Anonymous
Post 04/10/2013 23:42     Subject: Telling grandparents we're not comfortable with them driving the kids anymore
Anonymous wrote:Being direct and truthful is not an issue. You have to do that, out of respect for them.

- So I would start off by saying that you see how they love being with their grandchildren, and that you want to facilitate this as much as possible.
- That you love them both dearly and that you know this will be upsetting for them to hear. That you are sorry for this.
- But that recently DH and yourself have been worried by eyesight/reaction time/whatever it is while driving. Make sure to include for both of them a specific incident, to prove your point!
- Add that of course you can see they still have all their intellect, which is why you feel you can all have a very calm and rational discussion about this.
- Finally, say that DH and yourself have come to the conclusion that the children will now be driven by yourselves. Suggest new routine of sleepovers here.

If they can see that you care for their well-being and sincerely want their relationship with their grandchildren to continue, then it will greatly ease the pain.


This is what we did (actually, DH did it). At the time the ILs were in their late 70s and I was increasingly feeling as if my kids were getting into a car with a drunk driver behind the wheel. We couldn't allow it any longer.

The ILs were upset but it blew over. Although we have tried to faciliate visits by driving the kids, taking them to X place to meet the ILs, etc., bottom-line, it pretty much put an end to the ILs' outings with them. Which is sad, but not sadder than a horrible car accident for which I would never forgive myself (had it happened and had I said nothing).
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2013 22:24     Subject: Re:Telling grandparents we're not comfortable with them driving the kids anymore
I feel like I have a handle on how the second half of the conversation would go (logistics, me offering to drop kids off, etc.) but I'm so afraid of simply starting the conversation. This is the start of something way bigger. It breaks my heart. They live in a huge house further out. They come into Chevy Chase, Bethesda, DC, all the time for doc appointments. How far away are we from telling them they shouldn't be driving at all? Is this conversation the precursor to the "sell your house and get a condo in Chevy Chase next to the Barlow Bldg where all your various doc appointments are"?


PP here who's BTDT with a parent - You're right to start thinking about what comes next. It's possible, although not likely, that they will welcome starting the conversation. But either way, you need to start planning, ideally earlier than we did (only after my dad lost his license.) There are ways to keep people in their own home even without a car; we found a nonprofit agency through the state/local council on aging that would send a driver for whatever specified time my dad needed (for a fee). But it's just not the same as having the independence to go where you want, when you want. It actually helped us all see that we needed to be thinking about the next step, which in our case was a move to a retirement community where he can live now independently and stay even when/if he declines. My dad still thinks of himself as a youngish guy, and I think we preferred to keep thinking of him in the same terms, and as someone who had made it through the death of a spouse and was doing pretty well. But honestly if you're talking late 70s, these are not young people, and you need to start looking at what the options are when driving or other vital functions become too difficult and/or dangerous. It's a lousy part of life to be honest, especially if you have young kids to deal with as well. The upside is that when you have a plan that works, everyone is happier and healthier in the long run.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2013 22:20     Subject: Telling grandparents we're not comfortable with them driving the kids anymore
Anonymous wrote:How do I even begin this conversation with my inlaws? My hands shake just thinking about it.

They are in their late 70s. MIL and FIL are equally bad in their own ways. Kids are 1 and 3. We see them 1-3 times a week. They take our oldest either on little outings or for sleepovers about 1x/week. This will be a HUGE change. They don't work and their grandchildren are their entire lives.

For a number of reasons, the conversation will have to involve me, if not come solely from me. I have a great relationship with them and feel just as close as if they were blood to me. However, MIL cand be "difficult" and I'm at a loss how to approach this.

I have concerns about their ability to competently care for my kids and this is the tip of the iceberg but its the first step.

This will be the first "aging/competence" discussion anyone has ever had with either of them about anything.

Your husband needs to man up and tell them.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2013 21:32     Subject: Re:Telling grandparents we're not comfortable with them driving the kids anymore
My DH won't let his mother drive our kids and she is not at all declining. She's in her 60's and is very healthy and as alert as she ever was. She's just a careless driver. She gets into scrapes, drives too fast for the road, and nearly every time we're in the car with her she's slamming her brakes because she didn't see someone's brake lights or she's cutting someone off, etc. She's just a terrible driver and I don't like to be in the car with her myself. So I told DH under no circumstances would she be driving our kids, and to his credit he said there was no way he'd ever, ever consider letting her. BTW, i really wish she'd hang up her keys, as she is a menace to others, but she is definitely of sound mind and an adult, so what can we do?
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2013 21:15     Subject: Telling grandparents we're not comfortable with them driving the kids anymore
Anonymous wrote:Thanks everyone. I know it might sound odd, but I do have a good relationship with my inlaws. I'm more rational and level headed than DH (not saying much) and my delivery would probably be more effective. Also, I'm a SAHM and definitely more connected with the kids and their routines, including their routines with the inlaws. It would be very obvious that this would be coming from me, regardless of who the messenger was. I feel like I owe it to them to have the conversation face to face with them and not use DH as a straw man. For example, DH hasn't been around for some of the concerning incidents and it would be obvious that he would be bringing up concerns on my behalf.

I feel like I have a handle on how the second half of the conversation would go (logistics, me offering to drop kids off, etc.) but I'm so afraid of simply starting the conversation. This is the start of something way bigger. It breaks my heart. They live in a huge house further out. They come into Chevy Chase, Bethesda, DC, all the time for doc appointments. How far away are we from telling them they shouldn't be driving at all? Is this conversation the precursor to the "sell your house and get a condo in Chevy Chase next to the Barlow Bldg where all your various doc appointments are"?

I know my childrens' safety comes before all else. But my sympathy and guilt and confrontation-avoidance is a close second.



You sound like a kind, empathetic person. And you are right that this is probably just the first of a series of difficult conversations on the topic. But trust your gut. This is for the safety of your kids, and down the line for the safety of your in laws and everyone else they encounter on the road. It's the right thing to do.

In the meantime, take comfort in your good intentions and your love for them. Your in laws may be upset or angry, but they know you and they know how much you care for them. This will likely be a painful conversation, but you have years of history and experience together that tell them you love them. So maybe that's the place to start. Tell them point blank that you love them and that it hurts you to tell them this, but . . . .

Good luck!
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2013 21:07     Subject: Telling grandparents we're not comfortable with them driving the kids anymore
Anonymous wrote:No matter how you approach this, they are going to be upset, so I think going in with low expectations is key.

I think it needs to be both you and DH, so there are no questions about how they react or what they say, and you can make sure everything is clear.

Be direct: "We're no longer comfortable with you driving Larla and Aiden. We still want you to see them as much as possible, and we're willing to make that happen, though that may change a bit."

When they pushback on why: "There have been a few incidents. We're just not comfortable with it anymore." Keep repeating that basic line. Don't get into it more than that or you'll spend the whole conversation with them picking apart your reasoning.When they pushback on scheduling: Have some specific ideas about how things they do now can still be done or done with some modifications.

If they completely blow up and say you can't tell them what to do, they're just fine, etc...realize you may have to back off on one-on-one visits for awhile if you don't trust that they still won't drive your kids while the kids are there, just to show you.


This, this, THIS!!!

I've been down this road with my parents. There was no example we could give that would have convinced them it was time to stop driving the grandkids. Close call? We're being overly dramatic. Accident? Someone else's fault. etc.

I know my parents, and I know how they deal with things like this. So I did not give examples. I did not refer to incidents. I just said we're not comfortable with it anymore and we would be doing the drop offs and pick ups from now on. I also said we would be happy to meet them places for outings with the kids.

They were not happy about it, of course. And they periodically ask if we've changed our mind. But in the end, without examples to pick apart or argue about, the conversations have gone quickly. I held firm with "this is what we think is best" and that was that.

This is obviously very painful for everyone involved, I know. Good luck!
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2013 20:25     Subject: Telling grandparents we're not comfortable with them driving the kids anymore
Thanks everyone. I know it might sound odd, but I do have a good relationship with my inlaws. I'm more rational and level headed than DH (not saying much) and my delivery would probably be more effective. Also, I'm a SAHM and definitely more connected with the kids and their routines, including their routines with the inlaws. It would be very obvious that this would be coming from me, regardless of who the messenger was. I feel like I owe it to them to have the conversation face to face with them and not use DH as a straw man. For example, DH hasn't been around for some of the concerning incidents and it would be obvious that he would be bringing up concerns on my behalf.

I feel like I have a handle on how the second half of the conversation would go (logistics, me offering to drop kids off, etc.) but I'm so afraid of simply starting the conversation. This is the start of something way bigger. It breaks my heart. They live in a huge house further out. They come into Chevy Chase, Bethesda, DC, all the time for doc appointments. How far away are we from telling them they shouldn't be driving at all? Is this conversation the precursor to the "sell your house and get a condo in Chevy Chase next to the Barlow Bldg where all your various doc appointments are"?

I know my childrens' safety comes before all else. But my sympathy and guilt and confrontation-avoidance is a close second.

Anonymous
Post 04/10/2013 20:04     Subject: Telling grandparents we're not comfortable with them driving the kids anymore
My DH was able to tell his parents himself. They would not have liked to hear it from me. Families are not all the same.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2013 20:04     Subject: Re:Telling grandparents we're not comfortable with them driving the kids anymore
Anonymous wrote:DH needs to be INCLUDED is this conversation - but you need to be there as well to support all of them. These are his parents and I guarantee that it is 10x as difficult for him as it is for you. Asking him to do this by himself would be unfair and cruel. And I say this to all the "Let the DH handle it" posters.

In our case, we were direct and we also did not make it JUST about the kids. After all, we care about the GP's safety too. "Mom and Dad, we are concerned about your safety. We noticed X the last time you drove and we realize that the drive to our place is tough (a lot of winding roads, hills, etc.). From now on, we will just bring DC's to you." My FIL took it in stride, my MIL cried like a baby and my DH was heartbroken. But once the routine kicked in, they realized that they were not missing any time and that it was easier on them.

GL


Direct and also kind.

Also OP, at what point are you and DH concerned enough for your ILs and other drivers that you think they shouldn't drive at all? Maybe PPs will weigh in with their experiences in that situation.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2013 19:52     Subject: Telling grandparents we're not comfortable with them driving the kids anymore
Ugh, no way I'd let my mother drive my daughter. She scares the crap out of me when she drives at night or on the highway and she's not that old. Luckily she lives out of state. I really feel for you OP.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2013 19:40     Subject: Telling grandparents we're not comfortable with them driving the kids anymore
This is a hard one. My MIL drives my dd but they do not go more than a mile from her house so I am okay with it. If I felt this needed to be changed..this would be a conversation my husband would have ..def not me. There is something about a DIL laying down the law..I wouldn't do that. If this was me and after the "talk" was had. I would be committed to driving out to restaurant and making myself scarce so they have that time. Alone time with a grandparent is priceless. I used to go on adventures with my grandmother and I still think about it.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2013 17:50     Subject: Re:Telling grandparents we're not comfortable with them driving the kids anymore
DH needs to be INCLUDED is this conversation - but you need to be there as well to support all of them. These are his parents and I guarantee that it is 10x as difficult for him as it is for you. Asking him to do this by himself would be unfair and cruel. And I say this to all the "Let the DH handle it" posters.

In our case, we were direct and we also did not make it JUST about the kids. After all, we care about the GP's safety too. "Mom and Dad, we are concerned about your safety. We noticed X the last time you drove and we realize that the drive to our place is tough (a lot of winding roads, hills, etc.). From now on, we will just bring DC's to you." My FIL took it in stride, my MIL cried like a baby and my DH was heartbroken. But once the routine kicked in, they realized that they were not missing any time and that it was easier on them.

GL
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2013 17:32     Subject: Telling grandparents we're not comfortable with them driving the kids anymore
Agree that your DH should be the one having this conversation.

I'd stress the ways that they will still be able to do things with the kids. Can they take the bus/metro still with the kids? Find places where they could walk?
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2013 16:48     Subject: Telling grandparents we're not comfortable with them driving the kids anymore
I was older (junior high?) when this became an issue with my grandparents, and I was the one to tell my mom that I would no longer ride with my grandfather - that if we were going anywhere with them, my mom or dad would need to drive. Turned out my parents were already wondering if there was an issue, but had the same doubts, OP. My point being, if you're thinking it, it's probably past time to address it. Some of the PPs had good ideas (15:20 in particular). And like several said, this needs to come primarily from your DH, not you. Both of you can be there for the conversation, but he needs to do the talking.
Anonymous
Post 04/10/2013 16:32     Subject: Telling grandparents we're not comfortable with them driving the kids anymore
I posted earlier today on the dementia thread elsewhere on these boards. But this issue was actually the first step in our effort to get a handle on my dad's decline. The big difference was that he was not local, so it was only relevant when we went to visit. Still, it was difficult - we basically just told him that we would be driving his car for him whenever we were together from here on out. And we never ever deviated from that, even when it posed inconveniences. We were direct but not hostile/confrontational, and he actually seemed to appreciate the chance to sort of make light of it all. In retrospect I think he was happy that someone was concerned about his welfare, and happy that we weren't pushing the issue further.

Fwiw, this was about 3 years before we had him assessed, and his license was revoked. We were still in denial in a lot of ways, and you should think hard about where you are going from here - the truth is that if they are not safe to drive your kids, they are not safe to drive period. Clearly a lot of people stay in denial about this stuff for a long time, including me, but you do start to look at elderly drivers a little differently after dealing with this stuff.... good luck!