anything beyond very infrequent little white lies is a deal breaker to me (male).

Anonymous wrote:OP here again: 14:44 that's one kind of lie that drives me crazy. Because he'll say something, and I'll go on the assumption that he's telling the truth, like continuing to look for the thing he's actually thrown out, or wondering if I bought a product already opened. I'll go nuts for a minute trying to remember if I check if the jar was open before I left the store.

For a while I was wondering why all our plants weren't dying. I kept asking him if he watered them. He said no. Anytime I would check the plants, the soil would be wet. Hmm. (this type of thing really messes with my mind). One day I caught him watering the plants. Me: I thought you said you never water the plants? Him: Well, I'm just watering this one because it was dry, and thought I'd water the others while I was at it.

OP, I can smell a compulsive liar a mile away.

But what you are describing sounds a bit to me like minutia that your DH just figures he can white lie about rather than have to get into it with you about why he disagrees with you, or maybe a better way to put some of these instances is when you demand he do something, you stay on his ass like stink on sh*t about it, and he just doesn't want to do it or deal with your nagging, so he white lies about it (yes, honey, I did it! No honey, I didn't do it! And in his head he is thinking "When will she go away or STFU).

I'm not trying to be rude, I'm just being sincere - perhaps this advice will save your marriage/engagement. I would encourage him to be open about when he doesn't feel like doing something or disagrees about what needs to be done.

Anonymous wrote:19:55 here. Well there had certainly been stress - moving twice - job layoff - depression - etc. I hope that was what it was. It was pretty damn weird feeling like I didn't know this person I'd been married to for 20 years. I mean, I get an emotional affair being a shock - many people say that. And I never would have expected that from him either, as he was a very honest, loyal person who believed strongly against that. But on top of that, to change his personality - from women supporter and "pro women" to griping about his wife in a demeaning way, etc.....and I don't think I mentioned that he treated me that way too....acted like I had no right to ask him any questions-even normal ones, bitching at me for having any input about what should be a joint decision, feeling like he should be able to work anytime (evenings/weekends) without even running it by me (in case we had plans) and if he decided to work late, he shouldn't even have to call to give me a heads up.

He's somewhat better now, but not totally himself. Once the friendship with that guy waned, DH got better though not 100% due to some of it being a habit now. We are working on that. I don't trust him though. I still feel like, what is he going to do next if he makes another jerk of a friend? Or likes the attention he is getting from another ex or someone else?

I bet your husband's demeaning behavior had less to do with his friend and more to do with his emotional affair. In order to justify his affair in his own mind, he had to turn you into the bad guy. I think this is a fairly common dynamic when someone has had an affair. It would make even more sense if your husband was normally a good, moral, woman supporting guy because his guilt would be greater and so the defense mechanism would be even more necessary.

19:55 here. Well there had certainly been stress - moving twice - job layoff - depression - etc. I hope that was what it was. It was pretty damn weird feeling like I didn't know this person I'd been married to for 20 years. I mean, I get an emotional affair being a shock - many people say that. And I never would have expected that from him either, as he was a very honest, loyal person who believed strongly against that. But on top of that, to change his personality - from women supporter and "pro women" to griping about his wife in a demeaning way, etc.....and I don't think I mentioned that he treated me that way too....acted like I had no right to ask him any questions-even normal ones, bitching at me for having any input about what should be a joint decision, feeling like he should be able to work anytime (evenings/weekends) without even running it by me (in case we had plans) and if he decided to work late, he shouldn't even have to call to give me a heads up.

He's somewhat better now, but not totally himself. Once the friendship with that guy waned, DH got better though not 100% due to some of it being a habit now. We are working on that. I don't trust him though. I still feel like, what is he going to do next if he makes another jerk of a friend? Or likes the attention he is getting from another ex or someone else?

Not me. But my ex's wife does.

PP could it have been part of some midlife crisis?

I agree with a pp....check into Narcissism, since they are commonly pathological liars. Therapists say they are notoriously hard to treat.

Here's my spousal lying scenario...we are in therapy

A few years ago my DH got very buddy-buddy with a male co-worker (my husband is hetero). This new friend happened to be fairly male chauvinist and not happy with his wife. Multiple times per day, the co-worker friend would bitch about his wife and have a "put down" attitude about her when talking about her and when she called (like eye rolling when she would call and then talk down about how silly her call was when he got off the phone, or what a pain she was....basically always diminishing any concern she had and putting her down for having any concern/question at all). The truth is, even my DH admitted later that many of her calls were fair and valid reasons to call, and that his friend never asked her not to call, and his friend had plenty of time to talk with her. It was like the friend just enjoyed talking crap about his wife and putting her down. Well my husband started doing it too, though maybe a little less intense, but pretty close. The friend would ask him about our relationship and DH would tell him things that were none of his business and were about our difficulties, or things he didn't like about me, etc. It was kind of like an emotional affair only without sexual attraction, as the boundaries were down and DH would not stop telling him things I explicitly asked him not to. In fact, it was like the friend was in our relationship too. Well, DH would lie and say he wasn't doing that anymore even though he still was....over and over again. The lying was the worst. Oh and about the same time he did have "too much contact" (daily contact) with an ex-girlfriend and lied about that too, and covered that up, repeatedly. It was at the very least too much contact with her, and maybe an emotional affair.

Still struggling with all of that. Aside form the "emotional affair" of "too much contact with the ex and the lying around that, which is obvious why that is bothersome, I was really stunned my his male chauvinist-like attitude bitching about me and going along with his friend. DH is very "pro women" and has never been like that before (known him 20+ years) so it was a shock for him to say those things and act that way about me, and to go along with his friend that way (Also DH is not usually a follower). Anyone have similar experiences?

My DH lies about little stuff, but it really bugs me. I never lie to him about anything, ever. I am not a liar, generally, but I was raised to tell "white lies" and I do tell those sometimes. I do it because I want to make people feel better, even though I always feel badly, because I'm lying. "That is such a pretty haircut," I'll say, even though I think it would look great on a troll. "I love your shoes," I say, though they make you look like a prostitute. DH "forgets" he ate my leftovers, and fails to remember that he didn't do things I told him to do. He grew up in an abusive family where the children were blamed for the parents' bad behavior, so he has an automatic defense mechanism buried so deeply, he doesn't even know it's there. I have spoken with him about this, and he has gotten better, but he's not completely cured, and I don't think he ever will be. I hear him lie to people to flatter them, and I cringe, but at some level, I know he's trying to make them feel good. My DHs lies don't seem to rise to the level of pathological lying, but they have continued throughout our marriage, and I don't like them, despite his good intentions, and despite the fact that I tell "white lies" when necessary (as little as I can, but it comes up). No advice here, OP, just a little empathy. Marriage without trust is a failed marriage, so it's best to tell your DH what his behavior means, and urge him to get help before it ends your marriage.

He absolutely lies at work too. I wouldn't be hocked if it catches up to him someday. Get your ducks in a row, ask him
to go to therapy.

OP,
This sounds like a disorder. It's one thing to lie about transgressions (not acceptable of course but there's a point to not getting caught) but about things like watering the plants? Bizarre. I agree that therapy is in order.