Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I agree. We demand our kids work just like we did at a young age. It teaches them a work ethic that will carry them a long way. The kids who have a life spoon fed to them do not do well in the real world.

Interesting discussion. I am Asian and we don't expect teenagers to have part time jobs. Asian parents want their kids to focus on their grades and academics which we consider their "job".

I'm Asian, and I have told my kids that they will have to work a PT job if they want extra spending money. Having a PT job in HS/college years teaches a teen some responsibility and how to deal with people in the work place. There is value in that later on in life. I think some parents do a disservice to their kids by not cultivating their social skills and such. These soft skills are quite important in most of the workplace.

It also teaches great time management skills.

And, as someone who hires college interns, I don't hire someone who has NO work experience. If all you have is academic experience on your resume then you don't make the cut. The work experience doesn't have to be related to the internship (usually the academic projects fill that requirement) but even working at a restaurant, retail store or as a camp counselor shows me that you have some experience showing up for a job, interacting with people, providing service to clients.

Good point.

You're overthinking this, OP.

It's human nature for a parent to want their child to have a better life than s/he did. If you start on third base, you have to push for home.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents can push all they want for Ivy. Its a scam. Both DH and I are entrepreneurs and that is a mindset that wins every time. It can even win without a degree.

My son is the ONLY child mowing lawns. He is 15 and next spring his first car will be a pickup to trailer his equipment. He has 1 kid he pays on his busiest days to help. Next spring he will drive his own truck. He has had to knock on doors, convince people to spend their money with a neighborhood kid, and deliver a consistent product. He has 14 regular customers for mowing at 40/wk each and then has been busy with leaves and mulching this fall. We're teaching him that the way to freedom and success in this country is to rely on yourself and not be an office drone.

I agree. We demand our kids work just like we did at a young age. It teaches them a work ethic that will carry them a long way. The kids who have a life spoon fed to them do not do well in the real world.

Interesting discussion. I am Asian and we don't expect teenagers to have part time jobs. Asian parents want their kids to focus on their grades and academics which we consider their "job".

I don't think this has anything to do with being Asian, but allowing kids to focus on academics, or whatever their interest is, instead of having a job as a teen could lead them to believe that they are too good for manual labor and fall into a prince or princess way of thinking. Not always, of course, but I do think that that is a danger of not requiring teens to engage in some kind of work. Manual labor allows kids to see that their efforts can be productive in a concrete way. It also can teach them to work harder in school because they find that they want to do something else as adults.

As a side benefit, colleges love to see kids who have spent time working at a real job because they know that those kids tend to be more mature and to be hard workers. They also see fewer kids with jobs today, so it makes a kid stand out from the other applicants.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I agree. We demand our kids work just like we did at a young age. It teaches them a work ethic that will carry them a long way. The kids who have a life spoon fed to them do not do well in the real world.

Interesting discussion. I am Asian and we don't expect teenagers to have part time jobs. Asian parents want their kids to focus on their grades and academics which we consider their "job".

I'm Asian, and I have told my kids that they will have to work a PT job if they want extra spending money. Having a PT job in HS/college years teaches a teen some responsibility and how to deal with people in the work place. There is value in that later on in life. I think some parents do a disservice to their kids by not cultivating their social skills and such. These soft skills are quite important in most of the workplace.

It also teaches great time management skills.

And, as someone who hires college interns, I don't hire someone who has NO work experience. If all you have is academic experience on your resume then you don't make the cut. The work experience doesn't have to be related to the internship (usually the academic projects fill that requirement) but even working at a restaurant, retail store or as a camp counselor shows me that you have some experience showing up for a job, interacting with people, providing service to clients.

Anonymous wrote:I think there are many ways to succeed. The HYP route is one, but not the most fun one. There is the entrepreneur route that has been mentioned, but I have friends who are scriptwriters, tv producers, high up in retail etc.

I am not going to push my kids too hard on the academics, because in my experience people who thrived at this are no happier, and not even necessarily richer, than those that chose other paths.

+1 Also, I think a lot of the anxiety is due to how limited our social circles have become (see the 40% college thread). If the only successful people you know are ones who went to highly selective colleges like you then you assume that's the ONLY WAY to be successful in life. If you recognized that there are a lot of people in the world who have happy, productive lives without following that narrow path then you can relax a bit and help your kid figure out what is right for them.

DH and I both have master's degrees (state universities) but among our family and friends are plenty of people doing well without being college grads -- my brother has worked as a computer programmer since HS (self-taught, did a year of CC and the dropped out - he was making so much money in his PT job that he preferred to just work), a cousin is CEO of a commercial electrical contracting company (he did an electrician apprenticeship instead of college), my niece started at a large company in an entry level phone bank position and has worked her way up to a very good salary. I also know plenty of people with their own businesses and some who went into the military and eventually completed degrees but not on the just-after-HS timetable.

The common thread in those who are successful is that they have a strong work ethic and are able to take the initiative to learn what they need to know. So, my main concern is not pushing my kids to have straight-As but to encourage hard work and initiative. I do expect my kids to have some additional education/training after HS. Yes, I'd prefer that they go to college but if they'd rather go into a trade apprenticeship, join the military, or have some other clearly articulated plan as to how they are going to create a productive life, then that is fine. It's their life, not mine.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I agree. We demand our kids work just like we did at a young age. It teaches them a work ethic that will carry them a long way. The kids who have a life spoon fed to them do not do well in the real world.

Interesting discussion. I am Asian and we don't expect teenagers to have part time jobs. Asian parents want their kids to focus on their grades and academics which we consider their "job".

I'm Asian, and I have told my kids that they will have to work a PT job if they want extra spending money. Having a PT job in HS/college years teaches a teen some responsibility and how to deal with people in the work place. There is value in that later on in life. I think some parents do a disservice to their kids by not cultivating their social skills and such. These soft skills are quite important in most of the workplace.

It also teaches great time management skills.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I agree. We demand our kids work just like we did at a young age. It teaches them a work ethic that will carry them a long way. The kids who have a life spoon fed to them do not do well in the real world.

Interesting discussion. I am Asian and we don't expect teenagers to have part time jobs. Asian parents want their kids to focus on their grades and academics which we consider their "job".

I'm Asian, and I have told my kids that they will have to work a PT job if they want extra spending money. Having a PT job in HS/college years teaches a teen some responsibility and how to deal with people in the work place. There is value in that later on in life. I think some parents do a disservice to their kids by not cultivating their social skills and such. These soft skills are quite important in most of the workplace.

Anonymous wrote:Parents can push all they want for Ivy. Its a scam. Both DH and I are entrepreneurs and that is a mindset that wins every time. It can even win without a degree.

My son is the ONLY child mowing lawns. He is 15 and next spring his first car will be a pickup to trailer his equipment. He has 1 kid he pays on his busiest days to help. Next spring he will drive his own truck. He has had to knock on doors, convince people to spend their money with a neighborhood kid, and deliver a consistent product. He has 14 regular customers for mowing at 40/wk each and then has been busy with leaves and mulching this fall. We're teaching him that the way to freedom and success in this country is to rely on yourself and not be an office drone.

I'm sure you realize that outside of the UMC, many teens are mowing lawns, raking leaves, and shoveling snow. We're lower MC and not white. For nearly all of the boys in my extended family, starting your own yard work business is a rite of passage at age 12. The difference between our families seems to be that our boys save their profits for college where they go into STEM majors.

Anonymous wrote:Just a point to temper all the self-congratulatory back patting by the parents of the superior entrepreneur kids -- all the adult $$ entrepreneurs I know in DC and McLean are every bit as competitive and douchey as the double ivy lawyers and consultants.

They are every bit as insuffable too. The main differences I see are that -- as a couple of PPs hint -- they went to worse colleges/ have fewer degrees, and to a person, they ALL drive flashy cars and live in gargantuan but tacky tear down- type homes.

All the people you know with landscaping companies are insufferable, tacky and drive flashy cars.

Um... Okay. Not!

Upper middle class anxiety is palpable. We will soon truly be a one party nation with left liberal policies across the board. It has been working very well for California, though. So it could be good.

It isn't obvious were scared of a future that doesn't look like our present?

I think there are many ways to succeed. The HYP route is one, but not the most fun one. There is the entrepreneur route that has been mentioned, but I have friends who are scriptwriters, tv producers, high up in retail etc.

I am not going to push my kids too hard on the academics, because in my experience people who thrived at this are no happier, and not even necessarily richer, than those that chose other paths.

Just a point to temper all the self-congratulatory back patting by the parents of the superior entrepreneur kids -- all the adult $$ entrepreneurs I know in DC and McLean are every bit as competitive and douchey as the double ivy lawyers and consultants.

They are every bit as insuffable too. The main differences I see are that -- as a couple of PPs hint -- they went to worse colleges/ have fewer degrees, and to a person, they ALL drive flashy cars and live in gargantuan but tacky tear down- type homes.

Anonymous wrote:Parents can push all they want for Ivy. Its a scam. Both DH and I are entrepreneurs and that is a mindset that wins every time. It can even win without a degree.

My son is the ONLY child mowing lawns. He is 15 and next spring his first car will be a pickup to trailer his equipment. He has 1 kid he pays on his busiest days to help. Next spring he will drive his own truck. He has had to knock on doors, convince people to spend their money with a neighborhood kid, and deliver a consistent product. He has 14 regular customers for mowing at 40/wk each and then has been busy with leaves and mulching this fall. We're teaching him that the way to freedom and success in this country is to rely on yourself and not be an office drone.

THIS. Our newly minted 14 yo has made a bundle this fall raking leaves and will hopefully start mowing in the spring. When younger he sold drinks along a bike trail. We are trying to keep the entrepreneurial spirit alive in both our kids. Other DK has a pretty lucrative business as well.

Compare this thread with the 40% with a college degree thread.

DH and I went to state schools, as did our siblings. We have friends who went to state schools, Ivies, etc. I worry about our kids growing up in this area, and we're thinking about moving somewhere less crazy.