Anonymous
Post 02/11/2014 17:18     Subject: How do you feel about students hiring private writing tutors?
I think that is great. I have a problem with professional writers writing essays for kids for assignments etc.

Anonymous
Post 02/11/2014 17:02     Subject: Re:How do you feel about students hiring private writing tutors?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:If it helps them with the process, organizing thoughts, fine. It's not going to make them surpass a child who is naturally an extraordinary writer so don't get upset about it.


And what if it does? Would you be opposed to it then?


There is no such thing as a "naturally extraordinary writer." Writers learn to write by reading and writing on a regular basis. It's learned. Rince, repeat. Writing is probably the skill that is most easily learned from experience; unfortunately, there are not many shortcuts for learning how to use language well.

I think a tutor who helps a student to problems in writing and provides individualized feedback can help a great deal. In fact, its lack of such consistent practice and feedback that makes so many students poor at writing. Combined with regular reading, its a great idea.

Of course, this instruction should never include writing essays for students. That goes without saying.



I agree writing can be taughts. But few teachers teach "writing". They give writing assignments and grade them but don't teach brainstorming, mapping, flow charting, etc.

Mostly they say, have a good introductory sentence that states the thesis, a couple of supporting sentences and a conclusion.

Some kids can't become good writers with that type of instruction.


This is PP - I couldn't agree more. The writing instruction happening in the classroom is often quite poor - at least that is what I concluded from teaching and tutoring college freshmen.

Unfortunately, I'm not sure that kind of writing pushed to gifted high school students (the AP essay) is good for very much besides writing AP essays. Alas.

I agree writing can be taughts. But few teachers teach "writing". They give writing assignments and grade them but don't teach brainstorming, mapping, flow charting, etc.

Mostly they say, have a good introductory sentence that states the thesis, a couple of supporting sentences and a conclusion.

Some kids can't become good writers with that type of instruction.
Anonymous
Post 02/11/2014 17:01     Subject: Re:How do you feel about students hiring private writing tutors?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:If it helps them with the process, organizing thoughts, fine. It's not going to make them surpass a child who is naturally an extraordinary writer so don't get upset about it.


And what if it does? Would you be opposed to it then?


There is no such thing as a "naturally extraordinary writer." Writers learn to write by reading and writing on a regular basis. It's learned. Rince, repeat. Writing is probably the skill that is most easily learned from experience; unfortunately, there are not many shortcuts for learning how to use language well.

I think a tutor who helps a student to problems in writing and provides individualized feedback can help a great deal. In fact, its lack of such consistent practice and feedback that makes so many students poor at writing. Combined with regular reading, its a great idea.

Of course, this instruction should never include writing essays for students. That goes without saying.



This is PP - I couldn't agree more. The writing instruction happening in the classroom is often quite poor - at least that is what I concluded from teaching and tutoring college freshmen.

Unfortunately, I'm not sure that kind of writing pushed to gifted high school students (the AP essay) is good for very much besides writing AP essays. Alas.

I agree writing can be taughts. But few teachers teach "writing". They give writing assignments and grade them but don't teach brainstorming, mapping, flow charting, etc.

Mostly they say, have a good introductory sentence that states the thesis, a couple of supporting sentences and a conclusion.

Some kids can't become good writers with that type of instruction.
Anonymous
Post 02/11/2014 16:57     Subject: Re:How do you feel about students hiring private writing tutors?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:If it helps them with the process, organizing thoughts, fine. It's not going to make them surpass a child who is naturally an extraordinary writer so don't get upset about it.


And what if it does? Would you be opposed to it then?


There is no such thing as a "naturally extraordinary writer." Writers learn to write by reading and writing on a regular basis. It's learned. Rince, repeat. Writing is probably the skill that is most easily learned from experience; unfortunately, there are not many shortcuts for learning how to use language well.

I think a tutor who helps a student to problems in writing and provides individualized feedback can help a great deal. In fact, its lack of such consistent practice and feedback that makes so many students poor at writing. Combined with regular reading, its a great idea.

Of course, this instruction should never include writing essays for students. That goes without saying.



Disagree there are children who are born with a gift for writing, you cannot teach that. You can micmic and inspire great form but there is an indefinable ability and you cannot "fake it 'til you make it."


I'll concede the possibility of innate ability. But if there is a discipline in which it is possible to overstate the milage raw appetite gives you, it is here. Almost everyone who writes well does so from practice - and by editing, editing, editing - and from hearing and using language. That special, unique voice some acquire is usually springs from these roots. As such, "poor writers" can certainly benefit from additional instruction (and plain old practice). And few writers are so exceptional that they won't benefit from instruction, exposure, workshopping, etc. Certainly this is true of all grade and high school students.

Anonymous
Post 02/11/2014 16:39     Subject: How do you feel about students hiring private writing tutors?
Anonymous wrote:Not sure if this fits here but I was just thinking about how to help my son. 8 th grader, great reader but terrible writer. We have a great relationship but he does not want me to teach or coach him. Should I look for a writing tutor, a writing program on-line? He hates to write and I am worried about him because writing is a life skill. So far, his grades are good but it is because we sit with him, edit, make him do webs, etc.

My dh bith tell him that writing is a skill, craft and you have to work at it. He will always do the least amount possible, make no connections between ideas, use elementary language ( he has a great vocabulary.) I have been thinking about this all semester so timely post.


For online programs, I might take a look at Institute for Excellence in Writing's online writing class Level B for Grades 6–8/ages 11-13. More information here (http://iew.com/events-classes/online-classes/online-class-information). This program teaches an extremely structured writing method especially at first when students are new to the program, so it might be good for a reluctant writer who hasn't yet learned to use writing strategies consistently . The method forces students to make specific conscious decisions about word choice, so that might address your vocabulary concerns. The method taught by this program lends itself well to the five paragraph essay style of writing emphasized in school because it teaches students to write from a carefully created outline.

I have heard some criticism of the program so it might not be right for everyone. A common complaint is that the method it teaches is too structured and removes the creativity from the writing process. I personally think this is good at the elementary level because I want my kids to learn the basics and have a strong foundation in writing skills before they start trying to embellish and experiment with "creative" writing, and I think it might be good for a reluctant writer who is older, like your son. Some parents say that it reduced their student's enjoyment of writing, but this was always with a kid who already loved to write, so I'm not sure how it would apply in your case. Finally, I have heard that the class is too expensive, or that it is not convenient that there is only one after school course offered since the program is mainly geared towards homeschoolers. YMMV, so definitely look into it and decide based on what works for your family/your son, but when I saw your post I thought this program might fit what you were looking for so I wanted to mention it.

Hope this helps.
Anonymous
Post 02/11/2014 16:02     Subject: How do you feel about students hiring private writing tutors?
Not sure if this fits here but I was just thinking about how to help my son. 8 th grader, great reader but terrible writer. We have a great relationship but he does not want me to teach or coach him. Should I look for a writing tutor, a writing program on-line? He hates to write and I am worried about him because writing is a life skill. So far, his grades are good but it is because we sit with him, edit, make him do webs, etc.

My dh bith tell him that writing is a skill, craft and you have to work at it. He will always do the least amount possible, make no connections between ideas, use elementary language ( he has a great vocabulary.) I have been thinking about this all semester so timely post.
Anonymous
Post 02/11/2014 15:22     Subject: Re:How do you feel about students hiring private writing tutors?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

Disagree there are children who are born with a gift for writing, you cannot teach that. You can micmic and inspire great form but there is an indefinable ability and you cannot "fake it 'til you make it."


Should have been "Disagree. There are children ...." (obviously I am not naturally gifted)


I think just the opposite. It is true that some people hapeen to have an easier time at writing than others, but that is the case with of every human endeavor. Writing, even more so than most academic skills, takes years of practice and honing, which means that anyone can substantially improve with time and effort. In fact, I think the single biggest cause of bad writing is the mistaken belief that one is either a gifted writer or not. If you take this view and you think highly of your own writing, you see no need to improve it. And if you take this view and think poorly of your writing, you have no incentive to improve it.

A related issue is that writing is contextual. Someone who is great at creative writing might be terrible at writing a thesis-oriented paper, for example. It is easy to overlook that there are different types of writing, each of which takes some time and experience to master.
Anonymous
Post 02/11/2014 15:09     Subject: Re:How do you feel about students hiring private writing tutors?
How do you feel about students hiring private writing tutors?

About the same way I feel about hiring a maid to clean the house or a personal training to increase my strength and flexibility.
Anonymous
Post 02/11/2014 11:41     Subject: Re:How do you feel about students hiring private writing tutors?
Anonymous wrote:

Disagree there are children who are born with a gift for writing, you cannot teach that. You can micmic and inspire great form but there is an indefinable ability and you cannot "fake it 'til you make it."


Should have been "Disagree. There are children ...." (obviously I am not naturally gifted)
Anonymous
Post 02/11/2014 11:40     Subject: Re:How do you feel about students hiring private writing tutors?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:If it helps them with the process, organizing thoughts, fine. It's not going to make them surpass a child who is naturally an extraordinary writer so don't get upset about it.


And what if it does? Would you be opposed to it then?


There is no such thing as a "naturally extraordinary writer." Writers learn to write by reading and writing on a regular basis. It's learned. Rince, repeat. Writing is probably the skill that is most easily learned from experience; unfortunately, there are not many shortcuts for learning how to use language well.

I think a tutor who helps a student to problems in writing and provides individualized feedback can help a great deal. In fact, its lack of such consistent practice and feedback that makes so many students poor at writing. Combined with regular reading, its a great idea.

Of course, this instruction should never include writing essays for students. That goes without saying.



Disagree there are children who are born with a gift for writing, you cannot teach that. You can micmic and inspire great form but there is an indefinable ability and you cannot "fake it 'til you make it."
Anonymous
Post 02/11/2014 11:33     Subject: How do you feel about students hiring private writing tutors?
No doubt this is a cover for the coming post with a link to a handwriting tutor.

Who would object to this? My only objection is to the insane, INSANE price of these handwriting improvement "tutors."
Anonymous
Post 02/11/2014 11:29     Subject: Re:How do you feel about students hiring private writing tutors?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:If it helps them with the process, organizing thoughts, fine. It's not going to make them surpass a child who is naturally an extraordinary writer so don't get upset about it.


And what if it does? Would you be opposed to it then?


There is no such thing as a "naturally extraordinary writer." Writers learn to write by reading and writing on a regular basis. It's learned. Rince, repeat. Writing is probably the skill that is most easily learned from experience; unfortunately, there are not many shortcuts for learning how to use language well.

I think a tutor who helps a student to problems in writing and provides individualized feedback can help a great deal. In fact, its lack of such consistent practice and feedback that makes so many students poor at writing. Combined with regular reading, its a great idea.

Of course, this instruction should never include writing essays for students. That goes without saying.



I agree writing can be taughts. But few teachers teach "writing". They give writing assignments and grade them but don't teach brainstorming, mapping, flow charting, etc.

Mostly they say, have a good introductory sentence that states the thesis, a couple of supporting sentences and a conclusion.

Some kids can't become good writers with that type of instruction.
Anonymous
Post 02/11/2014 11:23     Subject: How do you feel about students hiring private writing tutors?
Anonymous wrote:Maybe the concern is cheating. A lot of writing tutors cross the line from helping educate to ghost writing, in my experience. I certainly think a tutor who is merely educating is a great idea.

I[b] worked in a writing center at college and was surprised how few people took advantage of the free service[/b]. More than half of the people who came in were bright ESL students.


+1. I almost became an ESL teacher because of the experience.
Anonymous
Post 02/11/2014 10:21     Subject: Re:How do you feel about students hiring private writing tutors?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:If it helps them with the process, organizing thoughts, fine. It's not going to make them surpass a child who is naturally an extraordinary writer so don't get upset about it.


And what if it does? Would you be opposed to it then?


There is no such thing as a "naturally extraordinary writer." Writers learn to write by reading and writing on a regular basis. It's learned. Rince, repeat. Writing is probably the skill that is most easily learned from experience; unfortunately, there are not many shortcuts for learning how to use language well.

I think a tutor who helps a student to problems in writing and provides individualized feedback can help a great deal. In fact, its lack of such consistent practice and feedback that makes so many students poor at writing. Combined with regular reading, its a great idea.

Of course, this instruction should never include writing essays for students. That goes without saying.



*a student WITH writing problems
*its=it's

Yes, the irony of my needing to correct these mistypes is not lost on me. At least I know to be horrified when I edit.
Anonymous
Post 02/11/2014 10:18     Subject: Re:How do you feel about students hiring private writing tutors?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:If it helps them with the process, organizing thoughts, fine. It's not going to make them surpass a child who is naturally an extraordinary writer so don't get upset about it.


And what if it does? Would you be opposed to it then?


There is no such thing as a "naturally extraordinary writer." Writers learn to write by reading and writing on a regular basis. It's learned. Rince, repeat. Writing is probably the skill that is most easily learned from experience; unfortunately, there are not many shortcuts for learning how to use language well.

I think a tutor who helps a student to problems in writing and provides individualized feedback can help a great deal. In fact, its lack of such consistent practice and feedback that makes so many students poor at writing. Combined with regular reading, its a great idea.

Of course, this instruction should never include writing essays for students. That goes without saying.