Anonymous wrote:...but it sounds like on a day-to-day basis he is not a bad father figure? If that's true, he deserves respect for helping to raise his stepsons, not derision.

It's great he's provided a comfortable house and cars to drive to school... but that's where it ends. The kids would like to go to college, their mom would love it. But when uninformed parents lack understanding about college prep and refuse to fund, it doesn't give them a realistic shot to go. Of course we all know anecdotes, but these are children's lives, not a craps game. And when everything turns out as research predicts, he has his excuse teed up, "They're not mine. I gave them a great upbringing. A nice house, even cars!"

I also know his tune about paying for college will change when it's time for "his" kids.

You really can't just stroll into the middle of someone else's family and tell them that they don't know what they're doing. Let them do it their way. Like your BIL, I'd be livid and I'd tell you off, too.

Plenty of high schools offer SAT prep as part of the curriculum. If the kids want to, they probably have that option. Believe it or not, most kids don't pay for a private SAT prep class, and most families don't have college funds for the kids. You are the abnormal family, here. Not them. If the kids are destined for college, they can figure out how to get there themselves.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I agree with all this. There are solid options for kids who don't have family money.

BIL actually makes decent money. I'd est. $130K per year, which is far too much for kids to get any Pell Grant, etc. funding. And they don't save, they're on tilt - leased cars, no equity in house, credit cards have been declined when we've been out.

No, they are miles away from Pell Grants, which--given how paltry Pells are and how poor you have to be to qualify for them--is a GOOD thing. Come on, OP.

$130k with four kids will likely mean pretty good financial aid, especially if there is no equity in the house.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like you should back off until the kids are adults and then they can ask you for help if they want it.

Until the kids are 18, you can make offers to assist...

18 is far too late to make much of a difference.

Kids would love to go to college and get away from home and step-father. But again, the household is ignorant about how to become prepared.

PP who wrote "until the kids are 18..."

As the mom of teens, I STRONGLY disagree with this. 18 is not at all too late to make a difference. I strongly suggest you readjust your thinking.

Most kids in the US go to college without having taken SAT prep courses. Most kids become prepared for college simply by attending high school and doing their school work. You can help them with that by showing an interest in what they are studying, encouraging them to work hard, and talking with them about their plans for the future. You can ask them if they have access to SAT study guides, ask if they have signed up for testing dates, ask if they are working with their guidance counselors. You can be emotionally supportive even if not financially supportive at this time.

I get the sense from your posts that you have a notion these kids need to get into top colleges or they will end up deadbeats. That is absolutely false. I also have a sense that you are thinking you will pay for top colleges or not at all. That is a terrible mistake IMO. If they don't have the grades/test scores to get to a top college, they can get solid educations at South Podunk State. And you can help with that. If they get to South Podunk State and realize they really want to be at Ivy U, they can work towards transferring. You can help with that. And if the kids aren't prepared for college at 18, they can get prepared by going to community college and then hopefully on to a 4-year degree. You can help with that.

MOST kids in the US do not go "away" to college, they go to colleges within an hour of home. Do not let perfect (in your opinion) be the enemy of good, or even the enemy of better than nothing.

18 isn't too late. Later than you might wish, but not too late to make a difference.

You can provide them with books and guidance. You can provide money for them to apply to colleges (whether straight out of high school or once they're in community college). You can provide tuition money provided they keep their grades up. You can help them move away from home and get settled at school.

But whatever you do, don't badmouth their bio dad, their stepdad, their mom...

"reverse snobbery" ... yes, ignorant, backwards and intimidated ... and also a control-freak by any means necessary.

doodlebug wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like you should back off until the kids are adults and then they can ask you for help if they want it.

Until the kids are 18, you can make offers to assist...

18 is far too late to make much of a difference.

Kids would love to go to college and get away from home and step-father. But again, the household is ignorant about how to become prepared.

So set up regular "dates" with the boys where you invite them over for a day or an overnight, do something fun and sneak in some college talk.

+1
I get what you're saying about the husband being a controlling jerk, and it sounds like one of those people who embraces reverse snobbery. I certainly don't think everyone needs to or should go to college (really - if someone doesn't have aptitude in that direction, but does for a trade, go for the trade!), but be present as their aunt and uncle and work the topic in. They're teens; it's a natural topic. It's very kind of you to be concerned.

Also, please reconsider your assessment of the boys' futures. Sure, it's possible that someone without a college education could become a deadbeat dad. But it's also possible for someone WITH a college education to be a deadbeat. And there are certainly many non-college-educated men who are gainfully employed, contributing members of society. It sounds like your BIL is one of them.

You are going to need to tread carefully, OP. It sounds like you want to be involved in these kids' lives and to help them as much as you can. But you might not be able to do that, or might be very limited in your ability to do that, if you piss off their stepfather while they are still living with him. Don't make things harder for them by provoking BIL's ire. He may be too controlling and too cavalier about their education and futures, but it sounds like on a day-to-day basis he is not a bad father figure? If that's true, he deserves respect for helping to raise his stepsons, not derision.

1) Question: is BIL saving for his biological children's college education? If not, then perhaps this is just something that he does not prioritize. If so, then your sister is doing her older children a huge disservice. But even so, it's not your business.

2) Maybe if your offers of tutors came with fewer smug strings attached, they would be more receptive.

3) No one is stopping you from opening 529s for these boys. You don't even have to tell your sister or her husband about it. Wait until the kids are college-bound, and then tell them, the legal adults to whom the money belongs.

4) It's really not your business, though, so help quietly or get your nose out of his family.

Whoa - I see how your intentions might be alright but you are coming at this all wrong.

Here's how you do this well:

Neither of my parents went to college, but I was a bright kid with a lot of potential. My aunt and uncle invited me to stay with them in the city over the summer, and basically exposed me to their awesome quality of life, made possible by their education. They never said it outright, but they definitely talked about how much fun they had in college and how it set the stage for their success.

Then they privately talked to my parents, told them they thought I was a really good kid who had the ability to succeed in college, and offered to hire me as a babysitter and overpay me so that I could afford college prep classes and the like.

They never made my parents feel badly, and they talked to my parents before they ever made the offer to me. Basically, the tone of the discussion was "We are incredibly lucky to be in a position to do this, and at some time in the past someone helped us, so we want to pay it forward."

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like you should back off until the kids are adults and then they can ask you for help if they want it.

Until the kids are 18, you can make offers to assist...

18 is far too late to make much of a difference.

Kids would love to go to college and get away from home and step-father. But again, the household is ignorant about how to become prepared.

So set up regular "dates" with the boys where you invite them over for a day or an overnight, do something fun and sneak in some college talk.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like you should back off until the kids are adults and then they can ask you for help if they want it.

Until the kids are 18, you can make offers to assist...

18 is far too late to make much of a difference.

Kids would love to go to college and get away from home and step-father. But again, the household is ignorant about how to become prepared.

Anonymous wrote:OP here: It's not a humble brag. We are in a position to afford the tutor and prep course and pay for their college (if they become prepared). At the end of the day they are broke and have no concept of what college costs.

They are ignorant about how to prepare their children for college and show no desire to learn. Sister wanted to get a job, he forbid her, because he's one of those guys that needs to be in complete control the house.

If they don't go to college and turn into their deadbeat father, the BIL will merely say "They're not my kids." Subconsciously maybe that's what he wants so his real kids to look better.

You may be completely right, who knows. But....still not your business. You are working towards a huge fight with your Sister and very little contact with the whole family. I agree with the rest, almost unanimous DCUM pp's to mind your own business.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like you should back off until the kids are adults and then they can ask you for help if they want it.

This. Until the kids are 18, you can make offers to assist, but they should be made to your sister. She can decide whether or not to accept your help.

Once the kids are 18, there is no reason not to offer to help the kids directly. There would be no need for BIL to know if the kid didn't want him to. If BIL expects the kids to take care of paying for college themselves, then he isn't likely to know if some of the savings/scholarship money comes from you.

If you have a chunk of change to spend, consider opening up 529s with the kids as beneficiaries. Then when they are applying to college, you can let them know that you have been saving money for them and they can expect $x per year. The money can generally be spent on only on education expenses, and many plans are set up so that you can electronically transfer funds directly to the college where the student is enrolled. That way, you know the money is being spent on higher ed expenses, and it might make it easier for you to stay behind the scenes, so to speak, if the money goes directly to the college without having to pass through your nephews' or your sister/BIL's hands.

I agree with all this. There are solid options for kids who don't have family money. Make sure they are looking at less expensive in-state options (even if those schools aren't prestigious they can offer a good education) and understand net price. Doing a couple years at cc and transferring is also an option (because 6 year grad rates for cc students are so low, particularly for first-gen students, I prefer to see students start at a 4 year college, but you do what you have to do). Make sure they understand the difference federal loans (good option) and private loans (bad options).

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like you should back off until the kids are adults and then they can ask you for help if they want it.

This. Until the kids are 18, you can make offers to assist, but they should be made to your sister. She can decide whether or not to accept your help.

Once the kids are 18, there is no reason not to offer to help the kids directly. There would be no need for BIL to know if the kid didn't want him to. If BIL expects the kids to take care of paying for college themselves, then he isn't likely to know if some of the savings/scholarship money comes from you.

If you have a chunk of change to spend, consider opening up 529s with the kids as beneficiaries. Then when they are applying to college, you can let them know that you have been saving money for them and they can expect $x per year. The money can generally be spent on only on education expenses, and many plans are set up so that you can electronically transfer funds directly to the college where the student is enrolled. That way, you know the money is being spent on higher ed expenses, and it might make it easier for you to stay behind the scenes, so to speak, if the money goes directly to the college without having to pass through your nephews' or your sister/BIL's hands.