PP, this is before the recent Euro Debt issues

Negative Annualized Stock Market Returns for the Next 10 Years or Longer? It's Far More Likely Than You Think


By: Mike Shedlock | Mon, Feb 7, 2011

http://www.safehaven.com/article/19917/negative-annualized-stock-market-returns-for-the-next-10-years-or-longer-its-far-more-likely-than-you-think

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From what I have seen only the SUCKER everyday folks leave their money in 401k as the market tank and gains. The only people making money are the traders that go in and out at the dips and climbs especially with computer trading. Feels like a ponzi scheme. On top of that some instiutions are so big they can artificially create dips and gains in the market luring the little guys in and out to stell their money. HORRIBLE. I don't get how the stock market isn't seen as a huge scam against everyone except the rich and big trading companies.

We have over a million in our 401(k)s, even though we are "SUCKER everyday folks." How much money do you have?

how did you have before the last 10 years? 2 million

Anonymous wrote:From what I have seen only the SUCKER everyday folks leave their money in 401k as the market tank and gains. The only people making money are the traders that go in and out at the dips and climbs especially with computer trading. Feels like a ponzi scheme. On top of that some instiutions are so big they can artificially create dips and gains in the market luring the little guys in and out to stell their money. HORRIBLE. I don't get how the stock market isn't seen as a huge scam against everyone except the rich and big trading companies.

We have over a million in our 401(k)s, even though we are "SUCKER everyday folks." How much money do you have?

Anonymous wrote:I haven't lost any and neither have you if you haven't withdrawn it.

This. But that said, I have had a 2% 1 yr personal rate of return, 3% 3 yr personal rate of return and 0% 5 yr rate of return. I "lost" $$ spectactularly in 2008-2009 - my portfolio basically halved itself. It's since made up all of that loss - so, yay. Last quarter was pretty bad, but October zoomed back ahead. What the heck do you expect when the government goes to the brink with debt ceiling negotations? When the Europeans are dithering over their own debt crises? The market reacts to these issues, although it appears to be getting back to business now. I only look for fun, and then to rebalance in January. I don't plan on retiring for another 20 years, so here's hoping that some growth occurs between now and then!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've made 7.66% this calendar year so far. What are you in?

A gambler only talk of his winnings. What is your 4 years rate of return or

I don't know and I don't care. I've been invested for over a decade and have more than 20 years until I need any of my 401(k) money. Who cares what my 4 year ROI was or is? How is it possibly relevant?

If you took the advice of so called fincial advisors or fund managers and invested in their 401k 10 years until retirement plan you would be screwed because the ROI wouldn't match up in the performance of the previous 3 -4 year increments.

The 401k system was never designed to take the hits of the dips and gains stock market that have been caused by rapid traders and computer machines of the last 10 years.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've made 7.66% this calendar year so far. What are you in?

A gambler only talk of his winnings. What is your 4 years rate of return or

I don't know and I don't care. I've been invested for over a decade and have more than 20 years until I need any of my 401(k) money. Who cares what my 4 year ROI was or is? How is it possibly relevant?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:be grateful that you didn't start investing when I did (late 2004). I actually have a negative annualized return (-1%). I contribute every single month and have about 7% less than what I put in).

But you've only been in it a few years. I've had a 401(k) for 20 years, and I've made a lot of money over that time period. Think retirement and long time, not only 7 years. Patience.

do you honestly believe that it will continue at the same rate? The market basically went up a massive amount from that time period until 2000, where it dived, we still are not at the same position 11 years a go.

All I know is that my 401(k) is positive since 2000. Of course, I'm a buy and hold investor, and invest the legal max every calendar year.

Anonymous wrote:I've made 7.66% this calendar year so far. What are you in?

A gambler only talk of his winnings. What is your 4 years rate of return or

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:be grateful that you didn't start investing when I did (late 2004). I actually have a negative annualized return (-1%). I contribute every single month and have about 7% less than what I put in).

But you've only been in it a few years. I've had a 401(k) for 20 years, and I've made a lot of money over that time period. Think retirement and long time, not only 7 years. Patience.

do you honestly believe that it will continue at the same rate? The market basically went up a massive amount from that time period until 2000, where it dived, we still are not at the same position 11 years a go.

Anonymous wrote:be grateful that you didn't start investing when I did (late 2004). I actually have a negative annualized return (-1%). I contribute every single month and have about 7% less than what I put in).

But you've only been in it a few years. I've had a 401(k) for 20 years, and I've made a lot of money over that time period. Think retirement and long time, not only 7 years. Patience.

I've made 7.66% this calendar year so far. What are you in?

Anonymous wrote:I'm the PP you copied earlier, OP -- Agree with those who say there *are* crappy 401(k)s. All the more reason to see a qualified financial advisor -- he/she can evaluate your options and suggest either a better mix of funds or a way to still take advantage of your 401(k) -- don't scoff at a 4% match, that's 4% FREE MONEY -- without having to use its crappy fund choices.

Thanks again to you and to the other posters. Unfortunately, I cannot take my money out of the 401K without leaving my place of employment, unless I'm being foreclosed upon. There's no option to withdraw even with penalty except for the aforementioned hardship situation.

Also, it's not that I'm scoffing at a 4 percent match, which of course is less than it was but is better than nothing, but my point about the 4 percent is that, without that, I would be in the red, overall. With it, my investments have basically kept pace. The mix of funds is really limited in our 401K, which is part of the problem. I think what I am starting to consider doing is to simply invest 4 percent, which will at least get matched, and then invest the other portion of my salary that had been going into my 401K into another place, like a Roth or another option. If my company's match goes up, I'll consider tweaking. You're right that we need to see a planner again.

From what I have seen only the SUCKER everyday folks leave their money in 401k as the market tank and gains. The only people making money are the traders that go in and out at the dips and climbs especially with computer trading. Feels like a ponzi scheme. On top of that some instiutions are so big they can artificially create dips and gains in the market luring the little guys in and out to stell their money. HORRIBLE. I don't get how the stock market isn't seen as a huge scam against everyone except the rich and big trading companies.

I'm the PP you copied earlier, OP -- Agree with those who say there *are* crappy 401(k)s. All the more reason to see a qualified financial advisor -- he/she can evaluate your options and suggest either a better mix of funds or a way to still take advantage of your 401(k) -- don't scoff at a 4% match, that's 4% FREE MONEY -- without having to use its crappy fund choices.