Anonymous
Post 12/07/2015 17:10     Subject: Embarrassing Fight w/ my mother
OP you are totally being reasonable.
Politeness does not require that you accept racist gifts.
Anonymous
Post 12/07/2015 16:20     Subject: Embarrassing Fight w/ my mother
Anonymous wrote:Sorry you are going through this. Sounds like my MIL who is Dutch and also insists that Black Peter is not racist. You cannot win the argument that Black Peter is racist. Seriously...she's way older and isn't going to change her mind. Invite her to celebrate the holiday only if you eliminate the Black Peter part.

Your husband backed you up, right? If he needs encouragement, you can remind him that Black Peter is relatively new and directly tied to the history of slave trade by the Dutch. The story was first published in 1845 entitled “Saint Nicholas and his Servant” written by Schenkman.



Husband backed me up. We are of one mind on this.
Anonymous
Post 12/07/2015 16:11     Subject: Embarrassing Fight w/ my mother
I'm 16:08 again - I do not agree with the "Thank You" and explain to your kids later why it is bad. You would never allow someone to give your child a KKK doll or necklace with a swastika, why would you allow a Black Peter doll in your home. Sheesh.
Anonymous
Post 12/07/2015 16:08     Subject: Embarrassing Fight w/ my mother
Sorry you are going through this. Sounds like my MIL who is Dutch and also insists that Black Peter is not racist. You cannot win the argument that Black Peter is racist. Seriously...she's way older and isn't going to change her mind. Invite her to celebrate the holiday only if you eliminate the Black Peter part.

Your husband backed you up, right? If he needs encouragement, you can remind him that Black Peter is relatively new and directly tied to the history of slave trade by the Dutch. The story was first published in 1845 entitled “Saint Nicholas and his Servant” written by Schenkman.

Anonymous
Post 12/07/2015 15:55     Subject: Embarrassing Fight w/ my mother
OP, you were in the right. Zwarte Piet is the Dutch equivalent of a lawn jockey. The Dutch attempts to make him appropriate (no really, it's soot on his face) are even more offensive.

I suspect this brings up some other stuff for your mom, including her feelings around your embracing American culture.
Anonymous
Post 12/07/2015 15:46     Subject: Embarrassing Fight w/ my mother
Anonymous wrote:
Ah, yes, I remember that tradition. I would have compromised instead of rejecting the gift outright. Accepted the Sinterklaas and told my mother that there would be no Black Peter in my house, and why.

It's tough. I have racist European relatives.




If you read, OP said that she tried that, and her mom just said she would take them all back.

OP, I think you were very reasonable.
Anonymous
Post 12/07/2015 15:26     Subject: Embarrassing Fight w/ my mother
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:You were in the wrong. You don't tell someone "Take it back; I don't want that for my daughter!" You say "Oh, thank you for thinking of her, that was so sweet of you!"

Then you explain to your daughter later, privately, why it offends you and is offensive.


+1


She mentioned she already did in prior years and her mother didn't get it.

That being said, "thank you for thinking of her" doesn't really fly for a racist gift. Do you think?
Anonymous
Post 12/07/2015 15:17     Subject: Embarrassing Fight w/ my mother
Anonymous wrote:You were in the wrong. You don't tell someone "Take it back; I don't want that for my daughter!" You say "Oh, thank you for thinking of her, that was so sweet of you!"

Then you explain to your daughter later, privately, why it offends you and is offensive.


+1
Anonymous
Post 12/07/2015 13:30     Subject: Embarrassing Fight w/ my mother
Anonymous wrote:
Ah, yes, I remember that tradition. I would have compromised instead of rejecting the gift outright. Accepted the Sinterklaas and told my mother that there would be no Black Peter in my house, and why.

It's tough. I have racist European relatives.




The hardest part is...she does not see this as racist. I think that is why she is so upset with me.
Anonymous
Post 12/07/2015 13:29     Subject: Re:Embarrassing Fight w/ my mother
Nope. I get it OP. Sinterklass is an awful anachronism like 'black Sambo'. The Dutch wail and gnash their teeth about it, but they really need to have a national conversation about it--the xenophobic, hollow refrain of:"but, but, it's not racist because I say so". Let the group being portrayed as inferior or ridiculed decide if it's racist--we have no clue about this. Hats off to you OP for having this sensitivity.
Anonymous
Post 12/07/2015 13:28     Subject: Embarrassing Fight w/ my mother

Ah, yes, I remember that tradition. I would have compromised instead of rejecting the gift outright. Accepted the Sinterklaas and told my mother that there would be no Black Peter in my house, and why.

It's tough. I have racist European relatives.


Anonymous
Post 12/07/2015 13:26     Subject: Embarrassing Fight w/ my mother
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I don't really know the history of this and did just a very brief Google search, but can she just have the Santa doll without Black Peter?


It's not Santa (we do Santa later in the year on the 25th - St. Nicholaas is a different guy).

I tried that. I told her, I loved Sinterklaas (St. Nicholaas) and would open the box and give her just the one doll, with out the other (it came with 3 "Petes") - she said no, she would just return it. And I was being ridiculous.



Oh. Well yeah, in that case, sorry not sorry Mom. I wouldn't give the Petes to my kid either, if that was our heritage.
Anonymous
Post 12/07/2015 13:23     Subject: Embarrassing Fight w/ my mother
Anonymous wrote:YOu are coming across as a huge bitch. Your poor mom


She's a bitch because she doesn't want her daughter to participate in a holiday that has decidedly racist overtones? Where is your logic?
Anonymous
Post 12/07/2015 13:22     Subject: Embarrassing Fight w/ my mother
Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why a compromise couldn't be reached? Sounds like you rudely said no and said your daughter was born here so why does she care about it anyways?


I probably did rudely say "no" - I have made my feeling known on the subject before. It's embarrassing for me as a Dutch person that it's part of our history. I don't want my child playing with slaves as a toy.

Anonymous
Post 12/07/2015 13:22     Subject: Embarrassing Fight w/ my mother
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I don't really know the history of this and did just a very brief Google search, but can she just have the Santa doll without Black Peter?


It's not Santa (we do Santa later in the year on the 25th - St. Nicholaas is a different guy).

I tried that. I told her, I loved Sinterklaas (St. Nicholaas) and would open the box and give her just the one doll, with out the other (it came with 3 "Petes") - she said no, she would just return it. And I was being ridiculous.



She made it "all or nothing." Leave her to the consequences. Done.