Anonymous wrote:The problem with the RCF spanish immersion program is that it's located in a good school pyramid. Parents who are scrambling to get away from a less desirable school pyramid apply just to be in the BCC. Magnet programs should be used to draw the affluent/middle class families into the poorer communities to attend schools that would otherwise have few/limited students from middle-class families, not draw the affluent/middle class families away from the DCC, which seems to be the trend. It leaves the DCC schools with even fewer middle class families than it would have if everyone just went to their neighborhood school, it overcrowds the BCC (much to the dismay of the folks who pay the big bucks to live in that school assignment), and it makes it that much harder for parents with a genuine desire to expose their kids to a second language to get into the program because they're competing with a whole slew of applicants who just want anything but their home school. I'm sure there's a story behind the location of the program or a rule behind it or something, and maybe of the elementaries in the BCC cluster RCF has a comparatively high FARMS rate which somehow justified placing the program there, but as a policy matter, and looking at the incentive structure the program creates, my instinct is to say MCPS is doing it wrong with this program. The full immersion program should probably be in the downcounty.

Westland immersion parent here. I agree that the best solution is for MCPS to establish an immersion program continuation in high school somewhere. Otherwise the kids have no option for adequate language instruction and all that work and sacrifice is greatly diminished. I for one would send my child to a downcounty high school with an immersion continuation without hesitation -- I think most of the other parents agree.

The problem here is that the BCC cluster reps are acting in bad faith by not involving their immersion family constituents (all of whom pay PTA dues, volunteer, etc.) in the decision and at least informing them. We have had NO communication from them on this point at all. Even the RCF PTA won't speak up for the interests of half of its members. It is appalling.

The second problem is that MCPS, during several meetings with Cluster Superintendent Garran, BoE member Shirley Brandman and others, promised that such a change would be conducted with great transparency and input from immersion parents, with plenty of notice. Instead, this has been done on the sly with absolutely NO input from immersion parents. This is a public school system, not a private school whose tuition is paid through taxes. We should have been involved, informed, and our children's interests also considered.

The result is there are kids who are already well ensconced in middle school at Westland, whose families have made certain decisions about application magnets, etc., who now are going to be scattered across the county for high school. Many of these schools do not have the higher level language classes or the critical mass of high-level speakers to allow kids to maintain and continue to develop their language skills.

Maybe it is time for a change, but that doesn't mean that immersion parents should be dealt with in bad faith or treated like they are carpetbaggers. I can tell you that I did not make the decision for immersion based on BCC -- in fact, my other child is not in immersion and goes to a different high school and is perfectly fine. And the BCC parents are treating immersion parents in such an elitist, "I pay more taxes than you" way that it's really offensive. We applied to a legitimate magnet program and operated under the assumption that the assurances of MCPS leadership would be followed through on.

The reality is that we are talking about a small number of kids -- about 20 - 25 per grade. It's not going to make a dent in BCC's overcrowding but it's really an unfair and deceptive way to deal with these families.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do any other immersion programs feed all the way through high school?

Yes they do... SSIM can go to Blair, chinese go to Churchill.

Not true. SSIMS immersion kids go to their home high school or whatever magnet admits them. They do NOT go to Blair.

Wrong wrong wrong....

From the choice manual:


Students who reside outside the Downcounty Consortium, but attend a Consortium middle school, may participate in high school Choice, following the same process as students residing in the Consortium. These students also are assured that they may attend a Consortium high school. However, for these students, there is no guarantee of admittance to a specific high school, because they do not reside within a base area of one of the high schools. Student Choice request forms for out-of-Consortium students are processed in the second round of the student assignment process, after students residing in the Consortium have been provided with their high school assignments.

Anonymous wrote:The problem with the RCF spanish immersion program is that it's located in a good school pyramid. Parents who are scrambling to get away from a less desirable school pyramid apply just to be in the BCC. Magnet programs should be used to draw the affluent/middle class families into the poorer communities to attend schools that would otherwise have few/limited students from middle-class families, not draw the affluent/middle class families away from the DCC, which seems to be the trend. It leaves the DCC schools with even fewer middle class families than it would have if everyone just went to their neighborhood school, it overcrowds the BCC (much to the dismay of the folks who pay the big bucks to live in that school assignment), and it makes it that much harder for parents with a genuine desire to expose their kids to a second language to get into the program because they're competing with a whole slew of applicants who just want anything but their home school. I'm sure there's a story behind the location of the program or a rule behind it or something, and maybe of the elementaries in the BCC cluster RCF has a comparatively high FARMS rate which somehow justified placing the program there, but as a policy matter, and looking at the incentive structure the program creates, my instinct is to say MCPS is doing it wrong with this program. The full immersion program should probably be in the downcounty.

One of the reasons is because BCC has the IB program which is a natural progression for kids in Immersion.

The problem with the RCF spanish immersion program is that it's located in a good school pyramid. Parents who are scrambling to get away from a less desirable school pyramid apply just to be in the BCC. Magnet programs should be used to draw the affluent/middle class families into the poorer communities to attend schools that would otherwise have few/limited students from middle-class families, not draw the affluent/middle class families away from the DCC, which seems to be the trend. It leaves the DCC schools with even fewer middle class families than it would have if everyone just went to their neighborhood school, it overcrowds the BCC (much to the dismay of the folks who pay the big bucks to live in that school assignment), and it makes it that much harder for parents with a genuine desire to expose their kids to a second language to get into the program because they're competing with a whole slew of applicants who just want anything but their home school. I'm sure there's a story behind the location of the program or a rule behind it or something, and maybe of the elementaries in the BCC cluster RCF has a comparatively high FARMS rate which somehow justified placing the program there, but as a policy matter, and looking at the incentive structure the program creates, my instinct is to say MCPS is doing it wrong with this program. The full immersion program should probably be in the downcounty.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do any other immersion programs feed all the way through high school?

Yes they do... SSIM can go to Blair, chinese go to Churchill.

Not true. SSIMS immersion kids go to their home high school or whatever magnet admits them. They do NOT go to Blair.

Actually Immersion kids in SSIM can apply to choice. They may or may not go to Blair but they can attend DCC schools. Fact

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is there such a disconnect about the immersion program ending at Westland? In the 8th grade these students receive a certificate of completion. The immersion program does not continue to B-CC. If language immersion is sincerely your interest, any high school should be sufficient. Most kids who complete the program are placed in Spanish 4 or higher and quickly matriculate to higher level and AP spanish courses.

Regarding the IB program, a child at RCFES needs a COSA to attend Westland to complete the immersion program. A approved COSA is for the immersion program, not the MY IB program. It is an added benefit that your child can participate in the MY IB program at Westland.

You would have a stronger argument if you took on points related to the county's lack of support for language immersion through high school. As things stand now, the cluster parents have every right to look at ways to address the overcrowding issue at their schools.

The reason any immersion kids should continue matriculation into BCC is because they are a part of the community. There whole schooling career has been in the cluster, all their friends have been in the cluster, they contribute and donate to the clusters betterment and many sacrifice with long commutes to school, activities and events far from their home. Moving them back will not solve the overcrowding issue.

This is a poor argument. Plenty of kids are separated from their classmates along the way. Think of what happens after second grade at Rosemary Hills - the kids go on to three different schools. Or, how about the schools in the DCC (where you likely live and are trying to avoid), those kids go on to several different high schools. There's really no good reason why immersion kids should get an automatic COSa to BCC.

Of course this is a poor argument. What about the community of your home school cluster? Have you not invested time and energy there? If not, why not? Sacrifice with long commutes to school, activities and events far from home? You call that a sacrifice? I call that a choice.

Families in Immersion of course support the the school their child attends because that is where all the events and activities classmates participate in are located. I do not live near DCC or BCC but the program can only work if kids within it stay together. It's a choice based on a promise made when you sign up that the group will continue on together otherwise no one would sign up but local kids. As an aside I know many Immersion kids whose local school is far better than the Immersion school. I mean really whose dying to go to Sligo, College Gardens or Rolling Terrace. It's the program that attracts families not the Highschool over 10 years away.

This is factually incorrect. The other immersion programs work and the kids do NOT stay together after middle school. Many, MANY people sign up - not just local kids - and every year all of the immersion programs have waitlists.

The Spanish immersion program is the ONLY language immersion program that has this trajectory through high school established. And it makes no sense, particularly given overcrowding issues.

Look, I live in the DCC and would love to have a guarantee of BCC for my kids' high school as opposed to the crapshoot we have here. I've spent my kids' entire school careers maneuvering to get them into this, that and the other magnet (successfully thank goodness). I understand why people might want a guarantee of Westland and BCC. I completetly understand. But that doesn't make it fair or rational or defensible.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do any other immersion programs feed all the way through high school?

Yes they do... SSIM can go to Blair, chinese go to Churchill.

Not true. SSIMS immersion kids go to their home high school or whatever magnet admits them. They do NOT go to Blair.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is there such a disconnect about the immersion program ending at Westland? In the 8th grade these students receive a certificate of completion. The immersion program does not continue to B-CC. If language immersion is sincerely your interest, any high school should be sufficient. Most kids who complete the program are placed in Spanish 4 or higher and quickly matriculate to higher level and AP spanish courses.

Regarding the IB program, a child at RCFES needs a COSA to attend Westland to complete the immersion program. A approved COSA is for the immersion program, not the MY IB program. It is an added benefit that your child can participate in the MY IB program at Westland.

You would have a stronger argument if you took on points related to the county's lack of support for language immersion through high school. As things stand now, the cluster parents have every right to look at ways to address the overcrowding issue at their schools.

The reason any immersion kids should continue matriculation into BCC is because they are a part of the community. There whole schooling career has been in the cluster, all their friends have been in the cluster, they contribute and donate to the clusters betterment and many sacrifice with long commutes to school, activities and events far from their home. Moving them back will not solve the overcrowding issue.

You could say that about the French immersion kids finishing at SSIMS, but it doesn't work that way for them (or any other immersion students except the ones at Westland). They go their separate ways.

Your argument makes NO sense.

PP- you are right. No guarantee of blair for kids in immersion program. If you live in DCC, you go through the same high school choice process as everyone else.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do any other immersion programs feed all the way through high school?

Yes they do... SSIM can go to Blair, chinese go to Churchill.

Is this information in writing somewhere? I'm a parent of an immersion student who will eventually go to SSIMS and I have no expectation that DC will continue on to Blair. I didn't even realize that was a possibility. I thought immersion ended after SSIMS and was under the impression that we'd have to look at our assigned home high school and cluster. Just curious.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is there such a disconnect about the immersion program ending at Westland? In the 8th grade these students receive a certificate of completion. The immersion program does not continue to B-CC. If language immersion is sincerely your interest, any high school should be sufficient. Most kids who complete the program are placed in Spanish 4 or higher and quickly matriculate to higher level and AP spanish courses.

Regarding the IB program, a child at RCFES needs a COSA to attend Westland to complete the immersion program. A approved COSA is for the immersion program, not the MY IB program. It is an added benefit that your child can participate in the MY IB program at Westland.

You would have a stronger argument if you took on points related to the county's lack of support for language immersion through high school. As things stand now, the cluster parents have every right to look at ways to address the overcrowding issue at their schools.

The reason any immersion kids should continue matriculation into BCC is because they are a part of the community. There whole schooling career has been in the cluster, all their friends have been in the cluster, they contribute and donate to the clusters betterment and many sacrifice with long commutes to school, activities and events far from their home. Moving them back will not solve the overcrowding issue.

This is a poor argument. Plenty of kids are separated from their classmates along the way. Think of what happens after second grade at Rosemary Hills - the kids go on to three different schools. Or, how about the schools in the DCC (where you likely live and are trying to avoid), those kids go on to several different high schools. There's really no good reason why immersion kids should get an automatic COSa to BCC.

Of course this is a poor argument. What about the community of your home school cluster? Have you not invested time and energy there? If not, why not? Sacrifice with long commutes to school, activities and events far from home? You call that a sacrifice? I call that a choice.

Families in Immersion of course support the the school their child attends because that is where all the events and activities classmates participate in are located. I do not live near DCC or BCC but the program can only work if kids within it stay together. It's a choice based on a promise made when you sign up that the group will continue on together otherwise no one would sign up but local kids. As an aside I know many Immersion kids whose local school is far better than the Immersion school. I mean really whose dying to go to Sligo, College Gardens or Rolling Terrace. It's the program that attracts families not the Highschool over 10 years away.

Anonymous wrote:Do any other immersion programs feed all the way through high school?

Yes they do... SSIM can go to Blair, chinese go to Churchill.