Anonymous wrote:I'll go:
Fairfax Co elementary school. Doors locked during the day. You ring a doorbell and are buzzed right in. You are then supposed to go to Office to sign-in. HOWEVER, nobody asks who you are, what you want, etc. prior to buzzing you into the Office. The last part really disturbs me---esp after today.

I just got off the phone with my cousins that are teachers in Connecticut, and my retired Aunt. Their school system you have to state your name and be identified BEFORE they will unlock the door. I am not saying that would prevent what happened today--but it seems like a much better policy.

I was coming in today at 2:30 to volunteer and I was standing in the shadow of a woman in front who buzzed, immediately door clicked open and we walked in. I HATE this and going to ask Principal about it.

I could have written this post. Is that you JT? This is JD. I am thinking about taking up this issue with the school. Perhaps we should get a group of parents together.

I don't want to give the name of the school, but all four schools in my small Texas town (yes, I'm not one of you DC people, but fascinates by you and generally like the forum so visit regularly). We had a "shelter in place" small scale shooting incident in 2004 that made our district decide to up the security.

Each of the four schools in my town (Elementary, Intermediate, Jr. High, High School) have the same equipment and precautions.

I'll explain how my DD Elementary school works. All doors are (titanium) locked from the outside at all time, the front door has a keypad and speaker with camera. Teachers and faculty present badge ID into machine, which on locks the door into main office. When students enter or leave the building it's always with adult who has ID. Mduring drop-off parents are not allowed in because of too much foot traffic, all kids go to gym till 8:00 am. Two doors are unlocked at pick up, front that goes by office is unlocked and children being picked up by parents go out front, bus riders out side with 1 teacher/adult to every 18 students.

To access the school during day you must go through front doors, into office. The office only has one door that leads to the commons of the school, it is locked and the only way to open it is if a button is pressed which is under the office desk. When picking up a child you wait in the waiting room, no one goes into the commons unless they have gone through a background check and are on a computerized list of "ok" and have an appointment or reason. Trust me, many were unhappy at how strict, we don't do as many parties, and lunch with kid is not allowed, you have to take them out. However, today I bet no one complained.

Only the High School and Jr. high have metal detectors, really we are pretty secure. Although a faculty/staff member could go nuts, or someone could break into a window. Honestly, sometimes I don't think it matters. If some crazy motherfucker wants to go into a school and kill 5-year-olds a locked door isn't going to stop him.

An early on the scenes reporter was reading Sandy Hook's security letter-to-parents posting from earlier in the school year. It was much more impressive than what my kids' schools are currently doing. It required a buzz-in; then facial recognition by someone at the front desk; and holding up a school ID tag. The letter went on to state that there are some 1500 kids at the school so they asked parents to be patient if someone at the front desk didn't immediately respond and go thru the procedure.

Now we know that the shooter took his mother's own licensed guns, shot her, then went the school. It's possible that the school got lax, gave him facial recognition, and let him it. It's also possible he used him mom's school I.D. - we don't know yet and may never know. It's just a terrible tragedy.

What I can offer to the discussion is the fact that our K-8 started a buzz-in policy right after 9-ll. Very easy to implement because the school had only one entrance. But the gal at the front desk didn't want to be bothered so the locking, buzz-in, and sign-in all dropped off shortly after being implemented.

In sharp contrast, my son's small Catholic school had a very good buzz-in, sign-in-, sign-out system.

Again, in sharp contrast, our local public high school does nothing. I was walking all over its halls just last week looking for DS and encountered some 100 students and adults and not one person asked who I was or what I was doing there. I have a concealed carry permit but know I cannot carry a firearm on school grounds - but think of what I could have done if I had wanted? I'm going to have a talk with the principal on Monday. This high school also claims to have two armed and uniformed police officers on site at all times but neither my husband nor I have ever seen them.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Showing ID and signing in will hardy deter a gunman set on suicide.

Again-- don't unlock the door in the first place!

You keep missing the fucking point. This guy would have got in with his connections--but why not keep the lunatics to a minimum. If he starts shooting through the front door or even gets violent there will be time for the police to get him.

Yeah- let's do fucking nothing.

Our school automatically buzzes ANYONE in immediately. They do t use the intercom, do facial recognition or ask any ?s. you do that shot before you let anyone in the school- not after. Again- this guy had connections that next freak may not.

Anonymous wrote:Showing ID and signing in will hardy deter a gunman set on suicide.

Again-- don't unlock the door in the first place!

You keep missing the fucking point. This guy would have got in with his connections--but why not keep the lunatics to a minimum. If he starts shooting through the front door or even gets violent there will be time for the police to get him.

Yeah- let's do fucking nothing.

Showing ID and signing in will hardy deter a gunman set on suicide.

Anonymous wrote:There are ways to circumvent all of these policies. The better idea is to deal with the gun issue.

Totally agree--but that isn't happening anytime soon.

In the meantime- I'm more worried about copycat freaks.

I never said it would have prevented what happened- but it could prevent freaks with no ties to the schools from walking in and doing it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If Walmart can hire greeters to stand by the doors- why aren't our schools doing the same?

Nobody should be walking into a school sight unseen without being checked for weapons. It sucks that our society has degraded to this level, but its where we are and safety should come ahead of convenience.

Little old ladies in wheel chairs? Who wouldn't be terrified?

Some of them can be pretty scary.

But my point was obviously that having someone whose only job is to greet people/check for weapons seems like a pretty attainable thing that could make a big difference if applied consistently to everyone, every time.

There are ways to circumvent all of these policies. The better idea is to deal with the gun issue.

The issue is that in this case it was a relative of a teacher at the school. There would need to be a ban on anyone not working at the school to avoid allowing relatives or parents.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is against fire code to only have one door that opens. This is also bad policy just waiting for a catastrophe.

I think the PP means one door that opens from the outside or is unlocked. Others would open from the inside but not outside. Our office building has multiple doors that have no handles allowing entry from the outside but they do have push bars inside so they are exits from inside

Yes. All our school's doors open from the inside---but are locked when schools in session to those on the outside. However, a lot of good it does when they buzz anyone in without question. Ugh.

I like Prince William's concept of hanging onto a Driver's license. Hell---I even needed to hand one over for a locker rental yet anyone can freely move around my kids school without official ID being looked at--much less held until departure.

Oh--and playing tag is too dangerous---but buzzing the door for anyone to come in is not. Give me a break.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is against fire code to only have one door that opens. This is also bad policy just waiting for a catastrophe.

I think the PP means one door that opens from the outside or is unlocked. Others would open from the inside but not outside. Our office building has multiple doors that have no handles allowing entry from the outside but they do have push bars inside so they are exits from inside

Yes. All our school's doors open from the inside---but are locked when schools in session to those on the outside. However, a lot of good it does when they buzz anyone in without question. Ugh.

I like Prince William's concept of hanging onto a Driver's license. Hell---I even needed to hand one over for a locker rental yet anyone can freely move around my kids school without official ID being looked at--much less held until departure.

In my children's Prince William schools all doors are locked and you can enter only through the office. You are signed in and not allowed to go anywhere in the building without handing over your driver's license which is run through the Raptor security system. I visit my children's schools regularly to volunteer and I am held to the same security standards as anyone else. You also cannot pick up your child for early dismissal without handing over your license to have it compared to the emergency card to make sure your information matches.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is against fire code to only have one door that opens. This is also bad policy just waiting for a catastrophe.

All the doors open going out of the school in a locked school. Somebody can't get in them. I don't have to hit release to leave the locked front doors of our elementary school.

Think again....

If the doors are chained, you cannot open them from the inside. I have seen schools with some doors with chains.

Anonymous wrote:It is against fire code to only have one door that opens. This is also bad policy just waiting for a catastrophe.

I think the PP means one door that opens from the outside or is unlocked. Others would open from the inside but not outside. Our office building has multiple doors that have no handles allowing entry from the outside but they do have push bars inside so they are exits from inside