Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Globalization is everywhere. Companies operate across borders. Capital and commodities freely flow across borders. I think open borders is the logical conclusion of globalization.

ok....we'll open our borders when switzerland opens theirs.

25% of the population of Switzerland is documented, legal foreigners.

Your turn.

however the bar to obtain swiss citizenship is high.

switzerland has a good work permit system.

mind you it doesn't mean one can pop over there tomorrow and start working- you have to be sponsored. And given the size of switzerland and amount of multi-national corps there, inter-company transfers boost that number.

if switzerland had true open borders, i would be there tomorrow.

what you mean by open borders is what the EU has....a spaniard can apply for a job in france, italy etc without having to have a work permit/be sponsored/etc. Switzerland DOES NOT have this.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Just look at it as the US government making amends to the 1 million Mexican americans the U.S. Government rounded up and forced into Mexico during the 1930s. It is reported that between 60-70% of those Mexican Americanx were US citizens. Government officials knocked on people's doors and pulled families from thei homes. President Hoover said that the mexicans were taking jobs from the real Americans and we (the country) needed to save the jibs for real white people.

source?

I don't know how to cut and paste on my iPad and my 8 year old son is in camp right now and thus can not show me. However, if you google 1930s mexican mass deportation you should get results. I know the state of california is preparing to issue an apology.

Why should CA apologize, they let all their children and grandchildren come right back in.

Anonymous wrote:

Just look at it as the US government making amends to the 1 million Mexican americans the U.S. Government rounded up and forced into Mexico during the 1930s. It is reported that between 60-70% of those Mexican Americanx were US citizens. Government officials knocked on people's doors and pulled families from thei homes. President Hoover said that the mexicans were taking jobs from the real Americans and we (the country) needed to save the jibs for real white people.

source?

I don't know how to cut and paste on my iPad and my 8 year old son is in camp right now and thus can not show me. However, if you google 1930s mexican mass deportation you should get results. I know the state of california is preparing to issue an apology.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Globalization is everywhere. Companies operate across borders. Capital and commodities freely flow across borders. I think open borders is the logical conclusion of globalization.


ok....we'll open our borders when switzerland opens theirs.
25% of the population of Switzerland is documented, legal foreigners.

Your turn.

"Legal" is the operative word.

Ok so it's ok if our laws match theirs?

Just look at it as the US government making amends to the 1 million Mexican americans the U.S. Government rounded up and forced into Mexico during the 1930s. It is reported that between 60-70% of those Mexican Americanx were US citizens. Government officials knocked on people's doors and pulled families from thei homes. President Hoover said that the mexicans were taking jobs from the real Americans and we (the country) needed to save the jibs for real white people.

source?

Just look at it as the US government making amends to the 1 million Mexican americans the U.S. Government rounded up and forced into Mexico during the 1930s. It is reported that between 60-70% of those Mexican Americanx were US citizens. Government officials knocked on people's doors and pulled families from thei homes. President Hoover said that the mexicans were taking jobs from the real Americans and we (the country) needed to save the jibs for real white people.

Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Globalization is everywhere. Companies operate across borders. Capital and commodities freely flow across borders. I think open borders is the logical conclusion of globalization.


ok....we'll open our borders when switzerland opens theirs.
25% of the population of Switzerland is documented, legal foreigners.

Your turn.

"Legal" is the operative word.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know many legal immigrants. Not one of them favors amnesty.

yes the recent immigrants are always opposed to the next wave of immigrants. This is nothing new. But we have real issues to fix. Assuaging someone angry about line butting ranks really low.

This.....

Total b-s!

I am a legal immigrant and neither I nor many others I know who came here legally are opposed to LEGAL immigration. But we are opposed to people who come here illegally and then feel they have a right to stay in this great country although they broke the law when they came here.

And Republicans who support this move towards amnesty are out of their fricking minds because most Latinos think that it is Obama and the Democrats who are really rooting for them. Get ready for 11 million more citizens who will for the most part vote Democrat in future elections.

Seriously, if the Democrats did not think this would accrue to their benefit do you really think they would be pushing for immigration reform and legitimizing millions of illegals?

Illegal vs. Legal however comes down to arbitrary definitions/rules at that time. There is no 'inherent' differentiator if you know what i mean. If you have completely open borders, the suddenly everyone is 'legal'.

We need to look at the immigration debate through what is right/good policy rather than legal/illegal.

You say you are for legal immigration. what does that mean? Do you want unlimited h1b? Would you like chain migration/family reunification? Do you want a quota system again scaled to different countries such as back in the 20's? Or would you rather a high bar for citizenship but a generous work-permit program a la switzerland or singapore?

Sorry but this is a cop-out. Of course, if we had open borders then there would not be anything such as a legal or illegal immigrant but we don't have open borders.

Right/good policy is not determined because we have allowed a problem to fester that has caused us to end up with 11 million illegals. If we would not have allowed these illegals to enter the country under our immigration laws, then just because they are already here is not justification for legalizing them.

I am all for legal immigration - the diversity, skills and sheer drive enriches this country immeasurably. I don't have a problem with with the family reunification provision or current eligibility for citizenship. Where there is a temporary need for labor eg agricultural workers, then let us grant work permits expressly for that purpose.

Frankly, I blame the Republicans just as much as I do the Democrats for where we are today. Business generally supports Republicans and wants the cheap labor from these illegals and they discourage strong penalties against them for hiring illegals. Those who come here illegally do so for economic reasons for the most part ..... remove that incentive and the problem will be greatly diminished.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Globalization is everywhere. Companies operate across borders. Capital and commodities freely flow across borders. I think open borders is the logical conclusion of globalization.

ok....we'll open our borders when switzerland opens theirs.

25% of the population of Switzerland is documented, legal foreigners.

Your turn.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know many legal immigrants. Not one of them favors amnesty.

yes the recent immigrants are always opposed to the next wave of immigrants. This is nothing new. But we have real issues to fix. Assuaging someone angry about line butting ranks really low.

This.....

Total b-s!

I am a legal immigrant and neither I nor many others I know who came here legally are opposed to LEGAL immigration. But we are opposed to people who come here illegally and then feel they have a right to stay in this great country although they broke the law when they came here.

And Republicans who support this move towards amnesty are out of their fricking minds because most Latinos think that it is Obama and the Democrats who are really rooting for them. Get ready for 11 million more citizens who will for the most part vote Democrat in future elections.

Seriously, if the Democrats did not think this would accrue to their benefit do you really think they would be pushing for immigration reform and legitimizing millions of illegals?

Illegal vs. Legal however comes down to arbitrary definitions/rules at that time. There is no 'inherent' differentiator if you know what i mean. If you have completely open borders, the suddenly everyone is 'legal'.

We need to look at the immigration debate through what is right/good policy rather than legal/illegal.

You say you are for legal immigration. what does that mean? Do you want unlimited h1b? Would you like chain migration/family reunification? Do you want a quota system again scaled to different countries such as back in the 20's? Or would you rather a high bar for citizenship but a generous work-permit program a la switzerland or singapore?

most house republicans wish the immigration act of 1924 was still in effect.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know many legal immigrants. Not one of them favors amnesty.

yes the recent immigrants are always opposed to the next wave of immigrants. This is nothing new. But we have real issues to fix. Assuaging someone angry about line butting ranks really low.

This.....

Total b-s!

I am a legal immigrant and neither I nor many others I know who came here legally are opposed to LEGAL immigration. But we are opposed to people who come here illegally and then feel they have a right to stay in this great country although they broke the law when they came here.

And Republicans who support this move towards amnesty are out of their fricking minds because most Latinos think that it is Obama and the Democrats who are really rooting for them. Get ready for 11 million more citizens who will for the most part vote Democrat in future elections.

Seriously, if the Democrats did not think this would accrue to their benefit do you really think they would be pushing for immigration reform and legitimizing millions of illegals?

Anonymous wrote:Globalization is everywhere. Companies operate across borders. Capital and commodities freely flow across borders. I think open borders is the logical conclusion of globalization.

ok....we'll open our borders when switzerland opens theirs.

Anonymous wrote:Globalization is everywhere. Companies operate across borders. Capital and commodities freely flow across borders. I think open borders is the logical conclusion of globalization.

Perhaps, but economic efficiency is not the only goal of a society.

Globalization is everywhere. Companies operate across borders. Capital and commodities freely flow across borders. I think open borders is the logical conclusion of globalization.