Anonymous
12/27/2016 21:30
Subject: Re:Jewish Families: What are your holiday traditions?
Get chinese food on Christmas.
Anonymous
12/27/2016 14:02
Subject: Re:Jewish Families: What are your holiday traditions?
"When Napoleon left Elba with a small group of soldiers, Louis XVIII sent his army to crush him. But Napoleon won. No one claimed devine intervention."
Who was the Marshall Ney of the Hanukkah story?
Who was the Marshall Ney of the Hanukkah story?
Anonymous
12/27/2016 14:01
Subject: Jewish Families: What are your holiday traditions?
Anonymous wrote:
You call that a miracle? History is full of events where few defeated many.
The miracle of Purim is that a generally drunken, silly man, did not have his beautiful beloved wife killed when she entered his chamber without permission.
I would suggest that is even more common than military victories over steep odds.
The beauty of both holidays is that we see miracles not in the overt violation of natural law, but in the subtle, hidden, working out of providence, in which human action is the immediate cause. Note both are later stories, introducing a notion of the role of Hashem in history different from the earlier view.
Anonymous
12/25/2016 11:50
Subject: Jewish Families: What are your holiday traditions?
The way you make December no big deal is by celebrating pesach, Purim, and the other holidays. Then when December rolls around, a normal low keyed Hanukkah feels kinda right.
Anonymous
12/24/2016 21:38
Subject: Jewish Families: What are your holiday traditions?
Nothing for the "holiday season". The only christmassy thing we might do is something like the zoo lights. Otherwise it's business as usual. We do 8 days of Chanukah, lighting a menorah, eating latkes, presents, a few small indoor decorations. Community/synagogue parties when available. But it's 8 days and that's it...not a season.
But we belong to a synagogue and do events and holidays all year long, so it doesn't feel out of place or like we are only doing one thing during the year. The kids are learning the history and enjoying the cultural and community parts of it.
But we belong to a synagogue and do events and holidays all year long, so it doesn't feel out of place or like we are only doing one thing during the year. The kids are learning the history and enjoying the cultural and community parts of it.
Anonymous
12/23/2016 18:36
Subject: Jewish Families: What are your holiday traditions?
*divine
Anonymous
12/23/2016 18:34
Subject: Jewish Families: What are your holiday traditions?
Anonymous wrote:I have never been to fond of Chanukah. It commemorates a victory in a war the Jews ultimately lost.
That the Hasmoneans failed as rulers, and were overtaken by Rome, does not mean that particular war was lost. We are thankful for Hashem granting us chances, even when we go on to blow those chances.
Furthermore, there's that asinine story about the Ner Tamid lasting for 8 nights. But the Books of the Maccabees never mentions any light lasting for 8 nights. It merely says that the festival is to be celebrated for 8 nights.
Because it is rededicating the Beit Hamikdash. Which was originally dedicated on sukkot. Which lasts (effectively) 8 days. To really grok hanukkah, you have to constantly bear in mind the connection to Sukkot. Which the Maccabees could not celebrate appropriately that year.
The 8 night miracle was written by some rabbi centuries
Creativity! Reinvention! yay!
later who felt that the Books of the Maccabees were lacking because they had no miracles.
It already had a miracle - the victory of the few over the many,
You call that a miracle? History is full of events where few defeated many. In 1982, a small group of British marines took the Falklands back from a much larger Argentine army. No one said it was a miracle. When the Manchus invaded China and overthrew the Ming dynasty and replaced it with the Ching, they claimed they did it to help China defeat northern invaders. But the invaders defeated the Ching. The Ching asked for volunteers. 150 monks from the Shoalin Temple in Fukien volunteered. They defeated the invaders without suffering a single casualty. No one claimed devine intervention, the monks were just master martial artists. When Napoleon left Elba with a small group of soldiers, Louis XVIII sent his army to crush him. But Napoleon won. No one claimed devine intervention. When Franco invaded Spain with a small group from Morrocco, not only did he face the whole Spanish army, but he faced brigades organized by Stalin from all over the world, like the International Brigades and even the Abraham Lincoln Brigade. Now Hitler provided neither manpower nor much aid, but he gave lip service to Franco. Therefore, I doubt anyone but the most die hard Catholic would say that Hashem was on Franco's side. Yet he defeated a much larger and better armed force. Smaller, weaker forces have beaten larger, better armed forces throughout history, and they're not always the good guys. Nothing to do with miracles.
Anonymous
12/23/2016 14:04
Subject: Jewish Families: What are your holiday traditions?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I have never been to fond of Chanukah. It commemorates a victory in a war the Jews ultimately lost.
That the Hasmoneans failed as rulers, and were overtaken by Rome, does not mean that particular war was lost. We are thankful for Hashem granting us chances, even when we go on to blow those chances.
Furthermore, there's that asinine story about the Ner Tamid lasting for 8 nights. But the Books of the Maccabees never mentions any light lasting for 8 nights. It merely says that the festival is to be celebrated for 8 nights.
Because it is rededicating the Beit Hamikdash. Which was originally dedicated on sukkot. Which lasts (effectively) 8 days. To really grok hanukkah, you have to constantly bear in mind the connection to Sukkot. Which the Maccabees could not celebrate appropriately that year.
The 8 night miracle was written by some rabbi centuries
Oh, dear. Our enemies we can handle, but Hashem save us from our friends.
Creativity! Reinvention! yay!
later who felt that the Books of the Maccabees were lacking because they had no miracles.
It already had a miracle - the victory of the few over the many, of the weak over the strong. But a military miracle was not what the rabbis wanted honored.
But the story is stupid. The Ner Tamid had been out for a century. In that case, it could be out another 8 days until more oil was available. If you only have enough oil for one night, and it will take at least a week to get more oil, YOU DON't LIGHT THE NER TAMID!
A. I am not sure what you lose, halakhically, by lighting when you have only oil for one night B. If you have faith in Hashem, the entire equation changes.
Oy, vey. Our enemies we can handle, but Hashem save us from our friends.
Anonymous
12/23/2016 14:01
Subject: Jewish Families: What are your holiday traditions?
Anonymous wrote:I have never been to fond of Chanukah. It commemorates a victory in a war the Jews ultimately lost.
That the Hasmoneans failed as rulers, and were overtaken by Rome, does not mean that particular war was lost. We are thankful for Hashem granting us chances, even when we go on to blow those chances.
Furthermore, there's that asinine story about the Ner Tamid lasting for 8 nights. But the Books of the Maccabees never mentions any light lasting for 8 nights. It merely says that the festival is to be celebrated for 8 nights.
Because it is rededicating the Beit Hamikdash. Which was originally dedicated on sukkot. Which lasts (effectively) 8 days. To really grok hanukkah, you have to constantly bear in mind the connection to Sukkot. Which the Maccabees could not celebrate appropriately that year.
The 8 night miracle was written by some rabbi centuries
Oh, dear. Our enemies we can handle, but Hashem save us from our friends.
Creativity! Reinvention! yay!
later who felt that the Books of the Maccabees were lacking because they had no miracles.
It already had a miracle - the victory of the few over the many, of the weak over the strong. But a military miracle was not what the rabbis wanted honored.
But the story is stupid. The Ner Tamid had been out for a century. In that case, it could be out another 8 days until more oil was available. If you only have enough oil for one night, and it will take at least a week to get more oil, YOU DON't LIGHT THE NER TAMID!
A. I am not sure what you lose, halakhically, by lighting when you have only oil for one night B. If you have faith in Hashem, the entire equation changes.
Anonymous
12/23/2016 09:42
Subject: Jewish Families: What are your holiday traditions?
I have never been to fond of Chanukah. It commemorates a victory in a war the Jews ultimately lost.
That the Hasmoneans failed as rulers, and were overtaken by Rome, does not mean that particular war was lost. We are thankful for Hashem granting us chances, even when we go on to blow those chances.
Furthermore, there's that asinine story about the Ner Tamid lasting for 8 nights. But the Books of the Maccabees never mentions any light lasting for 8 nights. It merely says that the festival is to be celebrated for 8 nights.
Because it is rededicating the Beit Hamikdash. Which was originally dedicated on sukkot. Which lasts (effectively) 8 days. To really grok hanukkah, you have to constantly bear in mind the connection to Sukkot. Which the Maccabees could not celebrate appropriately that year.
The 8 night miracle was written by some rabbi centuries
Creativity! Reinvention! yay!
later who felt that the Books of the Maccabees were lacking because they had no miracles.
It already had a miracle - the victory of the few over the many, of the weak over the strong. But a military miracle was not what the rabbis wanted honored.
But the story is stupid. The Ner Tamid had been out for a century. In that case, it could be out another 8 days until more oil was available. If you only have enough oil for one night, and it will take at least a week to get more oil, YOU DON't LIGHT THE NER TAMID!
A. I am not sure what you lose, halakhically, by lighting when you have only oil for one night B. If you have faith in Hashem, the entire equation changes.
That the Hasmoneans failed as rulers, and were overtaken by Rome, does not mean that particular war was lost. We are thankful for Hashem granting us chances, even when we go on to blow those chances.
Furthermore, there's that asinine story about the Ner Tamid lasting for 8 nights. But the Books of the Maccabees never mentions any light lasting for 8 nights. It merely says that the festival is to be celebrated for 8 nights.
Because it is rededicating the Beit Hamikdash. Which was originally dedicated on sukkot. Which lasts (effectively) 8 days. To really grok hanukkah, you have to constantly bear in mind the connection to Sukkot. Which the Maccabees could not celebrate appropriately that year.
The 8 night miracle was written by some rabbi centuries
Creativity! Reinvention! yay!
later who felt that the Books of the Maccabees were lacking because they had no miracles.
It already had a miracle - the victory of the few over the many, of the weak over the strong. But a military miracle was not what the rabbis wanted honored.
But the story is stupid. The Ner Tamid had been out for a century. In that case, it could be out another 8 days until more oil was available. If you only have enough oil for one night, and it will take at least a week to get more oil, YOU DON't LIGHT THE NER TAMID!
A. I am not sure what you lose, halakhically, by lighting when you have only oil for one night B. If you have faith in Hashem, the entire equation changes.
Anonymous
12/22/2016 19:17
Subject: Jewish Families: What are your holiday traditions?
I have never been to fond of Chanukah. It commemorates a victory in a war the Jews ultimately lost. Furthermore, there's that asinine story about the Ner Tamid lasting for 8 nights. But the Books of the Maccabees never mentions any light lasting for 8 nights. It merely says that the festival is to be celebrated for 8 nights. The 8 night miracle was written by some rabbi centuries later who felt that the Books of the Maccabees were lacking because they had no miracles. But the story is stupid. The Ner Tamid had been out for a century. In that case, it could be out another 8 days until more oil was available. If you only have enough oil for one night, and it will take at least a week to get more oil, YOU DON't LIGHT THE NER TAMID!
Anonymous
12/22/2016 17:11
Subject: Jewish Families: What are your holiday traditions?
We always come to NYC because life here goes on during Christmas. Even if you stay in the DC area, we eat Chinese food and go to the movies. We light the menorah and give one present each day for 8 days. We sing songs and play dreidel.
Anonymous
12/22/2016 15:50
Subject: Jewish Families: What are your holiday traditions?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:OP here- to answer the PP, I'm asking about the holiday season (ie, after thanksgiving through New Years time frame). I suppose I'm in the minority but I grew up culturally Jewish but not around a lot of Jews so I was always envious of all of the Christmas stuff (cookie decorating, decorating the house, picking out a tree, etc.).
Yes, I know that Hanukkah is a minor religious holiday.
Maybe I'm projecting my own feelings but I don't want my kid to feel left out of the holiday fun and want to foster some non-religious traditions for our family. I guess the closest is the move and chinese food idea but obviously it's not very baby/toddler friendly!
Thanks PP for the book recommendation- I'll check it out.
Look I hear you. I just want to point out that for those Jews, religious or cultural, who celebrate (religiously or secularly) the entire Jewish calendar, December is not quite that big a deal. They may do a little hanukkah or a lot, they may do only Hanukkah or even do some secular winter stuff (my wife loves looking our neighbors' lights) but the sense of everyone else having all the fun is less. We have fun too, but not necessarily at the same time of year. I think we make Hanukkah bear too much of the work of countering an entire culture, when there are so many Jewish resources that are more effective that we neglect.
Yes, I agree with this - I'm the other PP who recommended the book. People have sometimes asked me whether my kids feel "left out" at Christmas, without Santa, etc, and honestly the answer is no, and it was the same for me as a kid. I just looked at it as the fun festival that other people celebrate, and we have the different festivals that we celebrate. We enjoy what I think of as "Christmas cheer" - i.e. the festive activities (like this year we went to the Botanical Gardens, we saw the Nutcracker, etc,) and wintery things like hot chocolate and mulled wine, but I just don't feel like there's anything missing from my life on 25 December. If you're not part of it already I'd also recommend signing up for PJ Library, which is an amazing organization that sends your kid a free book every month on Jewish themes, and there are local chapters which organize events for kids which will have a Jewish element but are non-religious. Sign up here (or if this isn't your area then sign up to your local area one https://pjlibrary.org/communities/Greater-Washington-DC/203074 ) - there are lots of ways to be celebrate your Judaism and make your own traditions. And here's an article I just came across while looking for the link for you: http://www.jconnect.org/Home/Holidays-Highlights/December-Holidays
Anonymous
12/22/2016 15:48
Subject: Jewish Families: What are your holiday traditions?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:OP here- to answer the PP, I'm asking about the holiday season (ie, after thanksgiving through New Years time frame). I suppose I'm in the minority but I grew up culturally Jewish but not around a lot of Jews so I was always envious of all of the Christmas stuff (cookie decorating, decorating the house, picking out a tree, etc.).
Yes, I know that Hanukkah is a minor religious holiday.
Maybe I'm projecting my own feelings but I don't want my kid to feel left out of the holiday fun and want to foster some non-religious traditions for our family. I guess the closest is the move and chinese food idea but obviously it's not very baby/toddler friendly!
Thanks PP for the book recommendation- I'll check it out.
We put up Hanukkah decorations in the house. A Happy Hanukkah banner across the mantel and that sort of thing. We don't go crazy, but enough to make the house feel a little more festive for 8 days. You can make Hanukkah sugar cookies with dreidel and star cut outs too. So far I've hit your "christmasy things" of cookie and house decorating. You will get all sorts of responses on this, but even though Hanukkah is a minor Jewish holiday, we don't have a problem playing it up in our house. We also have or attend a Hanukkah party each year. We eat Latkes at some point over the week and exchange gifts and light the candles each night. We do not go to temple for Hanukkah, but we do belong to a temple.
You can also come up with a different Christmas Day tradition. It can be a movie and Chinese, or you can make it a nice "family day" where you play board games all day, or invite another Jewish family over for brunch or dinner each year, have a movie marathon at home, etc.
You can also make a bigger thing of New Years Eve or New Years Day in your house.
I understand where OP is coming from. There is something festive and happy about the "Christmas" season, and for us at least, it is nice to find a way to embrace that spirit in our own way, without celebrating Christmas.
PP here. I want to add that we do belong to a temple and our children attend Religious school every week and feel connected to their religion. We go to temple on High Holidays, celebrate Passover, and attend a few Friday night shabbat services during the year. So Hanukkah is not the only time we celebrate our religion.
Anonymous
12/22/2016 15:46
Subject: Jewish Families: What are your holiday traditions?
Movies and Chinese on Christmas Day. Beyond that, nothing.