Anonymous wrote:It always amazes me how one person has so much free time to spend trying to drag Marshall through the mud.

Why is sharing information about the school "dragging it through the mud"? Is every discussion of Marshall supposed to begin and end with a Marshall parent touting the US News ranking? I think you protest too much. It seems like every other school-related post on the VA Public Schools forum lately is about Marshall, and every other post on the Real Estate forum is about Pimmit Hills, which is zoned for Marshall. I know I didn't start these threads, so perhaps you like the attention.

It always amazes me how one person has so much free time to spend trying to drag Marshall through the mud.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:2012 SATs - Langley (1812), McLean (1755), Madison (1730), Marshall (1702)

Fall 2012 National Merit Semifinalists - Langley (13), McLean (11), Madison (9), Marshall (8)

Jay Matthews/Washington Post Regional Challenge Index - McLean (14), Madison (15), Langley (16), Marshall (54)

US News/State of Virginia Rankings - Marshall (3), McLean (4), Langley (6), Madison (8)

GreatSchools - Each receives a "9" on a 1-10 scale.

Percentage of Students Receiving Free/Reduced Lunch - Langley (1.55%), Madison (8.60%), McLean (10.18%), Marshall (16.75%).

Percentage of Students With Limited English Proficiency - Langley (1.70%), Madison (4.25%), McLean (6.35%), Marshall (10.71%).

What this data shows is that Marshall does a phenomenal job of educating all of their students. Even with a higher percentage of FARMS and ESL students, their SAT scores are very comparable.

I think that would probably read too much into the data. The percentage of seniors at Marshall in 2012 who took the SAT (81.8%) is also lower than the percentages at McLean (86.9%), Langley (87.2%) and Madison (90.3%), which is what you'd expect at a school with higher percentages of FARMS and ESL students. SAT scores may tell you more about the family backgrounds of the students who take the SATs than it does about how well the schools educate them in any event, but the SAT scores at Marshall certainly don't tell you how well Marshall educated the almost 20% of its 2012 graduates who didn't take the SATs. I think what the Marshall scores probably tell you instead is that most students who go there and take the SATs score do about the same as they would have at Langley, McLean or Madison, but the averages get pulled down a bit because the school has a higher percentage of students (some of whom may be FARMS or ESL students) who do take the SATs, but may not be able to afford things like SAT prep courses or quite as academically proficient.

However, if you want to get into data trends at Marshall, most of them are favorable, as the school is still reaping the benefits (in terms of increases in enrollment and improving test scores) of the robust job market near Tysons and the high-end residential construction in the area.

Anonymous wrote:2012 SATs - Langley (1812), McLean (1755), Madison (1730), Marshall (1702)

Fall 2012 National Merit Semifinalists - Langley (13), McLean (11), Madison (9), Marshall (8)

Jay Matthews/Washington Post Regional Challenge Index - McLean (14), Madison (15), Langley (16), Marshall (54)

US News/State of Virginia Rankings - Marshall (3), McLean (4), Langley (6), Madison (8)

GreatSchools - Each receives a "9" on a 1-10 scale.

Percentage of Students Receiving Free/Reduced Lunch - Langley (1.55%), Madison (8.60%), McLean (10.18%), Marshall (16.75%).

Percentage of Students With Limited English Proficiency - Langley (1.70%), Madison (4.25%), McLean (6.35%), Marshall (10.71%).

What this data shows is that Marshall does a phenomenal job of educating all of their students. Even with a higher percentage of FARMS and ESL students, their SAT scores are very comparable.

2012 SATs - Langley (1812), McLean (1755), Madison (1730), Marshall (1702)

Fall 2012 National Merit Semifinalists - Langley (13), McLean (11), Madison (9), Marshall (8)

Jay Matthews/Washington Post Regional Challenge Index - McLean (14), Madison (15), Langley (16), Marshall (54)

US News/State of Virginia Rankings - Marshall (3), McLean (4), Langley (6), Madison (8)

GreatSchools - Each receives a "9" on a 1-10 scale.

Percentage of Students Receiving Free/Reduced Lunch - Langley (1.55%), Madison (8.60%), McLean (10.18%), Marshall (16.75%).

Percentage of Students With Limited English Proficiency - Langley (1.70%), Madison (4.25%), McLean (6.35%), Marshall (10.71%).

Anonymous wrote:Let it go, lady. The ranking stands. If there was an error, it will be corrected next year.

This is not exactly an Olympic competition, so the idea of a flawed ranking "standing" doesn't mean much. It could be screwed up again next year. All it means is that US News tries to rank many thousands of high schools and gets some of it wrong. With any model, "garbage in, garbage out."

I simply don't understand why some Marshall parents lead with their chin by touting a ranking that most know is based on flawed data, when there is accurate information out there that also portrays the school in a positive light. The only explanation that comes to mind is that some have such a big chip on their shoulder where Langley, McLean and Madison are concerned that they will jump on anything that makes Marshall look better. Whenever I point out the error in the US News data, I get chided for caring enough to do so, but no one has ever shown that the information assumed by US News (the 99% IB participation rate) is actually correct.

With the IB programme, you can get an IB diploma. With AP, you just take as many AP courses as you want in the areas that interest you. There is no "AP diploma" as such.

If you commit to the full IB diploma programme (you won't know until after you've graduated from HS whether you've done well enough on the IB exams to get the diploma), that looks great on college applications. Otherwise, I've heard that you're better off taking a handful of AP courses than a few IB courses when applying to schools.

Among local schools in FCPS with IB programs, most don't really have many full IB diploma candidates. Marshall does a much better job in that regard than most.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hey, OP, sorry your thread got hijacked! To answer one of your initial questions, kids who do well in IB need tob e excellent writers, as there is a lot of emphasis on that in every class, including STEM courses. The IB exams taken during senior year all nearly all essay. Students need to be self-starters with a drive to succeed, and to be organized and able to manage multiple long term projects and deadlines. It also helps if your child has high tolerance for stress.

I have one child who earned the IB diploma, and one who just took IB courses in the things he liked best and excelled at. I thinks it's a great program, and Marshall is an excellent high school. (In fact, it was ranked 3rd in VA, behind TJ and Marshall and AHEAD of McLean and Langley.)

Just as added food for thought: is your child interested in IB in order to prep for college, or to get college credits? I think IB does a better job prepping kids for analysis and creative thought. AP is a better choice if you want credit for all of the college-level classes your kid takes, because most colleges on grant credit for IB claases that are 2 years long. See the multiple threads here on that issue!

This again? Sigh. The reason why Marshall got ranked ahead of McLean and Langley by US News was that a primary input to the US News rankings was student IB/AP participation rates. For Marshall, US News incorrectly assumed a 99% IB participation rate, and substantially lower AP participation rates at McLean and Langley. IB participation at Marshall has never been anywhere near 99%, either this year or in prior years:

https://p1pe.doe.virginia.gov/reportcard/report.do?division=29&schoolName=1392

http://schoolprofiles.fcps.edu/schlprfl/f?p=108:17:2629891184551281:::0_CURRENT_SCHOOL_ID:070 (reporting enrollment in IB classes last year for 11th and 12th graders ranging from 40.9 percent for Hispanic students to 74.0 percent for white students).

If you think this is sour grapes, feel free to do so. But the Washington Post "Challenge Index" is also designed to reflect participation in IB and AP courses, and Marshall scored lower in last year's ranking of area schools (#54) than either McLean (#14) or Langley (#16).

http://apps.washingtonpost.com/local/highschoolchallenge/schools/2012/list/local/

If you're interested in the IB program at Marshall, I'd say "go for it," but check to make sure they are honest with the facts about the program. It used to be a place that cared more about the kids than rankings, but some parents and administrators there care more about rankings now than getting the facts straight.

Let it go, lady. The ranking stands. If there was an error, it will be corrected next year.

Anonymous wrote:Hey, OP, sorry your thread got hijacked! To answer one of your initial questions, kids who do well in IB need tob e excellent writers, as there is a lot of emphasis on that in every class, including STEM courses. The IB exams taken during senior year all nearly all essay. Students need to be self-starters with a drive to succeed, and to be organized and able to manage multiple long term projects and deadlines. It also helps if your child has high tolerance for stress.

I have one child who earned the IB diploma, and one who just took IB courses in the things he liked best and excelled at. I thinks it's a great program, and Marshall is an excellent high school. (In fact, it was ranked 3rd in VA, behind TJ and Marshall and AHEAD of McLean and Langley.)

Just as added food for thought: is your child interested in IB in order to prep for college, or to get college credits? I think IB does a better job prepping kids for analysis and creative thought. AP is a better choice if you want credit for all of the college-level classes your kid takes, because most colleges on grant credit for IB claases that are 2 years long. See the multiple threads here on that issue!

This again? Sigh. The reason why Marshall got ranked ahead of McLean and Langley by US News was that a primary input to the US News rankings was student IB/AP participation rates. For Marshall, US News incorrectly assumed a 99% IB participation rate, and substantially lower AP participation rates at McLean and Langley. IB participation at Marshall has never been anywhere near 99%, either this year or in prior years:

https://p1pe.doe.virginia.gov/reportcard/report.do?division=29&schoolName=1392

http://schoolprofiles.fcps.edu/schlprfl/f?p=108:17:2629891184551281:::0_CURRENT_SCHOOL_ID:070 (reporting enrollment in IB classes last year for 11th and 12th graders ranging from 40.9 percent for Hispanic students to 74.0 percent for white students).

If you think this is sour grapes, feel free to do so. But the Washington Post "Challenge Index" is also designed to reflect participation in IB and AP courses, and Marshall scored lower in last year's ranking of area schools (#54) than either McLean (#14) or Langley (#16).

http://apps.washingtonpost.com/local/highschoolchallenge/schools/2012/list/local/

If you're interested in the IB program at Marshall, I'd say "go for it," but check to make sure they are honest with the facts about the program. It used to be a place that cared more about the kids than rankings, but some parents and administrators there care more about rankings now than getting the facts straight.

Anonymous wrote:... I thinks it's a great program, and Marshall is an excellent high school. (In fact, it was ranked 3rd in VA, behind TJ and Marshall and AHEAD of McLean and Langley.)

I saw that, too! http://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/virginia

Hey, OP, sorry your thread got hijacked! To answer one of your initial questions, kids who do well in IB need tob e excellent writers, as there is a lot of emphasis on that in every class, including STEM courses. The IB exams taken during senior year all nearly all essay. Students need to be self-starters with a drive to succeed, and to be organized and able to manage multiple long term projects and deadlines. It also helps if your child has high tolerance for stress.

I have one child who earned the IB diploma, and one who just took IB courses in the things he liked best and excelled at. I thinks it's a great program, and Marshall is an excellent high school. (In fact, it was ranked 3rd in VA, behind TJ and Marshall and AHEAD of McLean and Langley.)

Just as added food for thought: is your child interested in IB in order to prep for college, or to get college credits? I think IB does a better job prepping kids for analysis and creative thought. AP is a better choice if you want credit for all of the college-level classes your kid takes, because most colleges on grant credit for IB claases that are 2 years long. See the multiple threads here on that issue!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why would anyone assume those idiots were from Marshall? Every article says Vienna and Madison is 100% Vienna.

I'm not sure it's particularly relevant to the IB program at Marshall, but some of those kids do live in the Marshall HS district. Madison is not 100% Vienna (part of Oakton goes to Madison), and Marshall's boundaries include most of Vienna/22182 and part of Vienna/22180 outside the Town limits.

How does anyone know where these kids live?

These kids want others to pay attention to their pranks. It's not a closely guarded secret among local kids or parents where they live, go to HS, or film their videos.

How about we get back to the OP's question about the IB program?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why would anyone assume those idiots were from Marshall? Every article says Vienna and Madison is 100% Vienna.

I'm not sure it's particularly relevant to the IB program at Marshall, but some of those kids do live in the Marshall HS district. Madison is not 100% Vienna (part of Oakton goes to Madison), and Marshall's boundaries include most of Vienna/22182 and part of Vienna/22180 outside the Town limits.

How does anyone know where these kids live?

Anonymous wrote:Why would anyone assume those idiots were from Marshall? Every article says Vienna and Madison is 100% Vienna.

I'm not sure it's particularly relevant to the IB program at Marshall, but some of those kids do live in the Marshall HS district. Madison is not 100% Vienna (part of Oakton goes to Madison), and Marshall's boundaries include most of Vienna/22182 and part of Vienna/22180 outside the Town limits.

Many, many thanks to 07:43! Do you have a child there? I.e., can I ask you follow-up questions?