Anonymous wrote:Exactly -- they're not poor, they're over extended often (but not always) and have fallen into the -- but I'm a doctor/lawyer/banker, I SHOULD live close-in; live in a mansion; send kids to private school; take 2 vacations a yr [or whatever other financial want they believe they MUST do bc as a doctor/lawyer, it's only fitting].

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's that simple. Lots of people in this area are not from here and are not from any competitive market like SF or NYC or even NJ or Mass. So they think by making it to DC and making 300k, they have ARRIVED. Then they look around and realize there are people making 400k, 500k, 1 million etc. They look around at the Jones and realize that at 300k, they may have to think about private school and it's no fair that their friends making 500k have to give zero thought to whether to enroll their 3 kids in private school.

And then they look back home to Wisconsin or Arkansas or wherever and realize that it's no fair that their old high school classmates -- who weren't even class valedictorian and weren't ivy bound land are grads of the local non flagship u are making 150k in sales and living in a McMansion style house with 2 brand new cars, whereas they HAVE ARRIVED in DC but "only" have a 700k brick home from the 1960s to show for it.

I haven't seen the same insecurity from people coming from say Long Island or NJ or the Bay Area bc they are used to be around A LOT of money and are also from competitive places so they never expected that they would be "the one" in their group of peers who'd be the success.

There may be some of this, but these HCOL coastal cities aren't the only places where people make high salaries. My parents are MDs in "flyover country", and they easily pull in a 7 figure HHI.

What I've noticed on DCUM is that people have a skewed perception of "rich", that seems to look more like "Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous" (i.e. .1%). They don't think that having a house in a good part of town, maybe paying for private school and/or a nanny, having cars that work, having a savings, and having enough discretionary income to not have to worry too much about what/where they eat makes them UMC or even "rich" by most definitions. What's funny is that growing up in a LCOL area with parents who had a 7 figure income, that's more or less the lifestyle we lived...and I was very aware that we were rich. The additional things we did was have luxury cars, take international trips (we didn't necessarily stay in 5 star hotels, though, and those trips were typically to my parents' country of origin), and not stress about extra curricular activity spending. My parents were also able to pay full price for college for all of us. We still mostly shopped sales and discount stores/outlets.

I think another thing people miss is how much on the edge some people live, even with high incomes. My parents, especially my dad, are pretty conservative when it comes to savings. It's actually to the point where we sometimes wonder why he works so hard, given that all of his kids also earn good livings so we aren't depending on an inheritance from him (and he's not the type of parent to let us live off of a trust fund while he's alive). But a very good friend of his died relatively young (late 60s), after receiving an aggressive cancer diagnosis. My dad helped his wife sort out the financial details. It was clear that despite his friend also being a doctor who lived in the same part of town and spent, if anything, a bit more than my parents while certainly earning less on a single income, he hadn't planned his future as well. His wife who was a SAHM for 40+ years had to sell their house and start working again. I asked my dad the state of their mortgage, and he told me he had paid it off early around the time they turned 60 so there would be nothing for us to worry about whenever the time comes.

I think if people accept that rich means having a lot of choice in how you get the basics plus some variable amount of extra, then they would be a lot happier. Most MC people don't have a ton of choices and they do worry about how they are going to get the basics. Remember "Roseanne"? That's MC. Not sending your kids to one of the best public schools, affording a nanny, and having a car that's less than 10 years old.

Anonymous wrote:The more you have, the more you spend.

As a previous poster said, when you have two parents working jobs that require long hours/commutes, you have daycare/aftercare payments, two cars to pay for and maintain, you eat out more, you outsource cleaning and yard work and such. These become "necessities" in order for you to live the life that you want--working hard and enjoying your family. Not necessities on the same level as "food on the table and hot water" but necessities nonetheless based on your lot in life. Because, why work hard to make $300k/year if you are going to spend all of your free time cooking/cleaning and never have quality time w/your family?

Also, most people who make high incomes have a lot of education. That means a combo of a) student loans and b) college savings plans for their children (as education is a top priority in their family).

Adding that all up, you feel poor, because most of your $300k salary is spoken for.

Anonymous wrote:I think it comes down to the fact that most people who make $300-400K have two parents working. (ourselves included).
Having two parents navigating the 9-5 slog around DC plus taking care of young children (or school aged kids which personally I have found harder with two working parents) is a never-ending grind.
There's a feeling of, "there has to be more to life than this".
I love my job (this is not a SAH vs. WOTH debate) but it's pretty crazy to plan the logistics of having both spouses working. I feel like all we do is work, commute (and we live close enough that one spouse bikes), and take care
of the kids. Lather, rinse and repeat daily.

Sometime I wish we at least had fabulous vacations or gorgeous furniture for all of our effort.

Anonymous wrote:I think it's that simple. Lots of people in this area are not from here and are not from any competitive market like SF or NYC or even NJ or Mass. So they think by making it to DC and making 300k, they have ARRIVED. Then they look around and realize there are people making 400k, 500k, 1 million etc. They look around at the Jones and realize that at 300k, they may have to think about private school and it's no fair that their friends making 500k have to give zero thought to whether to enroll their 3 kids in private school.

And then they look back home to Wisconsin or Arkansas or wherever and realize that it's no fair that their old high school classmates -- who weren't even class valedictorian and weren't ivy bound land are grads of the local non flagship u are making 150k in sales and living in a McMansion style house with 2 brand new cars, whereas they HAVE ARRIVED in DC but "only" have a 700k brick home from the 1960s to show for it.

I haven't seen the same insecurity from people coming from say Long Island or NJ or the Bay Area bc they are used to be around A LOT of money and are also from competitive places so they never expected that they would be "the one" in their group of peers who'd be the success.

Anonymous wrote:It's because they don't understand how math works. They buy a bunch of expensive stuff, like paying a nanny's salary or a 4-5k mortgage, and then don't understand why there isn't enough "left over." YOU BOUGHT A LOT OF EXPENSIVE THINGS, LIKE A RICH PERSON. Maybe really rich people feel poor after they pay out their household staffs and buy yachts and see that there isn't much "left over."

Anonymous wrote:I think it's that as you move into different circles you become aware of additional things to desire/covet. Growing up, I never knew anyone with a beach house so it never occurred to me that I was missing out. But now that I know people who have them, I wonder if my kids are missing out because we don't.

Same with super-expensive sleep away camps, a boat, etc. The list of things to desire just gets bigger.

Also, we took music lessons with the little old lady around the corner growing up. But we found a serious teacher for our kid, which eventually moved to the world of expensive summer music camps, more expensive instruments, etc. That is probably the same with sports, etc. You grew up playing games in the neighborhood and now you know people who have three year olds taking private swimming lessons.

Also, I think a lot of is stems from the cut-throat competitive atmosphere. Kids who don't take private lessons don't get into the orchestra at your high school; kids who don't take private lessons don't make the baseball team; you worry that your kids can't compete with the kids who have had math tutoring beginning in first grade and you start to panic that it's not just that you're being stupid and spoiled but that your child is being actively left behind compared to the people who appear ot have unlimited resources to spend on their children.

Anonymous wrote:I think it comes down to the fact that most people who make $300-400K have two parents working. (ourselves included).
Having two parents navigating the 9-5 slog around DC plus taking care of young children (or school aged kids which personally I have found harder with two working parents) is a never-ending grind.
There's a feeling of, "there has to be more to life than this".
I love my job (this is not a SAH vs. WOTH debate) but it's pretty crazy to plan the logistics of having both spouses working. I feel like all we do is work, commute (and we live close enough that one spouse bikes), and take care
of the kids. Lather, rinse and repeat daily.

Sometime I wish we at least had fabulous vacations or gorgeous furniture for all of our effort.