jindc wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Additionally, making daddy and son match is truly only about the ego of the father and placating his emotional needs. Children, teenagers, young adults and adults want to pretty much NEVER think about their parents genitals, right? I mean really, how much do we all daydream about our parents genitals?

While I personally don't give two craps about what people chose to do with this decision, I will say that my DH was NOT circumsized and his father was...and perhaps it's because his father is a complete a-hole, but he was never taught proper care (he had a hard time being potty trained because....foreskin). I think if you did not grow up with certain things, I could SEE how it could be difficult to 'deal' with the other.

And then my DH was circumsized at age 18 and wished it had been done when he was an infant. And unless you've had both foreskin and no foreskin, I don't really think you can comment on the issue. I trust my DH's view, having gone through it (if we have a boy, but we're hoping for a girl!). People really care far too much here about other people's kids penises.

We did not circ and potty trained our kiddo easily around 2 years old, no issues at all. You don't have to retract or do anything to it at all when they are little, in fact, if you retract it forcefully you can hurt them. Our pediatrician says "wash it like a finger" so that is what we do. A college boyfriend of mine had a "botched" circ and too much skin was removed and he has slight pain during erections. He did not get a say in what his parents did. His parents regret it. I don't get why you are so opposed to hearing other opinions on this. Have you ever watched a circumcision? I think if you do this, you should have to watch one first.

jindc wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Additionally, making daddy and son match is truly only about the ego of the father and placating his emotional needs. Children, teenagers, young adults and adults want to pretty much NEVER think about their parents genitals, right? I mean really, how much do we all daydream about our parents genitals?

While I personally don't give two craps about what people chose to do with this decision, I will say that my DH was NOT circumsized and his father was...and perhaps it's because his father is a complete a-hole, but he was never taught proper care (he had a hard time being potty trained because....foreskin). I think if you did not grow up with certain things, I could SEE how it could be difficult to 'deal' with the other.

And then my DH was circumsized at age 18 and wished it had been done when he was an infant. And unless you've had both foreskin and no foreskin, I don't really think you can comment on the issue. I trust my DH's view, having gone through it (if we have a boy, but we're hoping for a girl!). People really care far too much here about other people's kids penises.

Sadly it sounds like your DH was lied to AND physically mistreated as a young boy, which is awful. As all of us here who have intact boys can attest, having a foreskin does NOT make potty training more difficult. There is no special care needed, either - in fact the more it is left alone the healthier it tends to be. It is terrible when parents repeat the myths and mess with his penis to the point that a young boy thinks there is something dysfunctional or bad about his *normal* body -- it seems that this might be what happened to your DH. Either that, or an ignorant doctor recommended a circumcision when it wasn't necessary, as most problems can be cleared up with non-surgical treatment.

In the past, doctors usually recommended regular retraction for cleaning (especially during the diaper phase, which had the added benefit of sticking a torn penis in a dirty diaper), which we now know can cause significant problems as the boy gets older due to repeated tearing of sensitive tissue. Lots of retraction or manipulation can also cause a lot of pain, fear, and unnecessary concern/obsession about the foreskin, resulting in situations like your DH's where the boy/man believes that there is something so wrong with his penis that he must have it surgically altered at some point.

Research might help heal some of your husbands trauma related to his situation, AND would help educate both of you that leaving your son intact could be very normal and healthy for him, despite the problems inflicted on your DH. I am always amazed when adult men say "it was such a horrible experience as an adult, that I'm going to force it on my one day old newborn son". It doesn't make sense. At least your DH, at age 18, was able to consciously understand what was happening to him, receive adequate anesthesia during the surgery, and to take appropriate pain medication afterwards. Doesn't he believe that his newborn son would feel the same sensations as he did?

Anonymous wrote:Additionally, making daddy and son match is truly only about the ego of the father and placating his emotional needs. Children, teenagers, young adults and adults want to pretty much NEVER think about their parents genitals, right? I mean really, how much do we all daydream about our parents genitals?

While I personally don't give two craps about what people chose to do with this decision, I will say that my DH was NOT circumsized and his father was...and perhaps it's because his father is a complete a-hole, but he was never taught proper care (he had a hard time being potty trained because....foreskin). I think if you did not grow up with certain things, I could SEE how it could be difficult to 'deal' with the other.

And then my DH was circumsized at age 18 and wished it had been done when he was an infant. And unless you've had both foreskin and no foreskin, I don't really think you can comment on the issue. I trust my DH's view, having gone through it (if we have a boy, but we're hoping for a girl!). People really care far too much here about other people's kids penises.

Anonymous wrote:How is this automatically dads decision? If we were talking about female circumcision would it be only the moms decision? That doesn't make any sense. It hard to find common ground on circumcision when parents disagree but why should the fathers views trump the mothers? I don't get this argument at all.

Exactly, especially since it is actually the mother who (hopefully) has an intact foreskin.

Additionally, making daddy and son match is truly only about the ego of the father and placating his emotional needs. Children, teenagers, young adults and adults want to pretty much NEVER think about their parents genitals, right? I mean really, how much do we all daydream about our parents genitals?

So, when parents choose to circ for "tradition" sake or "to match", it is only to make dad feel confident that his penis is alright. And if you think on that a few seconds, that is pretty gross, too -- we are going to cut off part of our son's penis to make his dad feel better? Bad, bad choice. Women, make your husbands act like mature men. Refuse to cut your sons to pacify their insecurities (insecurities that they can't even seem to articulate; instead they hide behind stupid statements like "but we should match"). Be kind to them, but don't give in. Your every instinct as a mother is to protect your son; don't let this unncessary cosmetic surgery force you to have to overcome that.

How is this automatically dads decision? If we were talking about female circumcision would it be only the moms decision? That doesn't make any sense. It hard to find common ground on circumcision when parents disagree but why should the fathers views trump the mothers? I don't get this argument at all.

3:07: I like your take on this, and agree!

Anonymous wrote:I agree totally. This is Dads decision, in my mind.

And I would circ the third son if you did the other two. Yes, it will be a big deal amonst the three of them.

My DD's have size A, C, and DD breasts. While it is not a huge deal, kids do notice these differences and compare.

so from this argument; are you planning to offer breast reductions or augmentations?
Serious question.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who will be doing the teasing? What kind of exhibitionist whore will you be raising?

Op here- that's pretty funny!

Also, as a pp claimed, I am not a troll, and think it's kind of weird that posters are always calling troll on controversial topics.

Anyway, I will probably just circ since my husband feels its the obvious choice, but if it were up to me, I wouldn't. Thanks for all the input- and I noticed after I posted a lot of circ posting on the forum... I guess it's a concern for many.

Anymore, most people are either indifferent (doing it just because of perceived social pressure) or radically opposed. Those who vehemently fight FOR circ tend to be trolls....many of the posts here fall into that category (you can spot them from the foul, crass language and ridiculous fake stories, ie "my son dribbles! help!").

Anyway, of all the stories I have ever read about families that choose circ for one boy but not for another, I have never heard of a case where it was regretted. If a child asks you a question about it, it is very easy to say "doctors used to recommend it, and now they don't" and help each child feel good about themselves. For a relatively short period of their lives, your children are part of your nuclear family, but then they go on to live many adult years without ever (I promise!) thinking about the genitals of their siblings. In many families, boys never even see their brothers penises after age 4 or 5 or so. (I can't remember EVER seeing my siblings genitals, even though I'm sure we bathed together as toddlers). Even things that are plainly obvious (say, like noses) are usually not cause for too much concern; siblings tend to realize that they are not going to look identical to each other. Ultimately good parents tend to be positive about all of their children's physical attributes, even when they wind up being different, and work to discourage any teasing about such things.

The bottom line is that when parents know better, they do better. Imagine explaining to your adult son that you knew that there was no need to circumcise by the time he was born, yet you did it just to conform him to his brothers. THAT is what will seem ridiculous to him. ("WHAT, you cut of part of my penis so that I would match my BROTHER?! We aren't talking about cute matching Ralph Lauren polo shirts here, MOM!")

For what its worth, my sons don't match my husband -- and neither my sons (or my husband, lol) have been traumatized by the experience. In fact, I don't think my boys, who have actually seen DH naked plenty of times, have ever noticed the difference.

My husband is circ'd and his brother isn't. They had no issues growing up. My husband looked at me like I was a weirdo for asking him if it ever bothered him that his brother wasn't (or bothered his brother that he was).

My brother wasn't but my dad was. My brother could care less that he is different from my dad.

Anonymous wrote:Who will be doing the teasing? What kind of exhibitionist whore will you be raising?

Op here- that's pretty funny!

Also, as a pp claimed, I am not a troll, and think it's kind of weird that posters are always calling troll on controversial topics.

Anyway, I will probably just circ since my husband feels its the obvious choice, but if it were up to me, I wouldn't. Thanks for all the input- and I noticed after I posted a lot of circ posting on the forum... I guess it's a concern for many.

Anonymous wrote:i don't understand why that makes sense. why shouldn't the mother have a say in whether her child's body is going to be cut or not?

Anonymous wrote:My own feeling is mothers get no say in this one if Dad feels strongly one way or another.

Exactly. I'm a mom and I get a say in the medical decisions affecting my son, just as dad has a say in the medical decisions affecting our daughter. FWIW, we did not circumsise our son. He's different than dad but so what. They're going to be different in countless ways. I wouldn't make him be right handed just so they can match. As for teasing, your son's brother's will tease him about many things, maybe this maybe not. Whether or not it will be something discussed in a locker room, I doubt since many more boys are not circumcised than when we were kids. Ultimately, I think the right approach is to assess the medical reasons for doing it and decide if they compel you to do so, if so fine. If not, then don't. We read the medical justifications/studies etc. And were not persuaded that the purported medical reasons warranted the procedure. If our son develops a problem such that he needs it done, then we'll do it--as with any other surgery. (I know many other families in the DC area that took this approach and none of us are anti-medicine, we all vaccinated our kids etc.).

Who will be doing the teasing? What kind of exhibitionist whore will you be raising?

i don't understand why that makes sense. why shouldn't the mother have a say in whether her child's body is going to be cut or not?

Anonymous wrote:My own feeling is mothers get no say in this one if Dad feels strongly one way or another.

just wanted to say good for you!

Teasing is not really a good deciding factor. If he won't be teased about one thing, he'll be teased about something else. That's what kids do.

If he had a big nose, would you get a rhinoplasty just so he can avoid teasing?