We turned down Waldorf and Park to send our children to Friends. We chose Friends because it seemed more diverse than both Waldorf and Park. We have no experience at Waldorf or Park, but our experience at Friends has been wonderful. I think our children are getting a great education. They are smart and talented, but most of the kids at Friends (their friends, at least) are also smart and talented. Friends does not differentiate that much, in our experience, mostly because it doesn't need to. I know a few people who have kids at Gilman, which has a good reputation in Baltimore, but it's not very diverse, and there's lots of attitude among Gilman boys, which turned us off completely, in addition to the single sex thing. Friends gets kids into all the Ivies and most selective colleges, but it is not focused on that, so kids who go there don't necessarily want to end up at those competitive schools. I do not expect my children will go to those schools, but they are still young, and who knows? I'm sure Friends will prepare them well for any school they want to attend, whether it's Harvard or the University of Maryland or anything in between. Friends wants to develop well-rounded kids who are intellectually curious, and who value things we value, like sharing and equality and simplicity. We love the Quaker values of the school (we're not Quaker), and like most Friends parents, just love the school.

I looked at the Greenmount School for my younger child. I liked a lot of what I saw. My major concern was that it was very, very small. I worried that my child wouldn't have a big enough peer group. He ended up at Waldorf instead.

To the Waldorf parent (and any others with direct experience) - may I ask why you chose Waldorf over Friends or Park for elementary school? Thanks.

A good friend of mine has multiple kids at Greenmount. She is generally happy with the education her kids are receiving, but not entirely. One of her DC is extremely gifted and many grade levels ahead in a subject. The mixed aged classes allow some acceleration, but not nearly as much as this child needs; the school hasn't yet found a way to accomodate this DC. Now, it's possible that no private school could accomodate this DC, but for just be aware that the differentiation only goes so far. Also, the "co-op" part of the school, which keeps down the tuition, means that your kids will have random parents as substititutes, for example. On the other hand, my friend pays much less in tuition than many of us.

As long as we're talking Baltimore schools, does anyone know anything about the Greenmount School? (k-8, very progressive, but less expensive than Park and Friends.)

I strongly disagree with the immediately prior post (having had seven years experience as a Waldorf parent and fifteen years experience as a Park parent, and having considered or applied to Friends on at least four separate occasions with two different kids). I have known a LOT of kids who have gone to Waldorf for elementary school and who have then transferred to Friends or Park at some point. (And who have done very well, BTW). If there are things in Park's curriculum that appeal to anyone, and especially for younger children, I strongly recommend considering Waldorf.

I think Waldorf is really in its own league. I would not mention them in the same breath as Park and Friends at all.

... and finally, a lot of people who like Park or Friends also really, really like Waldorf.

Postscript: I posed the question to my older son, the Park alum, about what kind of families would fit in. His statement was that the school was very tolerant - except of intolerance. He added he wasn't sure how comfortable fundamentalist Christian families would feel; when I probed, he agreed that highly observant Orthodox Jewish families might also have issues.

He was surprised that anyone would find Park "less tidy" than Friends (based on his visits to the latter), but I think this more illustrates his selective vision.

We agreed that Park and Friends are more similar than they are different (especially in terms of their communities), and that they appeal to very different people than, say, St. Paul's or Boy's Latin or McDonough...

I wanted a progressive education because I wanted my kids to enjoy learning and to appreciate different perspectives on a problem. Facts become obsolete, and blind memorization of them, or learning "the answer", won't stand you in good stead in the long run. The process of exploring a problem is more important than "the answer". I feel that kids learn better by "doing" rather than by sitting in class taking notes while a teacher lectures or sitting in class reading your history text. (This is just an example of how I was taught history, and explains why I was completely turned off to the topic). At Park, for example, students might engage in debates in history. They might celebrate "Modern Languages Day" by forming small groups to write and act out skits in which the audience is expected to interact. An English project in middle school will involve crafting a "speech" on a controversial topic in which they have to acknowledge multiple sides of the matter. In lower school they might form small companies and enter into a classroom competition to see who can design the strongest bridge - while mastering business and design skills. Kids really become engaged in the material.

I will say that the political hues at both Park and Friends are pretty liberal. This was perfectly fine with us as we're that way ourselves. I do know at Park they do try to value all opinions; they had, for example, a "Young Republicans" club in the upper school at one point (which my older son joined in order to hone his debating skills). My older son also especially enjoyed the "Student-Faculty Forum" in which a controversial topic was debated each week between students and faculty. An education is so much more than just having as many facts as possible crammed into your brain...

For example, I appreciated the number of openly gay teachers at Park. No need to hide in the closet, especially now with a gay head of school. It's not a place where homophobia, racism, or religious bigotry would be tolerated. (And lest you think that's true anywhere, I should tell you about some of the shenanigans I've seen team members from other schools - or their parents - pull over the years...).

The days are pretty structured in the lower and middle schools. I happened to like the relatively loose structure of the school day in the Upper School. Kids who were on a team could still participate in their sport, but weren't precluded from participating in other activities, as many met during the "free" blocks between classes. It meant that homework was never assigned one day to be due the next - great if your kid had a music lesson after an away game with little time left for homework. It meant that my kids have been able to pursue a wide array of activities, further enhancing their personal growth.

As far as tidiness goes, I rank that as very low on the list of things I'd be concerned about. My younger son's last school was tidy, and anything but chaotic, but he was bored out of his mind with the style of teaching. He did not enjoy school at all. Whereas now he'll come home and tell me about the interesting things they did in some class.

What type of families would fit in... I would like to say "most or all", because the school does foster an atmosphere of tolerance and is aggressively seeking to increase its diversity. I think anyone who comes to the school with no fixed agenda and an open mind would fit in.

Ultimately, I think both Park and Friends are pretty similar with respect to the sorts of families they attract and the values they hold. That was important to me, as I wanted our values to be shared by the families of my children's classmates. Although they aren't as incredibly competitive (at least in today's economy) to get into as I've heard some of the schools in NY and DC are, they're still competitive, and I'd apply to both and see what happens.

On the other hand, if a generally liberal social or political agenda is going to be irksome to you, there are other schools you might prefer. Gilman (possibly/probably harder to get into), Boy's Latin, Calvert, St. Paul's, McDonough are all more conservative. (The first two are all-male, the last three are either coed or have boy's and girl's divisions). If you want something even more liberal or green than Park (yes, it's possible!), check into Waldorf (also more structured). (Waldorf is an especially good option for younger kids - elementary or even middle school. Waldorf will also be very unlike any other school you've ever visited, and you may find it an especially intriguing option).

PP, why did you want a progressive education? What type of families would fit in at Park. I like the school but we are not liberal or green and I must admit that sometimes I cringe when my kids come home spouting out green or very liberal ideas. My kids are pretty young and are in a somewhat progressive school now and I do not care what they think about these issues as long as it is their thoughts vs. a school or teacher.

I really liked the school but was a little concern with the kids ability to leave things everywhere, it seemed a little chaotic and not too tidy. Is this your experience? I could really appreciate the difference in the classroom interactions between student and teacher at this school. It is not like any other school that I visited. It also seemed very hands on which I loved. I have young kids and really appreciated Park for the High School years but I was not sure about elementary and middle school.

Meant to add: on "differentiation". Neither Park nor Friends offers AP classes. In my experience this is an advantage. Teachers are not forced to "teach to the test". That being said, many students do elect to take AP exams (and do very well). Colleges actually view it as a plus if the kids take the AP exams and do fine not having had an official "AP class". Shows they're willing to go the extra mile.

Park prides itself on "differentiated instruction", which (roughly translated) means that kids can opt to complete different sorts of projects to demonstrate their mastery of material they've been studying. It's not all "exams" or "term papers". For example, my kids like to write; one of my kids opted to write a sequel to "Animal Farm" in middle school, based on the Chinese Revolution (instead of on the Russian Revolution). Another opted to write a prequel to "Merchant of Venice". But in different grades you'll see kids preparing board games, or posters, or memorizing a monologue from a play, or constructing a wooden model of the sort of Greek ship used by Ulysses... again, not all "papers or exams".

Park does offer different "tracks", beginning in middle school with math. By high school, students can also be placed in accelerated science, language, or history. If kids have particular talents (e.g., math), they may even be encouraged to skip a grade in math (and take just that one class with older kids, remaining classes with their peers).

Park has a reputation for REALLY teaching kids to write. I don't know how universally true that is, but certainly I have no complaints.

Lots of emphasis on "design your own experiments" in middle school science, not pursuing canned ones. That's the way science should be taught.

Oh, and I don't think it's any harder to get in during "off years". A lot depends on the existing size of each class and on its male:female ratio. The current edition of the school newspaper, the Postscript, has an article on how they're currently processing a second wave of applications. It's available from the school's website.

My older son graduated recently from Park, and now attends a "highly selective" liberal arts college. He had a great time at Park - the teachers really stretched him, and he learned A LOT. Even though he's at an excellent college, he has come to recognize the outstanding teaching he had at Park. More to the point, though - he made a great group of friends there, all good kids who stick up for each other and who all stayed away from any sort of inebriated party scene. Got to play on two varsity teams even though he is not an "Athlete" with a capital A. (Warming the bench as a walk-on in DIII at the moment). Immersed himself in a huge variety of extracurricular activities, from the nerdy to the performing arts.

My younger son is currently in the Upper School at Park (started in the middle school). He applied to both Park and Friends. We gave him his choice of where to attend, but secretly hoped for Park, because we value the "progressive" education there (yes, it IS progressive, something we appreciate) and felt the style at Friends was less creative, too much "sage on a stage". He has found a great peer group at Park. It's fine there if you're not an Athlete but instead you're kind of nerdy. At many schools he'd be able to sit in the back row and earn straight A's on the basis of his written work and tests. At Park he knows he has to participate in class if he wishes to do well. It's good for him.

Park works hard to provide financial aid. That being said, with the economy being what it is, it's tough to provide as much as everyone might need. Children of teachers get free tuition. Many students receive some financial aid. My sons have not found themselves with only "uber-rich" kids to hang out with.

We've heard stats about the prevalence of alcohol and other drugs at Park vs other independent schools that make us feel as if Park's approach is much more effective in preventing abuse than many of the other independent schools around here.

Learning issues like dysgraphia - I do know one kid who left Park in lower school for this reason (parents felt he wasn't getting enough support and was struggling). Don't know whether Friends would be any better, no experience there. You might be reliant on what you could arrange on your own. I was not overly impressed with my efforts to secure support in "executive function" issues, so went "outside".

It's not the school for everyone. The kids who thrive, do so because they're self-motivated. The teachers set them on fire. But they don't beat on the kids who aren't self-motivated. I tell people that Park students are given a long leash. You can go a long ways with it if you're a "student", or you can slack off (effectively hang yourself with it) if you're not. You have to be honest about what sort of individual your child is. I've known teachers to walk away from the free tuition because it wasn't working well for their kids.

Any other thoughts re: Friends? Anyone know of a similar forum for Baltimore schools?
Thanks.

I knew a family with a son at Park and nobody noticed that his horrible handwriting stemmed from a terrible pencil grip. Once they finally complained that his poor handwriting was not acceptable, they said the parents had to send him to a private OT. I babysit for him once or twice and noticed it right away and I was a teenager at the time, not a teacher.