OP here. Thanks for the input everyone. She has been trying and has spent 3-4 nights a week here. She does do some things with them, and i know that she tries. It just doesnt seem like she has come far enough in 2 years with the kids. Hard to blame her though.
If not by now, I don't think it will ever.

She doesn't have to want kids. She does have to want HIS kids. At least enough to not make his family about her.

Move on. I have been the child in this situation and I knew my dad's gf tolerated me, but would've been happier without me in the picture. Not a good feeling.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, if you moved her in, things will probably get a lot worse and fast. When people tell you something, believe them. I think at this point you are probably too scared to throw away a two year relationship. It's an investment, I get it. But this is not the right relationship for you or the kids. They need someone who will care about them and this woman clearly does not. You are better off alone until you find someone who values your children.

This a million times over. Find a good woman--not a girl.

I hope you find a partner who will love you and your kids.

FYI- not every good woman wants kids.

No one is saying that but she also should not need nightly, emotionally draining debriefing from the experience of normal daily life with her boyfriend's children. She may not want kids, but she can't act like one either. He has finite energy. At their age it should be spent on the kids. Not dramatic nutjobs.

What are you seeing that makes her a nutjob?

From the Op: "She is not bad with the kids, but not good either. little affection, just kinda does her own thing. past few months she has started to have meltdowns after the kids go to sleep. not always related to them (often stuck in her own mind), but sometimes she gets annoyed that the kids will always come first (and she acknowledges that they should, and gets angry at herself that she is not fully OK with them coming first). "

Her ambivalence combined with explosive moments sound like a nutjob. She can be ambivalent. Thats ok. But She needs to be supportively so, not taking his time away from a happy home life.

You didn't break her. You can't fix her.

I don't see anything about "explosive moments." "Meltdowns after the kids go to sleep" seems to me like she is upset/ conflicted about what she wants vs what she thinks she should do, and she holds it in until they are in bed. Doesn't seem nutjobby to me.

I agree, this relationship will not work out. But I don't think it's the girlfriend's fault for not wanting kids, and I don't think it's OP's fault for putting his kids first. It just seems not meant to be.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, if you moved her in, things will probably get a lot worse and fast. When people tell you something, believe them. I think at this point you are probably too scared to throw away a two year relationship. It's an investment, I get it. But this is not the right relationship for you or the kids. They need someone who will care about them and this woman clearly does not. You are better off alone until you find someone who values your children.

This a million times over. Find a good woman--not a girl.

I hope you find a partner who will love you and your kids.

FYI- not every good woman wants kids.

No one is saying that but she also should not need nightly, emotionally draining debriefing from the experience of normal daily life with her boyfriend's children. She may not want kids, but she can't act like one either. He has finite energy. At their age it should be spent on the kids. Not dramatic nutjobs.

What are you seeing that makes her a nutjob?

From the Op: "She is not bad with the kids, but not good either. little affection, just kinda does her own thing. past few months she has started to have meltdowns after the kids go to sleep. not always related to them (often stuck in her own mind), but sometimes she gets annoyed that the kids will always come first (and she acknowledges that they should, and gets angry at herself that she is not fully OK with them coming first). "

Her ambivalence combined with explosive moments sound like a nutjob. She can be ambivalent. Thats ok. But She needs to be supportively so, not taking his time away from a happy home life.

You didn't break her. You can't fix her.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, if you moved her in, things will probably get a lot worse and fast. When people tell you something, believe them. I think at this point you are probably too scared to throw away a two year relationship. It's an investment, I get it. But this is not the right relationship for you or the kids. They need someone who will care about them and this woman clearly does not. You are better off alone until you find someone who values your children.

This a million times over. Find a good woman--not a girl.

I hope you find a partner who will love you and your kids.

FYI- not every good woman wants kids.

No one is saying that but she also should not need nightly, emotionally draining debriefing from the experience of normal daily life with her boyfriend's children. She may not want kids, but she can't act like one either. He has finite energy. At their age it should be spent on the kids. Not dramatic nutjobs.

What are you seeing that makes her a nutjob?

Agree, I don't see a nutjob either, just two people whose lifestyles aren't compatible.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, if you moved her in, things will probably get a lot worse and fast. When people tell you something, believe them. I think at this point you are probably too scared to throw away a two year relationship. It's an investment, I get it. But this is not the right relationship for you or the kids. They need someone who will care about them and this woman clearly does not. You are better off alone until you find someone who values your children.

This a million times over. Find a good woman--not a girl.

I hope you find a partner who will love you and your kids.

FYI- not every good woman wants kids.

No one is saying that but she also should not need nightly, emotionally draining debriefing from the experience of normal daily life with her boyfriend's children. She may not want kids, but she can't act like one either. He has finite energy. At their age it should be spent on the kids. Not dramatic nutjobs.

What are you seeing that makes her a nutjob?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, if you moved her in, things will probably get a lot worse and fast. When people tell you something, believe them. I think at this point you are probably too scared to throw away a two year relationship. It's an investment, I get it. But this is not the right relationship for you or the kids. They need someone who will care about them and this woman clearly does not. You are better off alone until you find someone who values your children.

This a million times over. Find a good woman--not a girl.

I hope you find a partner who will love you and your kids.

FYI- not every good woman wants kids.

No one is saying that but she also should not need nightly, emotionally draining debriefing from the experience of normal daily life with her boyfriend's children. She may not want kids, but she can't act like one either. He has finite energy. At their age it should be spent on the kids. Not dramatic nutjobs.

OP, how attractive a GF are we talking about here?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, if you moved her in, things will probably get a lot worse and fast. When people tell you something, believe them. I think at this point you are probably too scared to throw away a two year relationship. It's an investment, I get it. But this is not the right relationship for you or the kids. They need someone who will care about them and this woman clearly does not. You are better off alone until you find someone who values your children.

This a million times over. Find a good woman--not a girl.

I hope you find a partner who will love you and your kids.

FYI- not every good woman wants kids.

I'd ditch her. Maybe the age of your kids is bringing up some crap that happened for her at that age but I wouldn't want her near them. They deserve to come home to a full circle of love, not ambivalence. You don't want to have to feel sorry for your own dad and the sadsack he's with and I think that's how this is but they don't want to hurt your feelings. She sounds like too much head stuff.

Your kids need more love and stability in their lives, not less. I can only imagine the things they have seen with a heroin addicted mother (her friends? Courts? Fighting? Damgerous situations?).
You are the only sane, stable adult in their little lives and you need to honor that to them, not bring more strife, uncertainty and confusion to their lives
They are old enough to to know and feel (and I'm sure hear her breakdowns even though you think they are sleeping) how your girlfriend feels. It will only be worse for them when she moves in.
Please don't

OP, if you break up, both of you will be sad or a while but it is best for everyone involved. Maybe you will meet a cute single mom.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, if you moved her in, things will probably get a lot worse and fast. When people tell you something, believe them. I think at this point you are probably too scared to throw away a two year relationship. It's an investment, I get it. But this is not the right relationship for you or the kids. They need someone who will care about them and this woman clearly does not. You are better off alone until you find someone who values your children.

This a million times over. Find a good woman--not a girl.

I hope you find a partner who will love you and your kids.

OP's girlfriend sounds like a perfectly good woman- one good enough to know her preferences and limitations. She doesn't need to be denigrated because she's not up for this major change in the relationship dynamic.

I think she is perfectly fine not ever wanting children. I wish more people would be honest with themselves and just not have kids if they are not ready or just don't want kids. However, to be in a relationship with a man who has two and talk about moving in with him knowing that she doesn't care for his kids is beyond selfish to me. Immature at least. And cry and whine because they come first. What? Give me a break.

You need to politely go your own ways. Yes, the original situation was manageable, but life has a way of changing and your current life and her life are not compatible and trying to force them to coexist is not fair to anyone. There will be many compromises made by all (your children, your GF and you) that are not fair to anyone involved. It is time to agree that you two are not currently a good match and move on. You are correct that you need to place your children first. If she moves in, then you will be forced to make some compromises that no longer put them first. If you don't, then you will be relegating her to a second class citizen in her own home. If you find a way to make everyone else compromise, you will find yourself caught in the middle far too often and will end up compromising yourself in trying to please your children and GF. Really, as much tension and issues as you are having now, you will have many more fold if she moves in and no solution after that will be pleasing to anyone.

Please do all of you a favor and let this relationship go. You deserve a partner who will be able to be supportive of you as a father. She deserves a partner who can place a priority of her and their relationship. Your kids deserve a household that is conducive to raising young adults. None of you will get any of this if you allow the relationship to continue and allow her to move in.