Why are you getting bent out of shape about Ireland? You do realize that not many countries share U.S. societies' views right?

Just bake the danm cake.

Anonymous wrote:I think businesses should be allowed to run their business as they see fit.

I think public opinion will then decide if they want to spend their money on said business or not.

Pretty simple.

So, can a business refuse to serve someone because they are black or have a disability?

For those of you who feel that the hypothetical baker should bake any cake even if they religiously oppose it.

If you were the hypothetical baker with your belief structure, would you agree that you should be forced by the government to bake the march for life Roe vs Wade cake with pro life slogans allnover it? Or a Family Research Council cake with quotes from deuteronomy? Or a cake for the Quiverfull folks at whatever 19 kids event they might throw?

I think those are more realistic examples than the Klan or Nazis.

All legal. All religiously/morality based, and all controversial and against beliefs of a large portion of the population, in the same way gay marriage or a pride parade is.

If I were a baker and hired to make a Nazi cake, then that's a cake that may be iced with a Lil special something mixed in.

I'd have a load of fun baking that cake....

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think businesses should be allowed to run their business as they see fit.

I think public opinion will then decide if they want to spend their money on said business or not.

Pretty simple.

OP yet again -- and do you still agree with that plan if the situation will not be affected by public opinion? Say I'm black and living in a small, isolated town. None of the businesses will do business with me because of my race. No one else in town cares enough to boycott said businesses, and I have no alternatives in the area.

This is why we have civil rights laws.

I'm with you -- that's why I posted the above hypothetical. My larger point is, do civil rights laws also protect the neo-Nazi who wants a Jewish baker to decorate a swastika cake for a Hitler birthday party? When do business owners have the right to say no? And assuming they do have some (presumably limited) right to say no, how you keep that from being a slippery slope down to refusing service based on race/sex/orientation/etc? I'm confused about where the line is drawn, both in people's own minds/ethics, and in the (current US) law.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm pro-gay and a baker and religious... but I draw the line at fetish cakes. No shapes. Won't do it. Otherwise all is well.

So, basically, no shapes at all (except round and square, of course)? I think that's fine.

and of course, the Bundt. What sort of shape is that really?

Anonymous wrote:I'm pro-gay and a baker and religious... but I draw the line at fetish cakes. No shapes. Won't do it. Otherwise all is well.

So, basically, no shapes at all (except round and square, of course)? I think that's fine.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think businesses should be allowed to run their business as they see fit.

I think public opinion will then decide if they want to spend their money on said business or not.

Pretty simple.

+1

I think certain decisions should be be left to public consensus.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think businesses should be allowed to run their business as they see fit.

I think public opinion will then decide if they want to spend their money on said business or not.

Pretty simple.

OP yet again -- and do you still agree with that plan if the situation will not be affected by public opinion? Say I'm black and living in a small, isolated town. None of the businesses will do business with me because of my race. No one else in town cares enough to boycott said businesses, and I have no alternatives in the area.

This is why we have civil rights laws.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I draw the line at hate messages or offensive speech (if the gay cake wanted to say "two dicks" or something like that). Two grooms on the top of a wedding cake? Yeah they need to bake that. A gay pride rainbow? They need to bake that.

Preferencing this that I support LGBT completely. I think it is silly that we have to "support" them because they are just citizens living their lives.

The business doesn't need to do any of that. Also there are other businesses that would be happy to. Spend your money there.

But how are gays supposed to find the bakers that will bake a cake with two grooms on it? I'm straight and had a hard time finding a cake baker with availability on my date, reasonable price and good taste (I think I went to 10+ places).

Why would a gay person want some asshole that hated them baking their wedding cake?

Anonymous wrote:I'm pro-gay and a baker and religious... but I draw the line at fetish cakes. No shapes. Won't do it. Otherwise all is well.

This is a very reasonable accommodation!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think businesses should be allowed to run their business as they see fit.

I think public opinion will then decide if they want to spend their money on said business or not.

Pretty simple.

OP here again. So, say there's a business that refuses to do business with people of a different race. Say I'm the same race as the business owners so I have no idea about this, though I'd boycott if I did. Is it the responsibility of the people who get discriminated against to make a public stink so that everyone knows and can make an informed decision? How do you even go about making such a stink? You can't put a sign on the door: "this place doesn't serve ____ race." I like your point in theory but how does it work in practice?

Yes. You alert the media, the BBB and your local chamber of commerce.

Yes, because that worked so well in 1955.

It is 2015

Right, and in 2015 bakers are not allowed to discriminate against people based on race. In 1955, they could serve whomever they damned pleased. I don't want to live in a world where bakers can refuse to bake cakes for people based on religion, race, sexual orientation, or national origin just because they want to run their business "as they see fit." That's called discrimination.

I'm pro-gay and a baker and religious... but I draw the line at fetish cakes. No shapes. Won't do it. Otherwise all is well.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think businesses should be allowed to run their business as they see fit.

I think public opinion will then decide if they want to spend their money on said business or not.

Pretty simple.

OP yet again -- and do you still agree with that plan if the situation will not be affected by public opinion? Say I'm black and living in a small, isolated town. None of the businesses will do business with me because of my race. No one else in town cares enough to boycott said businesses, and I have no alternatives in the area.

I think a better analogy would be a plack panther event. Cannot refuse business to the black mom buying bday cupcakes, can refuse to bake the black panther cake. Refusing to service the event but not the person. Or can't refuse to sell the skinhead a cheesecake, can refuse to ice KKK on top of it. Refuse to support the cause but not refuse to serve the person.