Anonymous wrote:It depends. I will sometimes make the kids breakfast even though, at 12, 15 and 16, they are more than capable of doing it themselves. I generally do their laundry. I make the 16 year olds lunch every school day... I'm up anyway and she's rushing around to get ready. She knows how to do it, obviously. The other two are homeschooled so no lunches to pack. But sometimes they clean bathrooms, throw in a load of towels, wash dishes, make lunch for everyone, etc. I will also ask them to make me a cup of tea, go grab me something out of another room, and so on. As long as they know how to do things, I not opposed to doing things for them. It's just part of being a family, imo.

I respectfully agree.

Anonymous wrote:It is about balance. My teen can do all the things discussed: clean, laundry, self care, but not cook because he really doesn't like eating.

Sometimes I do those things for him. Sometimes I dont. Depends on the day and what else is going on.

I don't put my rules about what he should do before the needs of the day.

+1

I do a lot for DS (10) during the week, when his schedule is crazy tight. We're no longer in DC, and this is his first year of middle school and the transition to a heavier study load, different classes/teachers/learning style, actual grades, plus manditory extra curriculars has been tough. I cover all meals, laundry, homework reminders, test prep, etc. He struggles with organization the most, and really is only barely making it even with all of my help.

On weekends, he has more leeway and responsibility. Weekends are when he gets to decide when he wants to get up, what to make himself for breakfast & lunch. How he wants to schedule his days. I really try to keep all hands off during weekends so that he can recover from the week and learn non-academic skills like cooking and independently managing his social life & doing light chores (folding/put gas away laundry, dishes).

Now that first term grades are in, I've also dropped support for the classes he has done really well in, so that he can be a more independent student in those areas.

Anonymous wrote:My girl is almost 13 and in seventh grade. I tend to encourage and enable her to do for herself, but do for her when she's overwhelmed (whether in her head or not). She is capable of cleaning her room. But sometimes, I sit on her bed and re-organize her dresser drawers while she organizes everything else and we chat. I can not bring her lunch if she forgets - I'm at work and it'd take an hour to get to her and I can't leave work that way. But I'm fine with reminding her as she walks out the door to grab her lunch. If she's had a long day I'll sometimes carry her backpack home (we walk about a mile from the bus to get home). I've been known to do her homework for her if it's bullshit busy work and she knows the concepts.

I was thinking about something similar recently, OP. I saw a parent opening a car door for their kid. I can't remember my parents EVER opening the car door for me, whether it was to get in or out. I can see when children are under 3 yrs old and maybe it's too heavy, but kids in elementary school? Why are the kids just STANDING THERE?

This cannot be serious.

We are teaching our kids to do for themselves. Motivating us is our niece and nephew who were (and remain) continuously coddled. Our extended family complains at every get-together about how they can not hold a conversation, think for themselves, or even try to maintain a relationship with family outside their parents.

The youngest is now planning on moving home after graduating from a prestigious university. My BIL told me this with pride.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My girl is almost 13 and in seventh grade. I tend to encourage and enable her to do for herself, but do for her when she's overwhelmed (whether in her head or not). She is capable of cleaning her room. But sometimes, I sit on her bed and re-organize her dresser drawers while she organizes everything else and we chat. I can not bring her lunch if she forgets - I'm at work and it'd take an hour to get to her and I can't leave work that way. But I'm fine with reminding her as she walks out the door to grab her lunch. If she's had a long day I'll sometimes carry her backpack home (we walk about a mile from the bus to get home). I've been known to do her homework for her if it's bullshit busy work and she knows the concepts.

I was thinking about something similar recently, OP. I saw a parent opening a car door for their kid. I can't remember my parents EVER opening the car door for me, whether it was to get in or out. I can see when children are under 3 yrs old and maybe it's too heavy, but kids in elementary school? Why are the kids just STANDING THERE?

Why don't you just email the teacher and say "Hey, WE aren't going to do this bullshit busy work homework?" I'm judging you 9 ways from Sunday about doing your special snowflake's homework, oh yes I am.

+1 What a way to teach her that she can skip things *you* think are BS. There are some things at work that I have to do that I think are BS, but I still have to do it. There are things that she will have to do in HS/college that she might think is BS, and then she'll skip it or run to you to do it. Wow. If I thought some hw was bs, at minimum, I would tell my DC to do it, but I wouldn't balk if it was half-assed.

Anonymous wrote:My girl is almost 13 and in seventh grade. I tend to encourage and enable her to do for herself, but do for her when she's overwhelmed (whether in her head or not). She is capable of cleaning her room. But sometimes, I sit on her bed and re-organize her dresser drawers while she organizes everything else and we chat. I can not bring her lunch if she forgets - I'm at work and it'd take an hour to get to her and I can't leave work that way. But I'm fine with reminding her as she walks out the door to grab her lunch. If she's had a long day I'll sometimes carry her backpack home (we walk about a mile from the bus to get home). I've been known to do her homework for her if it's bullshit busy work and she knows the concepts.

I was thinking about something similar recently, OP. I saw a parent opening a car door for their kid. I can't remember my parents EVER opening the car door for me, whether it was to get in or out. I can see when children are under 3 yrs old and maybe it's too heavy, but kids in elementary school? Why are the kids just STANDING THERE?

Why don't you just email the teacher and say "Hey, WE aren't going to do this bullshit busy work homework?" I'm judging you 9 ways from Sunday about doing your special snowflake's homework, oh yes I am.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My mom cooked my breakfast, made my lunch for school, and did my laundry until I went off to college. It was nice. I have two older elementary-aged boys, and I expect that I will be doing the same for them through high school. Part of the reason for this is that I don't want them to have cereal and milk for breakfast and a PB&J for lunch every day. If I make breakfast/lunch for them, then I get to develop their palette a little more!

I had the same experience and I agree. I had no problem figuring out how to do laundry and make simple foods for myself when I got to college, and I figure my kids can figure it out then, too.

I don't think the problem is so much that the child won't be able to figure out how to do it if they aren't responsible for chores when younger. The problem becomes that they won't WANT to do it and will expect others around them to do it for them. Not saying every child will be like that but some. I don't want my kids to rely on someone else to do something that they CAN do for themselves. I don't want them to be lazy (who does though?) They need to learn to give and take.

I talk to my kids every now and again about what they want to be when they grow up. My daughter has always said teacher. For awhile, my son used to say nothing. I want to live at home after graduation. That has changed into cop, spy and federal agent. Maybe it's the making him do a few things on his own that's changed his mind or maybe it just comes with age.....

I think part of the issue is that we want things done a certain (our way, lol) and kids can't do it yet.

For example, my 4 and 5 year olds want to help with the laundry. But I balk because it won't be folded *just so* AND I think it will be faster. I think this year I am going to start letting them do it. I hang all shirts anyway - and I am going to teach them how to fold (I like to KonMari everything - we don't have much room).

I am not taking lunches or snacks to school for anyone. My pre-schooler gets hot lunch everyday, and my K'er takes his lunch. I pack it and put it in his bag. If for some reason he forgets it (sometimes he likes to see what is in it), tough shit. School lunch that day. I DO keep $20 on his account - so that he can buy lunch. I will probably set up a system in the next few years for packing lunches (take one thing from each category). I went to college with many helpless people. I don't want my kids to reach college age and still not know how to cook anything or do laundry.

I definitely way over-coddled early, but as my son turned 11 and then 12, he's doing more and more for himself. I'm encouraging that, and he naturally wants to do more for himself. his big job is feeding the dog twice a day. he doesn't do his own laundry, but he does take his laundry down to the laundry room. he's starting to show interest in cooking but still prefers if I cook for him. he is in charge of his own schoolwork/homework etc. I enjoyed the early coddling, and he really loved it, so I don't regret that time in his life. this just feels like a natural progression toward independence.

I had my first in my mid 20's and my husband and I didn't have our second until 8yrs later (after tons of infertility issues) As I was having our 2nd, I started to realize how much I have done for the 1st and will hopefully teach this one a little more independence.

Fast-forward and our kids are now 6 and 14 - both girls.

My 14yr old SUCKS at time management, autonomy, cleaning up her shit, preparing anything, doing chores, etc... She is book smart, sweet, immature for her age but very loyal and kind to everyone. She is completely content if I do things for her, even as a teen. She works her butt off to prove to teachers and friends how smart she is, but gives up on herself too quickly.

My 6yr old has more of her own thought process, learns things on her own, makes a ton of mistakes but doesn't give up, has street smarts and common sense that I am not sure if the 14yr old has. She isn't perfect in school but she is very smart and even if she doesn't apply herself all of the time, I know it is there. She is a social butterfly too. Includes everyone. She is not afraid of anything and just goes with the flow.

Now I know their personalities would have been different if I raised them as twins the same exact way. But I know for a fact I did too much FOR the first child and I think it backfired on me. And even though the little one drives me bonkers sometimes, she is the kid that I will worry about the least.

Anonymous wrote:We see this sort of side topic come up on other threads. I was curious about other people's thinking on this. A few caveats.

This is not intended to be a judgement on what other people choose. I would hope that people can discuss what they choose and why, expected results when the choice was made, and if possible actual results from experience of exercising that choice. It is assumed that, of course, all parents are making the best choices for their family from their knowledge, beliefs and experience. That is to say, I hope that differing opinions are not assumed to be judgements and that those difference can be shared without judgement.

The question comes up about the balance between doing FOR your kids (laundry, fetching their forgotten lunch to their school, making their lunches...) and requiring/expecting your kids to do for themselves. Obviously this is going to depend on age. Which way do you tend and why?

Funny you mention this. I was at a basketball practice at a middle school last night and sat out in the hall most of the time with a pretty good view of the gym. In that one hour, I saw four moms and only one of them with their child, go into a locker and get things and go back out the front door. And I just laughed because I thought about if I left something in my locker when I was in middle school, my mom would say "tough shit" LOL. Well not really, but parents used to not do those things for kids. And most of the time, moms weren't working. I guess they were secure in their position. I honestly think the current guilt has to do with the mom wars of either "staying home so this is my job" or "I don't stay home so I have to make up for it by doing anything to make it easier for them" is the problem today. Parents are so worried to prove to others and themselves that they are doing the best job, that they don't realize they are teaching their kids they are so perfect and don't have to do much of anything to contribute to that perfectness.

I think I fall somewhere in the middle. My kids are 17 and 12. I expect them to help out when asked and to pick up after themselves. My 12 year old needs constant reminding of this. My 17 year old is quite good about it and rarely needs asking. I'm actually quite pleased with my older kid--I think he could live on his own pretty successfully.

Mostly my approach has been not to put myself out too much as my kids become teens. So, I'm happy to do laundry if I'm doing it anyway, but if you need that shirt tomorrow, you'll have to do it yourself. Let me show you how, then you'll know how to do it next time. (Since you're doing laundry, can you wash this other stuff as well?) I'm happy to pick up something at the store if I'm going, but if not, you can walk or ride your bike to the drugstore and get your preferred shampoo. (While you're there, please buy x, y, and z as well, here's some money.) (Obviously this works only if the item is sold within safe walking or biking distance.) if I'm cooking myself something for lunch on Saturday, I'm happy to cook for you, too, but if not, make your own egg sandwich or tuna or whatever. (Since you're up, can you make enough for me? Lol.) Over time, it's a slow shift from doing everything to getting them to do for themselves, and some for me/others as well.

I frequently ask my kids to run the vacuum, take out the trash, empty the dishwasher, start dinner, change the sheets. One of them walks the dog every afternoon. If it means I have to go out of my way, and it's within biking or easy public transit distance, my older child takes public transit or rides his bike whenever possible.

My DH has a more generous definition of what's convenient for him, and I think tends to do too much for the kids. I am the furthest thing from a martyr, so I frequently balk at doing what I feel is more than fair and I have no trouble telling the kids (or DH) when I feel like I have too much on my plate.

Where we are not as good is with general cleaning--dishes, bathroom. I'm working on that.

Part of the job as a parent is to foster independence and responsibility, slowly at first, then more and more as they get older.

A 3/4 yr old is capable of taking off their shoes and putting it on a shoe rack and hanging up their coat (if the rack is low enough).

My 7 yr old DD starts her own shower. I go up after she's started to help her wash her hair and scrub her back. Rest, she does on her own. Like other PPs, I do their laundry because I don't want to waste water, and prefer to wash on a full load. But, I do sometimes have them help me fold and put their own laundry away.

I pack their main lunch because, like another PP, I prefer that they have a warm, healthy lunch and not PBJ everyday. But, they pack their own snacks, and put their lunchbags in their backpack when I'm done packing it.

As for the car door, the only time I would open it for them is if the space is tight, and I'm afraid they might ding the car (I've dinged car doors myself due to tight spaces).

My kids are both expected to clean up after themselves - at the dining table, their rooms, and make their beds. I've been having them do this since they were 5. It's not done perfectly, but it gets them in the habit.

Anonymous wrote:My mom cooked my breakfast, made my lunch for school, and did my laundry until I went off to college. It was nice. I have two older elementary-aged boys, and I expect that I will be doing the same for them through high school. Part of the reason for this is that I don't want them to have cereal and milk for breakfast and a PB&J for lunch every day. If I make breakfast/lunch for them, then I get to develop their palette a little more!

I had the same experience and I agree. I had no problem figuring out how to do laundry and make simple foods for myself when I got to college, and I figure my kids can figure it out then, too.