Anonymous wrote:


I guess we are not good parents after all, we live in a tiny TH in the City of Falls Church, and can't be happy more! Would never move further for a bigger house. And our best friends are even worse - they live in an apartment in DC. Sure, they don't want "a good life for their kids"

I never said that those who make the choice to live in an apartment/condo or TH didn't want a good life for their kids. It's just one of the trade offs that people make to live in this area. I said that there aren't any options for single family homes close in, which is what we wanted after living in a small TH for several years. Please don't read into this that I think families who make that choice are doing a bad thing for their families. We made our choices and trade offs, you made yours. Neither one is better than the other.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem with this area is that it's just too damn expensive for middle class families.

No real argument there (I'm almost-moved-to-Austin poster). The cost of living hurts some, but it is possible to carve out a decent life here - you just have to make trade offs. We're making about the Fairfax median income as a two-income family, and we have very few options for single family homes. There is NOTHING close in, unless you want to do condo and TH living forever - yeah, no thanks. However, even living 20 miles from the city like we do in Western Fairfax, we have a pretty decent life. It isn't an upscale neighborhood, but it is full of middle class families who want a good life for their kids. We can get to the city if we need to, but Fairfax County has LOTS of great amenities for kiddos, so you don't have to go downtown for entertainment - it's just nice to know it is there.

If my husband were in a field that was less specialized, we probably wouldn't stay here because it does hurt when you really are stuck with the housing costs taking such a huge bite out of your budget. Our mortgage is about 30% of our monthly take home, but it just is and we deal with it because we have to. His career just doesn't exist elsewhere.

Now, making less than $100K HHI is even more limiting, so if that is what you mean by middle class (which is what it is in other parts of the country), then I truly do understand the pain. My PT job cut me back to less than half my normal hours over the summer, so we were budgeting on my husband's $90K at-the-time salary, so it made things REALLY tight. Had to be much more frugal, and cut our usual monthly savings for a few months. You do need to be much more conscious of where your money is going, but again, it can be done, it just is more of a challenge.

I guess we are not good parents after all, we live in a tiny TH in the City of Falls Church, and can't be happy more! Would never move further for a bigger house. And our best friends are even worse - they live in an apartment in DC. Sure, they don't want "a good life for their kids"

Look for great college towns. U. of Indiana, U. of Michigan, U. of Wisconsin, U. of Massachusetts, etc. would be great places to start.

Anonymous wrote:I have done extensive research on this, because we have many options for relocating eventually. Most cities have sub-par public schools, with maybe one or two pricey neighborhoods where schools are decent. Some cities have close-in suburbs that are walkable and have good schools. Some cities you have to go way out to the cookie cutter burbs to find good schools (and these are the ones I've crossed off my list).

Places that might work are:
St. Louis (close-in burbs with character; lots of family activities; good COL; public transit options)
Minneapolis (close-in burbs; good parks; homes with character; not sure about public transit)
Denver (close-in burbs, though a few city hoods have good schools; good parks; public transit stinks)
Portland (close-in burbs; good parks; homes with character; good public transit)

There aren't many options. DC actually has what you're looking for, but it comes with a hefty price tag.

I'd love to see a list like this but add in a warm climate (or maybe coastal) requirement. Any ideas?

Anonymous wrote:The problem with this area is that it's just too damn expensive for middle class families.

No real argument there (I'm almost-moved-to-Austin poster). The cost of living hurts some, but it is possible to carve out a decent life here - you just have to make trade offs. We're making about the Fairfax median income as a two-income family, and we have very few options for single family homes. There is NOTHING close in, unless you want to do condo and TH living forever - yeah, no thanks. However, even living 20 miles from the city like we do in Western Fairfax, we have a pretty decent life. It isn't an upscale neighborhood, but it is full of middle class families who want a good life for their kids. We can get to the city if we need to, but Fairfax County has LOTS of great amenities for kiddos, so you don't have to go downtown for entertainment - it's just nice to know it is there.

If my husband were in a field that was less specialized, we probably wouldn't stay here because it does hurt when you really are stuck with the housing costs taking such a huge bite out of your budget. Our mortgage is about 30% of our monthly take home, but it just is and we deal with it because we have to. His career just doesn't exist elsewhere.

Now, making less than $100K HHI is even more limiting, so if that is what you mean by middle class (which is what it is in other parts of the country), then I truly do understand the pain. My PT job cut me back to less than half my normal hours over the summer, so we were budgeting on my husband's $90K at-the-time salary, so it made things REALLY tight. Had to be much more frugal, and cut our usual monthly savings for a few months. You do need to be much more conscious of where your money is going, but again, it can be done, it just is more of a challenge.

12:51 here. For after your kids grow up, there is tons of entertainment for you. The Fox Theatre, Powell Symphony Hall, Sheldon Concert Hall, Music Festivals, Riverport, and The Pageant always have great shows going on. There are all kinds of restaurants to try, neighborhoods to explore, endless beer festivals, and the second largest Mardi Gras in the country. You certainly won't be bored.

St. Louis has everything you're looking for. Off the top of my head, the FREE attractions for kids includes the St. Louis Zoo (internationally recognized), Science Center, Art Museum (sometimes has classes), History Museum (great for transportation), fountain parks, festivals, outdoor plays in the summer. The paid attractions would include the Magic House, City Museum, Arch, Riverboats, Botanical Gardens, Butterfly House, Faust Carousel, and Transportation Museum. There are endless options for schools, including specialty charters (performing arts, technology, international studies, etc), numerous Catholic, several private. Neighborhoods are diverse. I grew up in historic Soulard in a large house built in 1881. Much of my family is from South St. Louis, and the rest is from Kirkwood/Webster. West county has great new homes and public schools, while the city has fantastic architecture, restaurants, and attractions. If you enjoy sports, you'll be right at home with the Cardinals, Blues, Rams, and the miscellaneous college rivalry games we host. Check out explorestlouis.com

Anonymous wrote:The problem with this area is that it's just too damn expensive for middle class families.

Can't agree more

The problem with this area is that it's just too damn expensive for middle class families.

I think the DC area is definitely an area that caters to kids...

And personally I think I have the rest of your things in Arlington esp. in Orange line neighborhoods from Rosslyn to Ballston. The area is very walkable, Metro for all the complaints is great transit system. The museums are free, and there are tons of kid-focused parts of those museums. Great activities/festivals, etc.

Anonymous wrote:I think NYC and nw DC have those qualities now. Boston as well.

Plus one!
I am happy to be raising my kids in Washington DC Metropolitan area. You can find anything you want here. I take them to theaters twice a month as I am a true theatergoer. There are plenty of nice parks around. Free museums! Plenty of sport activities. My kids do soccer, hockey, ballet and basketball. My calendar is full until summer! All I wish I had more money to do stuff with my kids...
And yes, I am happy with my kids' public schools!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


You know, Austin hasn't come up as a potential relo spot for us (we've had mostly "big city" options so far), so I haven't done much research on it yet. I had always assumed it would work for us, because of the nice housing stock and the managable size of the city.

we have family in TX, so that is why we looked there. It is the most laid back, liberal part of TX - I think the university being there helps with that. The schools have their issues, but there are areas of town with good schools. They have a magnet school for the Austin City students that is ranked in the top 100 nationally, and many of the suburban HS's are also in the top 100 or so (Westlake and the schools just North of Austin come to mind). It is also a rather outdoorsy place - lots of parks that they are quite proud of, including Town Lake. There are also the music festivals that bring people from all around the country.

Unfortunately for us, my husband is in a fairly specialized field of defense/security contracting that just doesn't exist in Austin (better known for IT). The jobs in TX for him would be in San Antonio, Fort Hood or some other backasswards military town that I have no interest in moving to. So, since we couldn't come to an agreement on a telework option for my husband and he isn't an IT guy, we stayed here.

We're actually trying to get back to Denver, but we consider other options as they pop up. Austin seems like it has a lot of the things going for it that we liked about living in Colorado. Unfortunately, the more desirable the city, the harder it is for us to move there. Our current options are Omaha and Fort Worth. We're passing.

Anonymous wrote:


You know, Austin hasn't come up as a potential relo spot for us (we've had mostly "big city" options so far), so I haven't done much research on it yet. I had always assumed it would work for us, because of the nice housing stock and the managable size of the city.

we have family in TX, so that is why we looked there. It is the most laid back, liberal part of TX - I think the university being there helps with that. The schools have their issues, but there are areas of town with good schools. They have a magnet school for the Austin City students that is ranked in the top 100 nationally, and many of the suburban HS's are also in the top 100 or so (Westlake and the schools just North of Austin come to mind). It is also a rather outdoorsy place - lots of parks that they are quite proud of, including Town Lake. There are also the music festivals that bring people from all around the country.

Unfortunately for us, my husband is in a fairly specialized field of defense/security contracting that just doesn't exist in Austin (better known for IT). The jobs in TX for him would be in San Antonio, Fort Hood or some other backasswards military town that I have no interest in moving to. So, since we couldn't come to an agreement on a telework option for my husband and he isn't an IT guy, we stayed here.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have done extensive research on this, because we have many options for relocating eventually. Most cities have sub-par public schools, with maybe one or two pricey neighborhoods where schools are decent. Some cities have close-in suburbs that are walkable and have good schools. Some cities you have to go way out to the cookie cutter burbs to find good schools (and these are the ones I've crossed off my list).

Places that might work are:
St. Louis (close-in burbs with character; lots of family activities; good COL; public transit options)
Minneapolis (close-in burbs; good parks; homes with character; not sure about public transit)
Denver (close-in burbs, though a few city hoods have good schools; good parks; public transit stinks)
Portland (close-in burbs; good parks; homes with character; good public transit)

There aren't many options. DC actually has what you're looking for, but it comes with a hefty price tag.

what was your opinion on Austin? We almost moved there and were pleased with our options, although there were drawbacks as well. We were only looking at certain neighborhoods and schools, though.

I think this area is as close to the sweet spot as you can get. Lots of options for kids, decent public transport, good public schools in the burbs (with options in DC proper). We consider ourselves pretty lucky, honestly. And we don't even live in the most sought after/expensive neighborhood, but our public schools in our pyramid are still award winning.

You know, Austin hasn't come up as a potential relo spot for us (we've had mostly "big city" options so far), so I haven't done much research on it yet. I had always assumed it would work for us, because of the nice housing stock and the managable size of the city.

Portland, or. Tons of kids activitiea, kindie music scene, extremely bike friendly including for kids, magnet schools for the arts, environment etc. Good mass transist, esp the closer in to downtown you are, progressive.