes where practice and reinforcement are essential.
Are you seriously counting the weekend as days missed? In that case, move school to 7 days per week because if a kid is absent on Friday, it's a full 3 days before he's back in class. While you're at it, get rid of holidays and the winter break as well. Regardless of the number of days since his last class, the kid has only missed one day of class.
All the people saying that this will help the kid get organized, well, that's a nice thought. But if a kid has organizational issues (and the parents are not able to help the kid), you have just given him academic ones as well. Are you willing to let his academics go by the wayside as you wait for him to mature and become better at organizing? Just something to ponder.
I just don't understand this concern. Not sure how block scheduling worsens a disorganized child more academically than a traditional schedule. If my lack of organization causes me to be a poor student, it won't matter if I have a class every day or every other day.
Are you seriously counting the weekend as days missed? In that case, move school to 7 days per week because if a kid is absent on Friday, it's a full 3 days before he's back in class. While you're at it, get rid of holidays and the winter break as well. Regardless of the number of days since his last class, the kid has only missed one day of class.
All the people saying that this will help the kid get organized, well, that's a nice thought. But if a kid has organizational issues (and the parents are not able to help the kid), you have just given him academic ones as well. Are you willing to let his academics go by the wayside as you wait for him to mature and become better at organizing? Just something to ponder.
I just don't understand this concern. Not sure how block scheduling worsens a disorganized child more academically than a traditional schedule. If my lack of organization causes me to be a poor student, it won't matter if I have a class every day or every other day.
Anonymous
12/28/2016 14:45
Subject: Block Schedules
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:A colleague did his dissertation on block vs traditional schedules in VA. All kids take the same SOLs, so it was easy to compare schools across the entire state. He accounted for things like school size, location and percentage of free/reduced meals.
Traditional schedule had significantly higher achievement.
Do you have a link to the thesis?
It's pointless to debate the research. Very little of it exists for middle schools, and what does exist generally shows no benefit, and possibly some harm for block scheduling in MS. But what works for one school may or may not work for another. So, it's hard to extrapolate too much.
What is clear is if you're going to do this, you need complete buy-in from parents and teachers, who need to be taught how to teach it. Double lectures are a horrible use of block scheduling time...
In terms of subjects, block can be good for science, social studies, and English. It's bad for sequential disciplines like languages and math. Unfortunately in this area, languages and many math classes are taught for high school credit, so if you screw things up by moving kids to block, it has a real-world effect on their academic paths. (Spanish 1, French 1, etc. are taught in 7th grade in many middle schools here.). So, the stakes are kind of high. And generally language and math teachers oppose block scheduling.
Block kills music programs. And it will cut back on the number of minutes in IEPs, etc.
I don't think block scheduling kills music programs. We have one MS kid in orchestra and one HS kid in band. Both prefer block. They love not having to drag the instruments to school every day. And it is more efficient, since so much time in a 47 minute period is spent putting the instruments together, warming up/turning and then taking them apart/ putting them away (especially in band). The music teachers in our MS say they prefer it, and we have not noticed a drop in participation/ class size since the move to block for the MS a couple years ago. In fact, I wish MS DD's orchestra class was smaller. They have 60+ kids in the highest orchestra for her grade (and there are more than one per grade).
They absolutely kill music programs. I'm glad your MS teachers say they prefer it, but they're the exception, not the norm. It may depend on the length of the class period and the type of block schedule used. A block that is 1 hour is very different than one that is 90 minutes. The 90-minute blocks in an A/B block schedule with an anchor day are terrible for music programs because it doesn't allow for daily instruction/practice. This is actually one of the few well-established negative externalities acknowledged about block scheduling.
The MS and HS my sons went to, also both had block schedules, and their music teachers (band for one son, orchestra for another) and the music programs at all levels thrived. In both cases, when block schedules came on board, the music teachers and science teachers were the biggest proponents of block scheduling. I am not sure where you found info to back up your claim that it is actually "one of the few well established negative...acknowledged..." Truly, when it came on board in a few MS's and HS's at the same time, all the music teachers were ecstatic due to the issue of trying to get kids in the room, instruments out and tuned, and to actually play/practice in a 40 min-45 minute time-frame had been very difficult. Students can and should still practice daily, regardless of block scheduling/"traditional" scheduling. I am actually kind of blown away that music teachers in your scenario don't like it.
Anonymous
12/28/2016 11:32
Subject: Block Schedules
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:A colleague did his dissertation on block vs traditional schedules in VA. All kids take the same SOLs, so it was easy to compare schools across the entire state. He accounted for things like school size, location and percentage of free/reduced meals.
Traditional schedule had significantly higher achievement.
Do you have a link to the thesis?
It's pointless to debate the research. Very little of it exists for middle schools, and what does exist generally shows no benefit, and possibly some harm for block scheduling in MS. But what works for one school may or may not work for another. So, it's hard to extrapolate too much.
What is clear is if you're going to do this, you need complete buy-in from parents and teachers, who need to be taught how to teach it. Double lectures are a horrible use of block scheduling time...
In terms of subjects, block can be good for science, social studies, and English. It's bad for sequential disciplines like languages and math. Unfortunately in this area, languages and many math classes are taught for high school credit, so if you screw things up by moving kids to block, it has a real-world effect on their academic paths. (Spanish 1, French 1, etc. are taught in 7th grade in many middle schools here.). So, the stakes are kind of high. And generally language and math teachers oppose block scheduling.
Block kills music programs. And it will cut back on the number of minutes in IEPs, etc.
I don't think block scheduling kills music programs. We have one MS kid in orchestra and one HS kid in band. Both prefer block. They love not having to drag the instruments to school every day. And it is more efficient, since so much time in a 47 minute period is spent putting the instruments together, warming up/turning and then taking them apart/ putting them away (especially in band). The music teachers in our MS say they prefer it, and we have not noticed a drop in participation/ class size since the move to block for the MS a couple years ago. In fact, I wish MS DD's orchestra class was smaller. They have 60+ kids in the highest orchestra for her grade (and there are more than one per grade).
They absolutely kill music programs. I'm glad your MS teachers say they prefer it, but they're the exception, not the norm. It may depend on the length of the class period and the type of block schedule used. A block that is 1 hour is very different than one that is 90 minutes. The 90-minute blocks in an A/B block schedule with an anchor day are terrible for music programs because it doesn't allow for daily instruction/practice. This is actually one of the few well-established negative externalities acknowledged about block scheduling.
Anonymous
12/28/2016 11:31
Subject: Re:Block Schedules
And generally language and math teachers oppose block scheduling.
Teacher here. This is my experience as well. If a kid is absent it's even worse because the kid can go six days without seeing his/her teacher/class. For example, if a kid is absent on a Thursday, he misses his Spanish/Geometry class. He will not go to Spanish/Geometry until the next Monday. The last time he was in class was the previous Tuesday. These are classes where practice and reinforcement are essential.
All the people saying that this will help the kid get organized, well, that's a nice thought. But if a kid has organizational issues (and the parents are not able to help the kid), you have just given him academic ones as well. Are you willing to let his academics go by the wayside as you wait for him to mature and become better at organizing? Just something to ponder.
Anonymous
12/28/2016 10:48
Subject: Block Schedules
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:A colleague did his dissertation on block vs traditional schedules in VA. All kids take the same SOLs, so it was easy to compare schools across the entire state. He accounted for things like school size, location and percentage of free/reduced meals.
Traditional schedule had significantly higher achievement.
Do you have a link to the thesis?
It's pointless to debate the research. Very little of it exists for middle schools, and what does exist generally shows no benefit, and possibly some harm for block scheduling in MS. But what works for one school may or may not work for another. So, it's hard to extrapolate too much.
What is clear is if you're going to do this, you need complete buy-in from parents and teachers, who need to be taught how to teach it. Double lectures are a horrible use of block scheduling time...
In terms of subjects, block can be good for science, social studies, and English. It's bad for sequential disciplines like languages and math. Unfortunately in this area, languages and many math classes are taught for high school credit, so if you screw things up by moving kids to block, it has a real-world effect on their academic paths. (Spanish 1, French 1, etc. are taught in 7th grade in many middle schools here.). So, the stakes are kind of high. And generally language and math teachers oppose block scheduling.
Block kills music programs. And it will cut back on the number of minutes in IEPs, etc.
I don't think block scheduling kills music programs. We have one MS kid in orchestra and one HS kid in band. Both prefer block. They love not having to drag the instruments to school every day. And it is more efficient, since so much time in a 47 minute period is spent putting the instruments together, warming up/turning and then taking them apart/ putting them away (especially in band). The music teachers in our MS say they prefer it, and we have not noticed a drop in participation/ class size since the move to block for the MS a couple years ago. In fact, I wish MS DD's orchestra class was smaller. They have 60+ kids in the highest orchestra for her grade (and there are more than one per grade).
Anonymous
12/28/2016 10:31
Subject: Block Schedules
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:A colleague did his dissertation on block vs traditional schedules in VA. All kids take the same SOLs, so it was easy to compare schools across the entire state. He accounted for things like school size, location and percentage of free/reduced meals.
Traditional schedule had significantly higher achievement.
Do you have a link to the thesis?
It's pointless to debate the research. Very little of it exists for middle schools, and what does exist generally shows no benefit, and possibly some harm for block scheduling in MS. But what works for one school may or may not work for another. So, it's hard to extrapolate too much.
What is clear is if you're going to do this, you need complete buy-in from parents and teachers, who need to be taught how to teach it. Double lectures are a horrible use of block scheduling time...
In terms of subjects, block can be good for science, social studies, and English. It's bad for sequential disciplines like languages and math. Unfortunately in this area, languages and many math classes are taught for high school credit, so if you screw things up by moving kids to block, it has a real-world effect on their academic paths. (Spanish 1, French 1, etc. are taught in 7th grade in many middle schools here.). So, the stakes are kind of high. And generally language and math teachers oppose block scheduling.
Block kills music programs. And it will cut back on the number of minutes in IEPs, etc.
Anonymous
12/28/2016 10:27
Subject: Block Schedules
Anonymous wrote:A colleague did his dissertation on block vs traditional schedules in VA. All kids take the same SOLs, so it was easy to compare schools across the entire state. He accounted for things like school size, location and percentage of free/reduced meals.
Traditional schedule had significantly higher achievement.
Do you have a link to the thesis?