Anonymous
04/08/2015 14:33
Subject: AP vs IB
IB is a deal-breaker for me when we look for houses. Not going to do it. I was completely fine with it until I looked into it further. There are a lot of kids who are full-force into IB ... and then they decide later that it's not worth it. These are really motivated kids who for whatever reason decide not to finish it. Yes, they can get college credits for each course, but they have to take all their exams at the end of senior year and several courses are two year courses -- who would want to commit to two years of a single course? Even in college kids don't commit to two years. Seems illogical that anyone would expect a 16 yr. old to commit to a course that long.
In theory, the IB program looks fantastic -- with the capstone and the community service and global thinking... but in practice, it just seems like it doesn't work for the vast majority of kids who are excellent students and very motivated when they start the program.
I also know of a family where they had to make an unexpected military move after the first year of a two year course and the kid wouldn't be going to an IB school once they moved... guess what... no credit for the class he just spent a YEAR on.
In practice, I think most teens are better suited to taking a la carte AP classes. As a parent, I like what IB promises... but seems like it doesn't deliver (or the kids can't/don't deliver the final IB degree very often).
There are a number of homes I would like in several IB school zones... but it's not gonna happen b/c of the IB program.
In theory, the IB program looks fantastic -- with the capstone and the community service and global thinking... but in practice, it just seems like it doesn't work for the vast majority of kids who are excellent students and very motivated when they start the program.
I also know of a family where they had to make an unexpected military move after the first year of a two year course and the kid wouldn't be going to an IB school once they moved... guess what... no credit for the class he just spent a YEAR on.
In practice, I think most teens are better suited to taking a la carte AP classes. As a parent, I like what IB promises... but seems like it doesn't deliver (or the kids can't/don't deliver the final IB degree very often).
There are a number of homes I would like in several IB school zones... but it's not gonna happen b/c of the IB program.
Anonymous
04/08/2015 14:32
Subject: AP vs IB
IB is an expensive scam for schools with poor students. Between the cost (it's expensive) and the return (unlikely to get an IB diploma versus getting AP credit, it's just not worth it.
If IB was so great, you would see it in McLean or Langley. Not in Lee or Mount Vernon or Stuart.
If IB was so great, you would see it in McLean or Langley. Not in Lee or Mount Vernon or Stuart.
Anonymous
04/08/2015 14:29
Subject: Re:AP vs IB
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:12:32 poster again - wanted to add that Robinson's website has a lot of great info. there to help you learn about IB and the differences between AP vs. IB.
Also, you can take IB classes but not pursue the IB diploma. The diploma is the part that requires the service hours, extended essay and Theory of Knowledge class.
I would be reluctant to send a kid to an IB school if he or she was not getting the full diploma. It is just too easy for colleges and universities to distinguish between students applying from IB schools on that basis.
Not sure what you mean - can you elaborate?
The goal of the IB program at the high school level is to obtain an IB diploma. It's not mandatory at IB high schools in FCPS, but it's still the goal of the program under the IBO guidelines.
You don't actually find out whether you're getting an IB diploma until after you've graduated from high schools. However, colleges can quickly tell whether or not an applicant is an IB diploma candidate, and some likely only consider applications from students pursuing the full diploma. AP isn't so binary. For the most part, colleges will just see students from AP schools who've taken a range of different AP classes, but there's no "AP diploma" program at most schools. AP is currently rolling out a program called the "Capstone" program that's modeled in part on IB, includes some new AP courses that emphasize research methods and require a writing project, and can lead to an "AP Capstone Diploma." But, even if the Capstone program were widely adopted, getting a "Capstone Diploma" likely would not be as important for students at AP schools as getting an IB diploma is for students at IB schools.
As it turns out, Oakton is one of the AP schools in FCPS where the Capstone course is being offered next year, as part of a pilot program. OP can take a look at this, and some of the other courses that a student interested in writing might take, at this link: http://www.fcps.edu/OaktonHS/forms/counseling/CourseSelection_Grades10-11-12_2015-16_021015.pdf
Colleges will take IB credit the same as AP courses one by one regardless of the diploma. The diploma is an added bonus.
Having seen lists of the schools that kids from nearby AP and IB schools are planning to attend, my view is the opposite: IB diploma candidates do about as well as the kids at AP schools who are taking multiple AP courses, and the non-IB diploma candidates at IB schools are at a disadvantage.
It all depends on course choice.
Colleges view a student who is taking only science/math AP classes or only English/history AP classes the same way they view an IB student who is only taking IB courses in certain areas.
They will view a student who is taking AP classes in every single subject plus AP electives the same way they will view an IB diploma candidate.
Anonymous
04/08/2015 14:29
Subject: Re:AP vs IB
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:12:32 poster again - wanted to add that Robinson's website has a lot of great info. there to help you learn about IB and the differences between AP vs. IB.
Also, you can take IB classes but not pursue the IB diploma. The diploma is the part that requires the service hours, extended essay and Theory of Knowledge class.
I would be reluctant to send a kid to an IB school if he or she was not getting the full diploma. It is just too easy for colleges and universities to distinguish between students applying from IB schools on that basis.
Knew several kids who got into UVA last year who didn't take the full IB diploma and several who did the full IB and didn't get into UVA. It's one data point, but shows it's hard to make blanket statements. It does depend on the kid.
Anonymous
04/08/2015 14:29
Subject: AP vs IB
Anonymous wrote:Thanks the PP who thoroughly explained IB and AP. Also, thanks for the info about Capstone. Our DC is a 7th grader at Jackson AAP and very interested in writing and reading; anything and everything humanities driven. Smart as heck in STEM but not interested in STEM. I just want to make sure I've done my due diligence to hopefully ensure a best fit. I wish there were a TJ for humanities.
I'm the PP who did the post to which I think you're referring. If your child is in seventh grade, you have good opportunities to find out much more during the next year and make a very informed decision.
I don't know if other IB high schools do the same thing, but Marshall holds IB information nights in the fall (usually early December) and again in the spring (March this year). Take your child to the fall IB night at Marshall or whatever HS would be the IB one closest to you. Good way to learn more, and learn it earlier. In February of your child's eighth grade year, if you and your child are still on the fence, be sure to attend the "curriculum night" at BOTH your assigned AP high school and the possible IB high school (or your assigned IB HS and possible AP HS, whichever way it works for you....). Just turn up at both -- no one asks you if your kid is supposed to be there! I'm talking here about not just the separate IB presentation night but the curriculum night aimed at all rising freshmen for the high schools. That will give you a good read on the two schools overall, as well as more information about AP and IB. We went to both our assigned school's curriculum night and the curriculum night for the IB HS, before making a choice about a transfer, and it was very useful to see both schools and hear about things at the schools outside the IB/AP programs.
Anonymous
04/08/2015 14:23
Subject: Re:AP vs IB
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:12:32 poster again - wanted to add that Robinson's website has a lot of great info. there to help you learn about IB and the differences between AP vs. IB.
Also, you can take IB classes but not pursue the IB diploma. The diploma is the part that requires the service hours, extended essay and Theory of Knowledge class.
I would be reluctant to send a kid to an IB school if he or she was not getting the full diploma. It is just too easy for colleges and universities to distinguish between students applying from IB schools on that basis.
Not sure what you mean - can you elaborate?
The goal of the IB program at the high school level is to obtain an IB diploma. It's not mandatory at IB high schools in FCPS, but it's still the goal of the program under the IBO guidelines.
You don't actually find out whether you're getting an IB diploma until after you've graduated from high schools. However, colleges can quickly tell whether or not an applicant is an IB diploma candidate, and some likely only consider applications from students pursuing the full diploma. AP isn't so binary. For the most part, colleges will just see students from AP schools who've taken a range of different AP classes, but there's no "AP diploma" program at most schools. AP is currently rolling out a program called the "Capstone" program that's modeled in part on IB, includes some new AP courses that emphasize research methods and require a writing project, and can lead to an "AP Capstone Diploma." But, even if the Capstone program were widely adopted, getting a "Capstone Diploma" likely would not be as important for students at AP schools as getting an IB diploma is for students at IB schools.
As it turns out, Oakton is one of the AP schools in FCPS where the Capstone course is being offered next year, as part of a pilot program. OP can take a look at this, and some of the other courses that a student interested in writing might take, at this link: http://www.fcps.edu/OaktonHS/forms/counseling/CourseSelection_Grades10-11-12_2015-16_021015.pdf
Colleges will take IB credit the same as AP courses one by one regardless of the diploma. The diploma is an added bonus.
Having seen lists of the schools that kids from nearby AP and IB schools are planning to attend, my view is the opposite: IB diploma candidates do about as well as the kids at AP schools who are taking multiple AP courses, and the non-IB diploma candidates at IB schools are at a disadvantage.
What? IB and AP are taken college for credit course by course. There is no disadvantage to taken 1 IB course vs taking 1 AP course. IB diploma is an added bonus which AP doesn't have. Either way you are probably someone that is still thinking of AP vs IB in 1990s terms when IB wasn't accepted as willingly as AP for college credit.
http://www.usnews.com/education/blogs/high-school-notes/2014/09/02/discover-the-difference-between-ap-and-ib-classes
"Students in IB schools can choose to pursue an IB diploma, a more structured path than offered with AP. The diploma program, concentrated in the last two years of high school, requires students to take courses in six specific subject areas. Students also must complete additional work outside of class, including an essay and service project.
Those who do not want to participate in the prix fixe diploma program can opt to take IB courses a la carte instead."
http://www.fairfaxtimes.com/article/20150327/NEWS/150329365/ap-and-ib-programs-offer-different-paths-to-college-success&template=fairfaxTimes
Anonymous
04/08/2015 14:09
Subject: AP vs IB
Thanks the PP who thoroughly explained IB and AP. Also, thanks for the info about Capstone. Our DC is a 7th grader at Jackson AAP and very interested in writing and reading; anything and everything humanities driven. Smart as heck in STEM but not interested in STEM. I just want to make sure I've done my due diligence to hopefully ensure a best fit. I wish there were a TJ for humanities.
Anonymous
04/08/2015 13:42
Subject: Re:AP vs IB
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:12:32 poster again - wanted to add that Robinson's website has a lot of great info. there to help you learn about IB and the differences between AP vs. IB.
Also, you can take IB classes but not pursue the IB diploma. The diploma is the part that requires the service hours, extended essay and Theory of Knowledge class.
I would be reluctant to send a kid to an IB school if he or she was not getting the full diploma. It is just too easy for colleges and universities to distinguish between students applying from IB schools on that basis.
Not sure what you mean - can you elaborate?
The goal of the IB program at the high school level is to obtain an IB diploma. It's not mandatory at IB high schools in FCPS, but it's still the goal of the program under the IBO guidelines.
You don't actually find out whether you're getting an IB diploma until after you've graduated from high schools. However, colleges can quickly tell whether or not an applicant is an IB diploma candidate, and some likely only consider applications from students pursuing the full diploma. AP isn't so binary. For the most part, colleges will just see students from AP schools who've taken a range of different AP classes, but there's no "AP diploma" program at most schools. AP is currently rolling out a program called the "Capstone" program that's modeled in part on IB, includes some new AP courses that emphasize research methods and require a writing project, and can lead to an "AP Capstone Diploma." But, even if the Capstone program were widely adopted, getting a "Capstone Diploma" likely would not be as important for students at AP schools as getting an IB diploma is for students at IB schools.
As it turns out, Oakton is one of the AP schools in FCPS where the Capstone course is being offered next year, as part of a pilot program. OP can take a look at this, and some of the other courses that a student interested in writing might take, at this link: http://www.fcps.edu/OaktonHS/forms/counseling/CourseSelection_Grades10-11-12_2015-16_021015.pdf
Colleges will take IB credit the same as AP courses one by one regardless of the diploma. The diploma is an added bonus.
Having seen lists of the schools that kids from nearby AP and IB schools are planning to attend, my view is the opposite: IB diploma candidates do about as well as the kids at AP schools who are taking multiple AP courses, and the non-IB diploma candidates at IB schools are at a disadvantage.
Anonymous
04/08/2015 13:35
Subject: Re:AP vs IB
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:There's lots of info. on there for you all to compare - and I'm not authority, but DD just applied for a transfer to Robinson for IB. We/she did tons of research first. Both programs have a lot to offer, and it comes down to personal choice. DD thought IB was a better fit for her learning style/tendencies. Just wanted to point out one thing I learned along the way. It seems to be the case that more colleges accept AP for college credit than IB - but anyone can take an AP exam - so if that's the most important thing to you/DC, keep in mind that your child can take an IB course and still taken an AP exam.
We also did a transfer. Our daughter was assigned to an AP school based on where we live but she will go instead to Marshal for IB.
OP, is your student an eighth grader right now? If so, you must file for a "curricular transfer" very soon -- the deadline is April 15! If your student is bound for an AP high school but wants to get into an IB school instead, you and your child need to learn more ASAP and file the transfer request quickly. I would call the IB coordinator at the nearest IB school. There are usually IB-specific presentation nights at IB high schools, but those are already done, so contact the coordinator and go online to the FCPS advanced academics web pages.
http://www.fcps.edu/is/aap/continuum/hs.shtml
Scroll down to IB and AP and click on those links.
OP, just this morning I was talking with a friend who is an FCPS teacher and both her kids did IB diplomas. Both got credit for their IB classes at their colleges. This mom/teacher noted that increasingly colleges are giving credit for IB. Colleges in the U.S. often understand AP better because they just see more AP students coming in.
But the whole IB-AP discussion should not revolve only around "How much college credit can I knock off by doing this in high school?" I would be more concerned that my child develop learning skills to cope better with college work than solely to amass credits. Nothing wrong with credits, but they seem to drive the whole discussion around here, unfortunately.
AP is a la carte, which can be better for some students. IB is very different. Kids in IB schools can just take IB classes as they choose (a la carte. like AP) but also can pursue the IB diploma, a more integrated approach, which requires six IB classes (at least three of them at "Higher Level") plus the "Theory of Knowledge" seminar (how we learn, and how we know what we know) and an "Extended Essay" that requires them to do research and write a paper on a topic of their choice. I know a couple of families who felt that things like the Theory of Knowledge seminar and the research paper were excellent preparation for college level work and college level expectations.
I could go on about differences but IB is different enough from AP that you really need to sit down and get it explained. A coordinator would be glad to do that but your time is short, if your child is starting high school next fall.
Perhaps not so relevant for the OP, but there have been some recent threads from parents who had math and science-oriented kids at IB schools and were somewhat frustrated with the comparative lack of flexibility in the math/science offerings at IB schools.
Anonymous
04/08/2015 13:34
Subject: Re:AP vs IB
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:12:32 poster again - wanted to add that Robinson's website has a lot of great info. there to help you learn about IB and the differences between AP vs. IB.
Also, you can take IB classes but not pursue the IB diploma. The diploma is the part that requires the service hours, extended essay and Theory of Knowledge class.
I would be reluctant to send a kid to an IB school if he or she was not getting the full diploma. It is just too easy for colleges and universities to distinguish between students applying from IB schools on that basis.
Not sure what you mean - can you elaborate?
The goal of the IB program at the high school level is to obtain an IB diploma. It's not mandatory at IB high schools in FCPS, but it's still the goal of the program under the IBO guidelines.
You don't actually find out whether you're getting an IB diploma until after you've graduated from high schools. However, colleges can quickly tell whether or not an applicant is an IB diploma candidate, and some likely only consider applications from students pursuing the full diploma. AP isn't so binary. For the most part, colleges will just see students from AP schools who've taken a range of different AP classes, but there's no "AP diploma" program at most schools. AP is currently rolling out a program called the "Capstone" program that's modeled in part on IB, includes some new AP courses that emphasize research methods and require a writing project, and can lead to an "AP Capstone Diploma." But, even if the Capstone program were widely adopted, getting a "Capstone Diploma" likely would not be as important for students at AP schools as getting an IB diploma is for students at IB schools.
As it turns out, Oakton is one of the AP schools in FCPS where the Capstone course is being offered next year, as part of a pilot program. OP can take a look at this, and some of the other courses that a student interested in writing might take, at this link: http://www.fcps.edu/OaktonHS/forms/counseling/CourseSelection_Grades10-11-12_2015-16_021015.pdf
Colleges will take IB credit the same as AP courses one by one regardless of the diploma. The diploma is an added bonus.
Anonymous
04/08/2015 13:33
Subject: Re:AP vs IB
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:12:32 poster again - wanted to add that Robinson's website has a lot of great info. there to help you learn about IB and the differences between AP vs. IB.
Also, you can take IB classes but not pursue the IB diploma. The diploma is the part that requires the service hours, extended essay and Theory of Knowledge class.
I would be reluctant to send a kid to an IB school if he or she was not getting the full diploma. It is just too easy for colleges and universities to distinguish between students applying from IB schools on that basis.
Not sure what you mean - can you elaborate?
The goal of the IB program at the high school level is to obtain an IB diploma. It's not mandatory at IB high schools in FCPS, but it's still the goal of the program under the IBO guidelines.
You don't actually find out whether you're getting an IB diploma until after you've graduated from high schools. However, colleges can quickly tell whether or not an applicant is an IB diploma candidate, and some likely only consider applications from students pursuing the full diploma. AP isn't so binary. For the most part, colleges will just see students from AP schools who've taken a range of different AP classes, but there's no "AP diploma" program at most schools. AP is currently rolling out a program called the "Capstone" program that's modeled in part on IB, includes some new AP courses that emphasize research methods and require a writing project, and can lead to an "AP Capstone Diploma." But, even if the Capstone program were widely adopted, getting a "Capstone Diploma" likely would not be as important for students at AP schools as getting an IB diploma is for students at IB schools.
As it turns out, Oakton is one of the AP schools in FCPS where the Capstone course is being offered next year, as part of a pilot program. OP can take a look at this, and some of the other courses that a student interested in writing might take, at this link: http://www.fcps.edu/OaktonHS/forms/counseling/CourseSelection_Grades10-11-12_2015-16_021015.pdf
Anonymous
04/08/2015 13:21
Subject: Re:AP vs IB
Anonymous wrote:There's lots of info. on there for you all to compare - and I'm not authority, but DD just applied for a transfer to Robinson for IB. We/she did tons of research first. Both programs have a lot to offer, and it comes down to personal choice. DD thought IB was a better fit for her learning style/tendencies. Just wanted to point out one thing I learned along the way. It seems to be the case that more colleges accept AP for college credit than IB - but anyone can take an AP exam - so if that's the most important thing to you/DC, keep in mind that your child can take an IB course and still taken an AP exam.
We also did a transfer. Our daughter was assigned to an AP school based on where we live but she will go instead to Marshal for IB.
OP, is your student an eighth grader right now? If so, you must file for a "curricular transfer" very soon -- the deadline is April 15! If your student is bound for an AP high school but wants to get into an IB school instead, you and your child need to learn more ASAP and file the transfer request quickly. I would call the IB coordinator at the nearest IB school. There are usually IB-specific presentation nights at IB high schools, but those are already done, so contact the coordinator and go online to the FCPS advanced academics web pages.
http://www.fcps.edu/is/aap/continuum/hs.shtml
Scroll down to IB and AP and click on those links.
OP, just this morning I was talking with a friend who is an FCPS teacher and both her kids did IB diplomas. Both got credit for their IB classes at their colleges. This mom/teacher noted that increasingly colleges are giving credit for IB. Colleges in the U.S. often understand AP better because they just see more AP students coming in.
But the whole IB-AP discussion should not revolve only around "How much college credit can I knock off by doing this in high school?" I would be more concerned that my child develop learning skills to cope better with college work than solely to amass credits. Nothing wrong with credits, but they seem to drive the whole discussion around here, unfortunately.
AP is a la carte, which can be better for some students. IB is very different. Kids in IB schools can just take IB classes as they choose (a la carte. like AP) but also can pursue the IB diploma, a more integrated approach, which requires six IB classes (at least three of them at "Higher Level") plus the "Theory of Knowledge" seminar (how we learn, and how we know what we know) and an "Extended Essay" that requires them to do research and write a paper on a topic of their choice. I know a couple of families who felt that things like the Theory of Knowledge seminar and the research paper were excellent preparation for college level work and college level expectations.
I could go on about differences but IB is different enough from AP that you really need to sit down and get it explained. A coordinator would be glad to do that but your time is short, if your child is starting high school next fall.
Anonymous
04/08/2015 13:05
Subject: AP vs IB
Remember that you don't get busing if you do pupil placement.
We are currently looking at Robinson for IB (for next year, since isn't the deadline April 15th for this year)
I'm currently doing pupil placement for middle school due to a foreign language issue. We are leaning toward IB due to our foreign language background and the need to have an easier time when we start looking at international colleges. But I am dreading the drive to Robinson already (plus with the later start times next year!)
I hate having to drive to the middle school. Also, none of the friends are nearby. I have told both my DCs that I am driving them to the DMV and getting them a car as soon as possible. (This is of course cheaper than moving for us! I've done the math)
As a product of FCPS, I don't think it matters if you are IB or AP if you want to go in-state. You get screwed being a northern virginian. Go out of state and transfer back. College was a breeze for me 20+ years ago coming out of FCPS (and I was just a B+ student) and I think it's only gotten worse/better - better education, worse, more stress for the kids.
I would vote for the social well being of the student. Stay with your friends no matter what you do, you'll have a good education. Your goal should be a well rounded student.
We are currently looking at Robinson for IB (for next year, since isn't the deadline April 15th for this year)
I'm currently doing pupil placement for middle school due to a foreign language issue. We are leaning toward IB due to our foreign language background and the need to have an easier time when we start looking at international colleges. But I am dreading the drive to Robinson already (plus with the later start times next year!)
I hate having to drive to the middle school. Also, none of the friends are nearby. I have told both my DCs that I am driving them to the DMV and getting them a car as soon as possible. (This is of course cheaper than moving for us! I've done the math)
As a product of FCPS, I don't think it matters if you are IB or AP if you want to go in-state. You get screwed being a northern virginian. Go out of state and transfer back. College was a breeze for me 20+ years ago coming out of FCPS (and I was just a B+ student) and I think it's only gotten worse/better - better education, worse, more stress for the kids.
I would vote for the social well being of the student. Stay with your friends no matter what you do, you'll have a good education. Your goal should be a well rounded student.
Anonymous
04/08/2015 13:01
Subject: AP vs IB
What school did you xfer from to go to Robinson?
Anonymous
04/08/2015 12:55
Subject: Re:AP vs IB
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:12:32 poster again - wanted to add that Robinson's website has a lot of great info. there to help you learn about IB and the differences between AP vs. IB.
Also, you can take IB classes but not pursue the IB diploma. The diploma is the part that requires the service hours, extended essay and Theory of Knowledge class.
I would be reluctant to send a kid to an IB school if he or she was not getting the full diploma. It is just too easy for colleges and universities to distinguish between students applying from IB schools on that basis.
You get the same credit per ib as ap course