Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes Jeff +1. Also Muslima is right - people forget or here in the US they just don't know.

Hi Muslima!

Anonymous wrote:IF you lived in CCMD and you thought that DC and CCDC "had no right to exist" and you kept lobbing rockets across Western Avenue, hitting our houses, destroying our schools etc one day we would get fed up with it and fight back. That's what is happening in Israel. Hamas does not want peace. They want to annihilate Israel.

Anonymous wrote:THERE NEVER WAS A STATE OF PALESTINE! THE ONLY LOCALLY GOVERNED PRE-WWII NATION WAS THE ISRAELITES, PRE-ROMAN!

Anonymous wrote:Yes Jeff +1. Also Muslima is right - people forget or here in the US they just don't know.

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:That's a very limited perspective. Consider this perspective instead:

The combined Washington, DC and Chevy Chase, MD used to be your homeland. Some strangers came from Ashburn and kicked you out, forcing you to live as a refugee in CCMD. For 40 years, they occupied CCMD, restricting every aspect of your life. Even when the Ashburnists withdrew from CCMD, they controlled travel to and from CCMD, controlled imports and exports, controlled customs duties and generally turned CCMD into an open air prison. Then, imagine that CCMD holds an election for town council and when a party disliked by the Ashburnists wins, a trade embargo is implemented and political leaders are arrested and killed.

You might want to fire a rocket at some point as well.

Why do you insist on rewriting history?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IF you lived in CCMD and you thought that DC and CCDC "had no right to exist" and you kept lobbing rockets across Western Avenue, hitting our houses, destroying our schools etc one day we would get fed up with it and fight back. That's what is happening in Israel. Hamas does not want peace. They want to annihilate Israel.

I think in actuality Israel wants to annihilate Palestine and all of there people. It is quite apparent by their actions-had they just kept the land they initially stole/got from the UN-and peacefully co-existed with the arabs (perhaps even helping them to prosper as well) there would be peace at least in that small sliver of the middle east. Instead, feeling superior, they want to control and oppress, take over and monopolize, ans become segregated and separatists. They are greedy and self righteous, and hypocrites going against everything in their Talmud and religion.

In 1948, Israel expressed hope to live at peace with her neighbors. Her neighbors responded by attacking. Israel won, resulting in the bounty boundaries pre-1967.
Are you suggesting Israel retreat to the UN lines, or the 1967 lines?

Not pp, but Israel should have never been created. You don't go and put a new country, where people are already living. Palestinians were not the cause of the Holocaust, and I think there's a lot of misplaced expectations & responsibility placed on them. I don't support Israel. I don't support a Jewish state. I support a single, secular state where people can live cohesively, together, in a democratic setting (which Israel is not - despite it's false claims).

Assuming a one-state solution is the right answer, how will you enforce a secular state, when the state will quickly be majority muslim? Based on the Jews experience in every other Muslim country, you are basically calling for the mass genocide of 7 million Jews.

Who is calling for the mass genocide of Jews? Were the Palestinians doing so? Where they calling for further genocide after WWII? Were the Muslims? No, they were not - they got along quite well, actually. There's a history and chain of events that you cannot ignore, and that political opposition to Israel may actually be justified - without calling for further Jewish genocide.

How do other secular democracies maintain their position? Can a one-state solution not follow a similar paradigm?

Name a single Muslim-majority secular democracy where Jews are allowed to live and practice their religion in peace.

Pre or post 48? You must understand that a lot of hostility is due to events following then - sentiments can't be disconnected. But Turkey's pretty tolerant.

Since the suggestion is to create a single secular state in 2014, lets see if we can find one now.

Turkey? Sounds like a great place to live for Jews.

"In the 2000s, despite surging antisemitism, including antisemitic incidents, aliyah remained low. In 2008, only 112 Turkish Jews immigrated, and in 2009, that number only rose to 250.[67] However, in the aftermath of the 2010 Gaza flotilla raid, antisemitism in Turkey increased and became more open, and it was reported that the community was also subjected to economic pressure. A boycott of Jewish businesses, especially textile businesses, took place, and Israeli tourists who had frequented the businesses of Turkish Jewish merchants largely stopped visiting Turkey. As a result, the number of Turkish Jews emigrating to Israel increased.[68] By September 2010, the Jewish population of Turkey had dropped to 17,000, from a previous population of 23,000[58] Currently, the Jewish community is feeling increasingly threatened by extremists. In addition to safety concerns, some Turkish Jews also emigrated to Israel to find a Jewish spouse due to the increasing difficulty of finding one in the small Turkish Jewish community. In 2012, it was reported that the number of Jews expressing interest in moving to Israel rose by 100%, a large number of Jewish business owners were seeking to relocate their businesses to Israel, and that hundreds were moving every year.[69]

In October 2013, it was reported that a mass exodus of Turkish Jews was underway. Reportedly, Turkish Jewish families are immigrating to Israel at the rate of one family per week on average, and hundreds of young Turkish Jews are also relocating to the United States and Europe.[70]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Turkey

Anonymous wrote:
Name a single Muslim-majority secular democracy where Jews are allowed to live and practice their religion in peace.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IF you lived in CCMD and you thought that DC and CCDC "had no right to exist" and you kept lobbing rockets across Western Avenue, hitting our houses, destroying our schools etc one day we would get fed up with it and fight back. That's what is happening in Israel. Hamas does not want peace. They want to annihilate Israel.

I think in actuality Israel wants to annihilate Palestine and all of there people. It is quite apparent by their actions-had they just kept the land they initially stole/got from the UN-and peacefully co-existed with the arabs (perhaps even helping them to prosper as well) there would be peace at least in that small sliver of the middle east. Instead, feeling superior, they want to control and oppress, take over and monopolize, ans become segregated and separatists. They are greedy and self righteous, and hypocrites going against everything in their Talmud and religion.

In 1948, Israel expressed hope to live at peace with her neighbors. Her neighbors responded by attacking. Israel won, resulting in the bounty boundaries pre-1967.
Are you suggesting Israel retreat to the UN lines, or the 1967 lines?

jsteele wrote:That's a very limited perspective. Consider this perspective instead:

The combined Washington, DC and Chevy Chase, MD used to be your homeland. Some strangers came from Ashburn and kicked you out, forcing you to live as a refugee in CCMD. For 40 years, they occupied CCMD, restricting every aspect of your life. Even when the Ashburnists withdrew from CCMD, they controlled travel to and from CCMD, controlled imports and exports, controlled customs duties and generally turned CCMD into an open air prison. Then, imagine that CCMD holds an election for town council and when a party disliked by the Ashburnists wins, a trade embargo is implemented and political leaders are arrested and killed.

You might want to fire a rocket at some point as well.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IF you lived in CCMD and you thought that DC and CCDC "had no right to exist" and you kept lobbing rockets across Western Avenue, hitting our houses, destroying our schools etc one day we would get fed up with it and fight back. That's what is happening in Israel. Hamas does not want peace. They want to annihilate Israel.

I think in actuality Israel wants to annihilate Palestine and all of there people. It is quite apparent by their actions-had they just kept the land they initially stole/got from the UN-and peacefully co-existed with the arabs (perhaps even helping them to prosper as well) there would be peace at least in that small sliver of the middle east. Instead, feeling superior, they want to control and oppress, take over and monopolize, ans become segregated and separatists. They are greedy and self righteous, and hypocrites going against everything in their Talmud and religion.

In 1948, Israel expressed hope to live at peace with her neighbors. Her neighbors responded by attacking. Israel won, resulting in the bounty boundaries pre-1967.
Are you suggesting Israel retreat to the UN lines, or the 1967 lines?

Not pp, but Israel should have never been created. You don't go and put a new country, where people are already living. Palestinians were not the cause of the Holocaust, and I think there's a lot of misplaced expectations & responsibility placed on them. I don't support Israel. I don't support a Jewish state. I support a single, secular state where people can live cohesively, together, in a democratic setting (which Israel is not - despite it's false claims).

Assuming a one-state solution is the right answer, how will you enforce a secular state, when the state will quickly be majority muslim? Based on the Jews experience in every other Muslim country, you are basically calling for the mass genocide of 7 million Jews.

Who is calling for the mass genocide of Jews? Were the Palestinians doing so? Where they calling for further genocide after WWII? Were the Muslims? No, they were not - they got along quite well, actually. There's a history and chain of events that you cannot ignore, and that political opposition to Israel may actually be justified - without calling for further Jewish genocide.

How do other secular democracies maintain their position? Can a one-state solution not follow a similar paradigm?

Name a single Muslim-majority secular democracy where Jews are allowed to live and practice their religion in peace.

Pre or post 48? You must understand that a lot of hostility is due to events following then - sentiments can't be disconnected. But Turkey's pretty tolerant.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IF you lived in CCMD and you thought that DC and CCDC "had no right to exist" and you kept lobbing rockets across Western Avenue, hitting our houses, destroying our schools etc one day we would get fed up with it and fight back. That's what is happening in Israel. Hamas does not want peace. They want to annihilate Israel.

I think in actuality Israel wants to annihilate Palestine and all of there people. It is quite apparent by their actions-had they just kept the land they initially stole/got from the UN-and peacefully co-existed with the arabs (perhaps even helping them to prosper as well) there would be peace at least in that small sliver of the middle east. Instead, feeling superior, they want to control and oppress, take over and monopolize, ans become segregated and separatists. They are greedy and self righteous, and hypocrites going against everything in their Talmud and religion.

In 1948, Israel expressed hope to live at peace with her neighbors. Her neighbors responded by attacking. Israel won, resulting in the bounty boundaries pre-1967.
Are you suggesting Israel retreat to the UN lines, or the 1967 lines?

Not pp, but Israel should have never been created. You don't go and put a new country, where people are already living. Palestinians were not the cause of the Holocaust, and I think there's a lot of misplaced expectations & responsibility placed on them. I don't support Israel. I don't support a Jewish state. I support a single, secular state where people can live cohesively, together, in a democratic setting (which Israel is not - despite it's false claims).

Assuming a one-state solution is the right answer, how will you enforce a secular state, when the state will quickly be majority muslim? Based on the Jews experience in every other Muslim country, you are basically calling for the mass genocide of 7 million Jews.

Who is calling for the mass genocide of Jews? Were the Palestinians doing so? Where they calling for further genocide after WWII? Were the Muslims? No, they were not - they got along quite well, actually. There's a history and chain of events that you cannot ignore, and that political opposition to Israel may actually be justified - without calling for further Jewish genocide.

How do other secular democracies maintain their position? Can a one-state solution not follow a similar paradigm?

Name a single Muslim-majority secular democracy where Jews are allowed to live and practice their religion in peace.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That one state solution worked real well for Yugoslavia after Tito died....

The divided state solution is working out just peachy for Pakistan and Indian though, right? The British effed up bigtime. You can't just slice up colonized territories like that, and expect things to roll over smoothly.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IF you lived in CCMD and you thought that DC and CCDC "had no right to exist" and you kept lobbing rockets across Western Avenue, hitting our houses, destroying our schools etc one day we would get fed up with it and fight back. That's what is happening in Israel. Hamas does not want peace. They want to annihilate Israel.

I think in actuality Israel wants to annihilate Palestine and all of there people. It is quite apparent by their actions-had they just kept the land they initially stole/got from the UN-and peacefully co-existed with the arabs (perhaps even helping them to prosper as well) there would be peace at least in that small sliver of the middle east. Instead, feeling superior, they want to control and oppress, take over and monopolize, ans become segregated and separatists. They are greedy and self righteous, and hypocrites going against everything in their Talmud and religion.

In 1948, Israel expressed hope to live at peace with her neighbors. Her neighbors responded by attacking. Israel won, resulting in the bounty boundaries pre-1967.
Are you suggesting Israel retreat to the UN lines, or the 1967 lines?

Not pp, but Israel should have never been created. You don't go and put a new country, where people are already living. Palestinians were not the cause of the Holocaust, and I think there's a lot of misplaced expectations & responsibility placed on them. I don't support Israel. I don't support a Jewish state. I support a single, secular state where people can live cohesively, together, in a democratic setting (which Israel is not - despite it's false claims).

Assuming a one-state solution is the right answer, how will you enforce a secular state, when the state will quickly be majority muslim? Based on the Jews experience in every other Muslim country, you are basically calling for the mass genocide of 7 million Jews.