You all need to listen to the 100 Cars episode of This American Life (podcast). It's awesome and fun and ends up explaining a lot about how dealerships work.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. We go in with a number we're willing to pay each month (reasonable to the cost of the car) with no money down and if they want the sale they figure out how to make it work. Somehow they always figure out a way.

The key is to go in before you actually need the car. If they know they have you over a barrel because you need a new car there's no incentive to figure out the deal.

This is a horrible way to think about purchasing a car. This method of car buying is a dealer's dream.

Not PP, but could you explain why?

Because you aren't negotiating the price of the car, you are negotiating the monthly payments.

Agree with PP. this is the the worst way o buy a car, unless you enjoy overpaying.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. We go in with a number we're willing to pay each month (reasonable to the cost of the car) with no money down and if they want the sale they figure out how to make it work. Somehow they always figure out a way.

The key is to go in before you actually need the car. If they know they have you over a barrel because you need a new car there's no incentive to figure out the deal.

This is a horrible way to think about purchasing a car. This method of car buying is a dealer's dream.

Not PP, but could you explain why?

Because you aren't negotiating the price of the car, you are negotiating the monthly payments.

Correct. And isn't that what ultimately matters? The cost of the car itself doesn't really matter to me. What matters to me is how much I will pay monthly.

If that is what you are concerned about; however, that approach is not fiscally responsible and that is why car dealers love people that want to haggle the payment & not the actual cost.

Can you explain your rationale? You keep asserting this as true, but aren't explaining why. Why is that approach not fiscally responsible? I'd like to know as I'll be in the market for a new car soon and ultimately I care most about my monthly payment.

Because the methods they use to get you down to that monthly payment ALWAYS cost more in the long run. It's not like they're going to say ok let us lower the price of the car so it fits your monthly payment amount. They will add another year of payments typically which will add to the amount of interest you're paying. That isn't the only way for them to do it, but it's the most used. I was married to a manager at a car dealer for quite a while and yes they do love the people that come in worried about the monthly amount. They always make more money that way.

NP. You're right that they make more money if they add another year of payments. But if you stick with the typical 36 or 39 month lease and get the monthly payment you want, then how is that a bad thing and why is the cost of the car so important? In my years of leasing cars, I've never had an issue with this method. Somehow they always find some kind of subsidy or incentive after they try the tactic you described. I will say it works faster if you are trying to get a car at the end of the model year.

There is no "best time of year" to buy a car. The typical way a dealer jiggers the monthly payment on a lease is to lower the number of miles on the lease. Buying, dealers have various incentives they can rack up in the F&I department. Negotiating a monthly payment labels you as a total sucker. Sorry but it's the truth.

There are plenty of car buying advice sites, but it really is pretty simple. Decide the car you want. Email 4-5 local dealers asking for a quote for a specific model (find a VIN if you want.) Narrow down to 2, ask for their best and final "off the lot" price. Either finance yourself or ask for their best financing incentives. One tip in MD - there are no prepayment penalties on car loans so you can negotiate a high interest rate loan with the dealer, have them give you the majority of their discount, and pay off at the first monthly payment.

12:51 here... What kind of car is this? Luxury?

OP here - maybe it's just the first dealer I dealt with. They want to make NO effort. They basically were like - the MSRP is x, if you want to buy we'll take $2000 off that; if you want to lease, sorry we only lease off of MSRP. The prices they are offering are higher than EVERY price on True Car in my area. Not to mention -- I want a particular model car and black interior/exterior. They don't have it on the lot so it went from - oh we can get it from another dealer or one of our other lots in 24 hrs, to them hard selling me a navy (which looks weird w a black interior). I walked away -- I mean if I lease I'll have it for 3 yrs, if I buy I'll have it for more than that -- is it too much to ask for to get the right damn color?? Esp. when that color isn't anything exotic or hard to find.

OP - Of course you must negotiate the price of the car (with all color/features/options YOU want. Just walk away if the dealer is unwilling to negotiate. I have bought/leased cars as far as Carolina and had my car shipped to me... Much better pricing and customer service than dealers in this area.

For those that simply say "lease is stupid" - everything is stupid if you don't know what you are getting into or talk about. Lease is advantageous in certain conditions.

For those who wonder why haggling on a payment is a bad idea. They can play the number game and talk you into a much longer financing term which will cost you more after all is done. Pick the car you want with the options you want, then stick to the present value/the selling price. Don't let them muddle it with different payment terms and interest rates.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Zero in on the make/ model/ year/ miles per year, money down etc. that you want. Then go to (or talk to) each dealer in the area and shop it around. Did this with Audi and magically the first dealer we visited was able to drop the MSRP a ton between the first price they offered and what we wound up doing. We basically went around in circles to three dealerships until we reached a price that 2 of 3 said no to, and then stopped there. Kind of felt like a jerk but the system's designed that way...

And then you leased or bought? For buying that's obviously how you do it. For leasing -- I've had dealers say -- nope sorry, I only lease at MSRP. Is that just their opening shot to make you think that they won't negotiate and then if you come back saying so-and-so down the street is willing to negotiate the starting MSRP on a lease, then they'll play ball too??

You can definitely negotiate leases, but it helps to be informed about what others have paid. If you try the tactic of saying someone else is willing to negotiate, that will probably help you.

Ok -- am using True Car to find what others have paid in my area on average. All the prices I'm seeing are 2-3k lower than the MSRP -- where the dealer wants to price out the lease. I'm not opposed to buying -- I just don't understand why the SAME car costs MSRP to lease vs. MSRP - 3000 (or 5000 or whatever you can negotiate down) to buy.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Zero in on the make/ model/ year/ miles per year, money down etc. that you want. Then go to (or talk to) each dealer in the area and shop it around. Did this with Audi and magically the first dealer we visited was able to drop the MSRP a ton between the first price they offered and what we wound up doing. We basically went around in circles to three dealerships until we reached a price that 2 of 3 said no to, and then stopped there. Kind of felt like a jerk but the system's designed that way...

And then you leased or bought? For buying that's obviously how you do it. For leasing -- I've had dealers say -- nope sorry, I only lease at MSRP. Is that just their opening shot to make you think that they won't negotiate and then if you come back saying so-and-so down the street is willing to negotiate the starting MSRP on a lease, then they'll play ball too??

You can definitely negotiate leases, but it helps to be informed about what others have paid. If you try the tactic of saying someone else is willing to negotiate, that will probably help you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. We go in with a number we're willing to pay each month (reasonable to the cost of the car) with no money down and if they want the sale they figure out how to make it work. Somehow they always figure out a way.

The key is to go in before you actually need the car. If they know they have you over a barrel because you need a new car there's no incentive to figure out the deal.

This is a horrible way to think about purchasing a car. This method of car buying is a dealer's dream.

Not PP, but could you explain why?

Because you aren't negotiating the price of the car, you are negotiating the monthly payments.

Correct. And isn't that what ultimately matters? The cost of the car itself doesn't really matter to me. What matters to me is how much I will pay monthly.

If that is what you are concerned about; however, that approach is not fiscally responsible and that is why car dealers love people that want to haggle the payment & not the actual cost.

Can you explain your rationale? You keep asserting this as true, but aren't explaining why. Why is that approach not fiscally responsible? I'd like to know as I'll be in the market for a new car soon and ultimately I care most about my monthly payment.

Because the methods they use to get you down to that monthly payment ALWAYS cost more in the long run. It's not like they're going to say ok let us lower the price of the car so it fits your monthly payment amount. They will add another year of payments typically which will add to the amount of interest you're paying. That isn't the only way for them to do it, but it's the most used. I was married to a manager at a car dealer for quite a while and yes they do love the people that come in worried about the monthly amount. They always make more money that way.

NP. You're right that they make more money if they add another year of payments. But if you stick with the typical 36 or 39 month lease and get the monthly payment you want, then how is that a bad thing and why is the cost of the car so important? In my years of leasing cars, I've never had an issue with this method. Somehow they always find some kind of subsidy or incentive after they try the tactic you described. I will say it works faster if you are trying to get a car at the end of the model year.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. We go in with a number we're willing to pay each month (reasonable to the cost of the car) with no money down and if they want the sale they figure out how to make it work. Somehow they always figure out a way.

The key is to go in before you actually need the car. If they know they have you over a barrel because you need a new car there's no incentive to figure out the deal.

This is a horrible way to think about purchasing a car. This method of car buying is a dealer's dream.

Not PP, but could you explain why?

Because you aren't negotiating the price of the car, you are negotiating the monthly payments.

Correct. And isn't that what ultimately matters? The cost of the car itself doesn't really matter to me. What matters to me is how much I will pay monthly.

If that is what you are concerned about; however, that approach is not fiscally responsible and that is why car dealers love people that want to haggle the payment & not the actual cost.

Can you explain your rationale? You keep asserting this as true, but aren't explaining why. Why is that approach not fiscally responsible? I'd like to know as I'll be in the market for a new car soon and ultimately I care most about my monthly payment.

Because the methods they use to get you down to that monthly payment ALWAYS cost more in the long run. It's not like they're going to say ok let us lower the price of the car so it fits your monthly payment amount. They will add another year of payments typically which will add to the amount of interest you're paying. That isn't the only way for them to do it, but it's the most used. I was married to a manager at a car dealer for quite a while and yes they do love the people that come in worried about the monthly amount. They always make more money that way.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. We go in with a number we're willing to pay each month (reasonable to the cost of the car) with no money down and if they want the sale they figure out how to make it work. Somehow they always figure out a way.

The key is to go in before you actually need the car. If they know they have you over a barrel because you need a new car there's no incentive to figure out the deal.

This is a horrible way to think about purchasing a car. This method of car buying is a dealer's dream.

Not PP, but could you explain why?

Because you aren't negotiating the price of the car, you are negotiating the monthly payments.

Correct. And isn't that what ultimately matters? The cost of the car itself doesn't really matter to me. What matters to me is how much I will pay monthly.

If that is what you are concerned about; however, that approach is not fiscally responsible and that is why car dealers love people that want to haggle the payment & not the actual cost.

Can you explain your rationale? You keep asserting this as true, but aren't explaining why. Why is that approach not fiscally responsible? I'd like to know as I'll be in the market for a new car soon and ultimately I care most about my monthly payment.

Anonymous wrote:Zero in on the make/ model/ year/ miles per year, money down etc. that you want. Then go to (or talk to) each dealer in the area and shop it around. Did this with Audi and magically the first dealer we visited was able to drop the MSRP a ton between the first price they offered and what we wound up doing. We basically went around in circles to three dealerships until we reached a price that 2 of 3 said no to, and then stopped there. Kind of felt like a jerk but the system's designed that way...

And then you leased or bought? For buying that's obviously how you do it. For leasing -- I've had dealers say -- nope sorry, I only lease at MSRP. Is that just their opening shot to make you think that they won't negotiate and then if you come back saying so-and-so down the street is willing to negotiate the starting MSRP on a lease, then they'll play ball too??

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. We go in with a number we're willing to pay each month (reasonable to the cost of the car) with no money down and if they want the sale they figure out how to make it work. Somehow they always figure out a way.

The key is to go in before you actually need the car. If they know they have you over a barrel because you need a new car there's no incentive to figure out the deal.

This is a horrible way to think about purchasing a car. This method of car buying is a dealer's dream.

Not PP, but could you explain why?

Because you aren't negotiating the price of the car, you are negotiating the monthly payments.

Correct. And isn't that what ultimately matters? The cost of the car itself doesn't really matter to me. What matters to me is how much I will pay monthly.

If that is what you are concerned about; however, that approach is not fiscally responsible and that is why car dealers love people that want to haggle the payment & not the actual cost.

Roughly, a lease should cover the depreciation of the car from time A, the start of the lease, to time B, the end of the lease. The value of the vehicle at time B is a guess: the estimated market value of the car, in, say, 3 years. The only other variable: the cost of the vehicle of time A. If a manufacturer wants to blow out of many vehicles nation-wide, they may offer lease "deals", which are usually expressed as a monthly pymt, with or without money down. Can you negotiate on the national deals? Sometimes, but not by much. You may be able to negotiate w the dealer on non-national deals. Results vary.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. We go in with a number we're willing to pay each month (reasonable to the cost of the car) with no money down and if they want the sale they figure out how to make it work. Somehow they always figure out a way.

The key is to go in before you actually need the car. If they know they have you over a barrel because you need a new car there's no incentive to figure out the deal.

This is a horrible way to think about purchasing a car. This method of car buying is a dealer's dream.

Not PP, but could you explain why?

Because you aren't negotiating the price of the car, you are negotiating the monthly payments.

Correct. And isn't that what ultimately matters? The cost of the car itself doesn't really matter to me. What matters to me is how much I will pay monthly.