Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think there's a big difference of a parody versus a "mockery" of religion. There is a very real point to FSM, and it's not about mockery. I suspect the reason fundamentalists and religious absolutists of all stripes are offended is that it hits a little too close to home.

Ramen.

Maybe you should tell us what the "very real point" of the FSM is. It sounds like you're saying, both the FSM and religion are man- made inventions.

In which case, (a) the FSM is serious and not humor, so nobody on that other thread should be called "humorless" for not laughing, and (b ) the reference to the FSM on that thread was intended as a serious repudiation of religion, so what was it doing on that thread if not a deliberate attempt to insult people?

You can't have it both ways. Gotcha!

PS, if the rest of your logic is as bad and off-point as what you just write above (and it's typical of the Ranting Atheist, so maybe it's you ) there's no way you're going to win a serious argument with me. Pretty soon you'll be in the gutter with AD hominem attacks and I'll be long gone, I promise.

Anonymous wrote:I think there's a big difference of a parody versus a "mockery" of religion. There is a very real point to FSM, and it's not about mockery. I suspect the reason fundamentalists and religious absolutists of all stripes are offended is that it hits a little too close to home.

Ramen.

Maybe you should tell us what the "very real point" of the FSM is. It sounds like you're saying, both the FSM and religion are man- made inventions.

In which case, (a) the FSM is serious and not humor, so nobody on that other thread should be called "humorless" for not laughing, and (b ) the reference to the FSM on that thread was intended as a serious repudiation of religion, so what was it doing on that thread if not a deliberate attempt to insult people?

You can't have it both ways. Gotcha!

I think there's a big difference of a parody versus a "mockery" of religion. There is a very real point to FSM, and it's not about mockery. I suspect the reason fundamentalists and religious absolutists of all stripes are offended is that it hits a little too close to home.

Ramen.

Thanks, OP, for starting a thoughtful thread.

Just based on personal experience, I think religious folk and atheists can all be guilty of humorlessness, especially the converts as a PP said. I know lots of Episcopalian jokes about the sins of using the wrong fork. On the other hand, 5:35's reaction to the Youtube clip shows that atheists can be humorless too. Same goes for the Finger-Wagging Atheist (endless posts about how "religious people are hyper-sensitive") and the Ranting Atheist (viciousness lying under a patina of sophomoric humor), both of whom seem like unpleasant, humorless individuals underneath.

For me, context matters. The atheist may be peeing his pants laughing, but if the snark derailed a promising thread, then it's annoying to the religious people who were trying to have a conversation.

Re the FSM, it's always been intended and understood as a parody and mockery of religion. So this is like one of those gotcha games where someone tells a Polish or Italian joke and then expresses disingenuous surprise that Poles or Italians don't see the humor.

Anonymous wrote:I think that atheists tend to be "converts" to their religion.

And like all other converts, they are more likely to be evangelical, narrow minded, and rigid in their beliefs and have a tendency to take themselves and their beliefs very seriously.

In a generation or so they might have more of a sense of humor about things.

From my experience, most of the atheists I have met tend to be of the scientific inclination. I have found that group as a whole is not particularly humorous.

so you think converts tot Catholicism, Judaism are more rigid than people indocrinated as children into those beliefs? Many people change to the religion of their spouse when they get married or have children. Are they more narrow-minded?

Is there reason to disapprove of people taking their religious beliefs seriously, for whatever reason?

How do you define "of the scientific inclination?" looking to science over religion for explanations about how the world works? or being scientists or good at science? As an atheist, I look to science to explain things (and know many religious people who do to) but I'm not particularly good at science.

Anonymous wrote:I got into a little trouble in another thread, unintentionally offending somone with a joke involving the flying spaghetti monster. http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/15/343778.page#4326266

I think there is an interesting question here, which I will raise even though I risk starting a thread that may eventually offend some. I think we atheists make fun of religion much more than believers make fun of atheism. Am I wrong about that, and if not, is it worth considering the asymmetry? Are you believers nicer than us, or is there just less to make fun of?

I think atheism just isn't that funny. What could possibly be funny about it- you live your life, then you die and nothing remains of you. Then look at the treasure trove of Catholicism- there's a pope, he wears a funny hat, he has special shoes, there are nuns, everybody is wearing funny outfits all over the place. I'm sure there are other funny things about other denominations/religions, but I mean, there are Simpsons characters where the humor revolves around their religion (Ned Flanders, their preacher, his hypocritical gossipy wife), but is there any real humor to be found in Lisa's thoughtful agnosticism? It's just a foil for the other characters' thoughtlessness.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Offhand, all I think of to make fun of in atheism is the idea of a bunch of chemicals, purely by chance, jumping up and forming cells, and those cells deciding to join together to form a worm, a fish, or Albert Einstein.

Sure, but that's not particularly funny--because no one actually believes that or anything like it. Well, I mean it *is* funny in a way because it's clear that's what many Creationists seem to think Evolution is about.

what I think is not funny, but amazing, is that some religious people can believe that God set the world in motion, then waited billions of years before sending his son down to save us from our sins.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I tend to only tell jokes about my own religion. So I would not tell a Jewish/Muslim/Athiest joke because I am none of those religions.

I also find my athiest friends are super sensitive about religion ... less so than my non practicing religion friends. It's like they think about it too much and if you told a joke they would jump right to defensive and ask why I support a church that molests kids.

So short answer... no I would not make a joke about other peoples religion. (unless it was my best friend)

You've got weird friends.

Most of my friends are atheist, and religion just never comes up that often. And when it does, it gets amused tolerance at worst. Unless an organized religious group is actively trying to fuck over some other group.

It may be a timing thing...DOMA.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I tend to only tell jokes about my own religion. So I would not tell a Jewish/Muslim/Athiest joke because I am none of those religions.

I also find my athiest friends are super sensitive about religion ... less so than my non practicing religion friends. It's like they think about it too much and if you told a joke they would jump right to defensive and ask why I support a church that molests kids.

So short answer... no I would not make a joke about other peoples religion. (unless it was my best friend)

Usually I overlook that common misspelling of atheist, but in this context I think I should say: My feelings are not that strong, I'm just athier, not athiest.

I'm dyslexic so it looks fine to me.

I think that atheists tend to be "converts" to their religion.

And like all other converts, they are more likely to be evangelical, narrow minded, and rigid in their beliefs and have a tendency to take themselves and their beliefs very seriously.

In a generation or so they might have more of a sense of humor about things.

From my experience, most of the atheists I have met tend to be of the scientific inclination. I have found that group as a whole is not particularly humorous.

Anonymous wrote:I make jokes about religion and my religious heritage, Roman Catholic, all the time. Then, after laughing, I add that I am going to hell for that one!

Also, I have a pretty serious Protestant friend who I refer to as "heretic" and he calls me "papist." Among my Jewish friends, when we are in a SNAFU, usually involving our wives - affectionately known as the die frauen - one of will ask "why is this night different from any other?" I am also the goy.

Some of my lesser jokes -

I am a submarine Catholic. I come up at Christmas and Easter!
How many Orthodox (Christians) does it take to screw in a lightbulb? None. The Orthodox do not like change.
When God said "Let there be light!" I think he meant "Bud Lite!"

Would a temple wear a thong?

Jesus said in my father's house there are many rooms. Unfortunately, your (Protestants room) will be by the ice and vending machines!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Jrh_uuPmd0

Wow, the laugh track on that video is horrible!

Anonymous wrote:Offhand, all I think of to make fun of in atheism is the idea of a bunch of chemicals, purely by chance, jumping up and forming cells, and those cells deciding to join together to form a worm, a fish, or Albert Einstein.

Sure, but that's not particularly funny--because no one actually believes that or anything like it. Well, I mean it *is* funny in a way because it's clear that's what many Creationists seem to think Evolution is about.

Anonymous wrote:I tend to only tell jokes about my own religion. So I would not tell a Jewish/Muslim/Athiest joke because I am none of those religions.

I also find my athiest friends are super sensitive about religion ... less so than my non practicing religion friends. It's like they think about it too much and if you told a joke they would jump right to defensive and ask why I support a church that molests kids.

So short answer... no I would not make a joke about other peoples religion. (unless it was my best friend)

You've got weird friends.

Most of my friends are atheist, and religion just never comes up that often. And when it does, it gets amused tolerance at worst. Unless an organized religious group is actively trying to fuck over some other group.

Anonymous wrote:I think atheists have been the object of derision and misunderstanding more than religious people for several reasons 1) atheism, being the lack of religion, is a bit harder to understand and 2) atheists, until recently, have been pretty quiet about their lack of beliefs, 3. Atheism has been seen as the lack of all the perceived good elements of religions - morals, compassion, etc. That's changing now as atheists are speaking out more openly and some people are realizing that their some of their best friends are atheists.

Think of gays a few decades ago and I think that's where atheists are now -- or were until about 7 yeas ago when the "New atheists" popped up on the scene. Everyone knew atheists existed, but it was not something that was talked about in polite company.

Well said. I think of telling family and others about me being an atheist as a kind of "coming out," because it's still not very much accepted as normal, and there seems to be a lot of suspicion about atheists. I think it was Pew and a number of other major polling places that asked people if they would vote for a Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, atheist, etc president. Every other ideological group received a higher vote of "yes, I would vote for someone of that background" than atheists - the fewest number of people said they would vote for an atheist. I find this just... crazy. There are so many prejudiced against atheists, yet somehow people think WE are pushy. It makes no sense. But people say the same thing about any minority demographic or group - that they're pushy. That they're just causing trouble. That they're being insensitive to the majority group.

Anonymous wrote:I think someone's ability to laugh at a joke about their beliefs depends on their security about those beliefs.

I absolutely agree. I feel like these are often the same people who don't like to read about, talk about, or become informed about other people's beliefs, because they think it'll taint their own. If you can't immerse yourself in the ideologies of others, or have a good sense of humor about your own traditions, it seems like that person's belief must be very weak to begin with.