Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I feel biased so I didn't answer your question. But I do want to suggest picking up a copy if "The Goid School," by Peg Tyre. It's about how to get your child the best education possible, regardless of the type if school - public, private, parochial, charter, home school, etc.

One of the things it mentions is class size. Statistically, it doesn't matter much at all, other than for kids K-3rd grade, when it is better to have smaller class sizes. But the author warns against paying for private school to get the ratio down. Apparently the class has to be as small as 12-17 kids to be helpful. And I'm not sure if the "top" privates around here have such small classes. In other words, don't pay $30,000 to reduce class size from 28 to 20.

My son had 12 kids in his class and we don't pay anywhere clost to $30,000.

That's great. But that's not what I'm warning against. Many of the top private schools around DC have large class sizes in the younger grades. I was pretty shocked to see posts on here stating Sidwell Friends has 25 in a kindergarten class. I have no clue if it's true or not, but if it is, I'd think twice before choosing it over an MCPS elementary.

So if that's your primary motiviation for going private, it may not be worth the $$ to get a slightly smaller class size. The real difference, statistically, doesn't really show up unless there are fewer than 17 in a class. It's just one thing of many to take into consideration when trying to get the best education for your child. It's not the only thing.

Most of the private schools in the area that we looked at have 18 or fewer students per class with two teachers. More importantly, most of these schools group the kids into smaller classes (ours is 5-8 students) for reading and math. Our MoCo elementary school currently has 27-28 kids per K class with 1 teacher and do not get special grouping for any lessons.

I don't know anything specific about Sidwell, but even if they have classes of 25, I'm sure they have 2 teachers and in the very least, break the class into groups of 12/13 for core subjects, so you are effectively getting smaller classes. At least that's what the one school we looked at with classes over 18 does.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I feel biased so I didn't answer your question. But I do want to suggest picking up a copy if "The Goid School," by Peg Tyre. It's about how to get your child the best education possible, regardless of the type if school - public, private, parochial, charter, home school, etc.

One of the things it mentions is class size. Statistically, it doesn't matter much at all, other than for kids K-3rd grade, when it is better to have smaller class sizes. But the author warns against paying for private school to get the ratio down. Apparently the class has to be as small as 12-17 kids to be helpful. And I'm not sure if the "top" privates around here have such small classes. In other words, don't pay $30,000 to reduce class size from 28 to 20.

My son had 12 kids in his class and we don't pay anywhere clost to $30,000.

That's great. But that's not what I'm warning against. Many of the top private schools around DC have large class sizes in the younger grades. I was pretty shocked to see posts on here stating Sidwell Friends has 25 in a kindergarten class. I have no clue if it's true or not, but if it is, I'd think twice before choosing it over an MCPS elementary.

So if that's your primary motiviation for going private, it may not be worth the $$ to get a slightly smaller class size. The real difference, statistically, doesn't really show up unless there are fewer than 17 in a class. It's just one thing of many to take into consideration when trying to get the best education for your child. It's not the only thing.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a SN child and was counseled to stay in public for more SN resources. I was told I would have to pay additional fees for private tutoring to help my dyslexic child keep up. The school would not provide that type of help.

Our private school charges for these extra services, and they are not nearly as comprehensive as they are at the local public. So for SN, I'd look at public.

I would agree if the child is LD/GT. but if you child is just dyslexic then they only have to make sure they are not failing out of their on grade classes.

If you want a dyslexic child in more challenging classes than the lowest common denominator then public may not be best either way you have to pay for private tutoring.

Anonymous wrote:I have a SN child and was counseled to stay in public for more SN resources. I was told I would have to pay additional fees for private tutoring to help my dyslexic child keep up. The school would not provide that type of help.

Our private school charges for these extra services, and they are not nearly as comprehensive as they are at the local public. So for SN, I'd look at public.

I have a SN child and was counseled to stay in public for more SN resources. I was told I would have to pay additional fees for private tutoring to help my dyslexic child keep up. The school would not provide that type of help.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are also in MoCo and our public elementary feeds into one of the best public high schools in the area, but we have decided to send our DD to private school (at least for the early elemetary years). Top private/independent schools have low student to teacher ratios so kids get more attention (we feel this is very early for young children). There are also more time and resources available for movement, PE, arts, music, language, science classes at the private schools, because private schools are less pressured to spend a lot of time preparing their studens (at least in the early years) for standardized exams. Finally, top private/independent (such as Sidwell, Beauvoir, GDS, Maret) have very competive admissions process (they are very unlikely to admit kids with potential learning diabilities, behavioral problems, average to low IQ scores, or not ready for school due to lack of maturity of understanding of English language) so they end up admitting a very select group of very brigh and school ready kids.

I agree with some of what you said - low teacher/student ratios in particular. But, I disagree about the private school "competitive admission process" essentially weeding out kids with issues. The majority of people I know who leave good public schools in favor of private do so because the child has a special need that is not being addressed in the public. This can be anything from extreme shyness, inability to sit still/concentrate in class, mild learning disability, behavior or sensory issues, etc. The reason that low teacher/student ratio is important enough for parents to pay $$$ for school is often b/c they believe their child has issues that demand more teacher time. You could be disappointed or surprised if you think that private school classrooms don't include these students. That said, private school can remove or counsel-out really disruptive students, but just a cursory look at other threads on this topic will show how difficult that can be when the student is a child of privilege, board member, legacy, etc. Sometimes these are the most disruptive of all. No place is perfect, so you have to look at everything and make the best decision with the information you have.

Just curious: What is your sample size, when you say the majority of people you know who leave good public schools for privates do so because their kid has special needs? And what is your direct experience with private schools that leads you to draw conclusions about children of privilege, board members, etc.?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another thing I would mention is that private schools usually have a head of admissions whereas public schools do not so they do not 'advertise' as well I think. My neighbor was all concerned because she didn't get a good sell from the staff on the public school and ended up being one of the main reasons for choosing private. I'm sure now that she's in private she's glad her taxpayer dollars aren't going toward the staff spending time advertising the school. Just because the school isn't fawning all over you, doesn't mean it's a bad school. They just don't have the resources to cater as much to new parents and instead focus their efforts on the students already there.

This has got to be one of the most absurd reasons for choosing private over public.

I agree but a friend of mine made the same argument to me. She wanted her son to go to a place that really appeared to want him. Our local public is great, but is nearly at capacity and frankly doesn't care if it gets one additional student, but the private she chose stood to gain her $25K tuition if she chose them. Of course the private will fawn more. Silly reason.

Both my kids shadowed at our Bethesda public high school when they were looking at school options and they could not have been nicer about it. The principal met with both of them personally. They actually do want the kids coming from private school and seemed to go out of their way to facilitate that. And I am not sure I would say the competitive private schools fawn over applicants. In fact many on this board argue quite the opposite.

Anonymous wrote:We are also in MoCo and our public elementary feeds into one of the best public high schools in the area, but we have decided to send our DD to private school (at least for the early elemetary years). Top private/independent schools have low student to teacher ratios so kids get more attention (we feel this is very early for young children). There are also more time and resources available for movement, PE, arts, music, language, science classes at the private schools, because private schools are less pressured to spend a lot of time preparing their studens (at least in the early years) for standardized exams. Finally, top private/independent (such as Sidwell, Beauvoir, GDS, Maret) have very competive admissions process (they are very unlikely to admit kids with potential learning diabilities, behavioral problems, average to low IQ scores, or not ready for school due to lack of maturity of understanding of English language) so they end up admitting a very select group of very brigh and school ready kids.

I agree with some of what you said - low teacher/student ratios in particular. But, I disagree about the private school "competitive admission process" essentially weeding out kids with issues. The majority of people I know who leave good public schools in favor of private do so because the child has a special need that is not being addressed in the public. This can be anything from extreme shyness, inability to sit still/concentrate in class, mild learning disability, behavior or sensory issues, etc. The reason that low teacher/student ratio is important enough for parents to pay $$$ for school is often b/c they believe their child has issues that demand more teacher time. You could be disappointed or surprised if you think that private school classrooms don't include these students. That said, private school can remove or counsel-out really disruptive students, but just a cursory look at other threads on this topic will show how difficult that can be when the student is a child of privilege, board member, legacy, etc. Sometimes these are the most disruptive of all. No place is perfect, so you have to look at everything and make the best decision with the information you have.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another thing I would mention is that private schools usually have a head of admissions whereas public schools do not so they do not 'advertise' as well I think. My neighbor was all concerned because she didn't get a good sell from the staff on the public school and ended up being one of the main reasons for choosing private. I'm sure now that she's in private she's glad her taxpayer dollars aren't going toward the staff spending time advertising the school. Just because the school isn't fawning all over you, doesn't mean it's a bad school. They just don't have the resources to cater as much to new parents and instead focus their efforts on the students already there.

This has got to be one of the most absurd reasons for choosing private over public.

I agree but a friend of mine made the same argument to me. She wanted her son to go to a place that really appeared to want him. Our local public is great, but is nearly at capacity and frankly doesn't care if it gets one additional student, but the private she chose stood to gain her $25K tuition if she chose them. Of course the private will fawn more. Silly reason.

DS is at a private. When people ask why, they think they already know, but I think they are unprepared for one of the most basic reasons. He's very average. He isn't a star in anything. That's fine with us, but he wouldn't have as many opportunities in public. What I mean is, he not great at sports, so in public he would never make a team. At his private everyone makes the team. It means he can play. He isn't the best in math, so he wouldn't be in the best math class in public. In private the class is small so his teacher sees when he is struggling and works with him until he understands, so he doesn't get away with hiding in the back row and pretending to understand. Same with English. He is forced to pay attention so he has to work harder and he does better. It is better for a kid like him.

This is the best reason and best value:cost ratio for private school. Public schools do want high test scores but at the end of the day they don't have the resources or incentives to provide extra help to kids in the middle so that they can achieve their best potential. Public schools are about achieving the schools' overall best potential which means focusing on kids on the lower end of the range to get the scores up. Private schools that only admit the smartest and most independently motivated kids really are selling snake oil when they clam credit for the high SAT scores, and college admits etc. Those kids would do just as well in public school and still succeed at the same, and interesting enough often higher levels.

We go to a very high rated elementary school in MCPS.

The biggest reason to go private IMO is not the larger class sizes. You can have a large class as long as you have lots of teaching assistants and specialist teachers for subjects beyond basic math and reading not just 1 teacher for 80% of the time per 25 kids. MCPS spends more $$ on assessments, staff, and the overhead for the system while private seem to have more flexibility to have more real science, art, drama, music, PE, foreign language, etc etc.

In private, you have more say..to a degree..in working with the administration if your child needs something else or there is a problem or you just want to know more about the school. MCPS is what it is and that's that. There is very little if any parent influence and MCPS really looks as parents as pests to manage and keep at arms length. Public school is great if you want to part of your community and the PTA is fun for getting neighbors and kids together for social events. If you want to be involved with the school and actual education then go private.

Curriculum 2.0 is another reason why private would be better in some ways. We just supplement at home because the math is so basic it is sad. Almost all the parents and a good number of teachers are very frustrated with Curriculum 2.0.

Anonymous wrote:Another thing I would mention is that private schools usually have a head of admissions whereas public schools do not so they do not 'advertise' as well I think. My neighbor was all concerned because she didn't get a good sell from the staff on the public school and ended up being one of the main reasons for choosing private. I'm sure now that she's in private she's glad her taxpayer dollars aren't going toward the staff spending time advertising the school. Just because the school isn't fawning all over you, doesn't mean it's a bad school. They just don't have the resources to cater as much to new parents and instead focus their efforts on the students already there.

This has got to be one of the most absurd reasons for choosing private over public.

Another thing I would mention is that private schools usually have a head of admissions whereas public schools do not so they do not 'advertise' as well I think. My neighbor was all concerned because she didn't get a good sell from the staff on the public school and ended up being one of the main reasons for choosing private. I'm sure now that she's in private she's glad her taxpayer dollars aren't going toward the staff spending time advertising the school. Just because the school isn't fawning all over you, doesn't mean it's a bad school. They just don't have the resources to cater as much to new parents and instead focus their efforts on the students already there.

OP, my kids are at GDS and the overall class sizes are not small. There are 24-26 kids with two co-teachers. They work in half groups for academic subjects so the effective group is 12 or 13 kids. This is very nice as it allows kids a lot of attention from their teacher. Interestingly the homeroom sizes drop as the kids get older.

Anonymous wrote:OP, I feel biased so I didn't answer your question. But I do want to suggest picking up a copy if "The Goid School," by Peg Tyre. It's about how to get your child the best education possible, regardless of the type if school - public, private, parochial, charter, home school, etc.

One of the things it mentions is class size. Statistically, it doesn't matter much at all, other than for kids K-3rd grade, when it is better to have smaller class sizes. But the author warns against paying for private school to get the ratio down. Apparently the class has to be as small as 12-17 kids to be helpful. And I'm not sure if the "top" privates around here have such small classes. In other words, don't pay $30,000 to reduce class size from 28 to 20.

Yes, the classes are smaller, and, yes, it makes a huge difference -- even for a bright, motivated and chatty student. You can't run and hide in a small class. Even if it's not your favorite subject, you have to do the reading or HW every day and be ready to participate.