Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well DH and I save and invest separately - spender (him) and saver (me).

Early 40s - I have 15x my income saved and invested (excluding significant home equity and $600k in 529 plans). About 50% of that is separate property (pre-marriage investments that I kept separate) and the other 50% of technically marital property, but that's only relevant if we get a divorce - I control it as long as we are married, and it's part of my estate.

DH is older and only has 3x saved.

Story of a spender versus a saver.

Whoa, 600k in 529s? I'm assuming you have 3 kids? I am also a saver but that's a very high number especially with your savings rate and investment property, you have many means of funding college for your kids.

It is weird to me how antagonistic you are towards your husband and the degree to which you keep your finances separate. My DH and I also have different financial personalities -- I'm more conservative and a saver, he's more risk taking and a spender. But we combine everything and I actually like how our tendencies balance each other out. We have way more total money saved/invested because of my influence -- I insist on high percentages of automatic savings and investing out of our income, and I don't allow lifestyle creep when we get raises, so the money builds up fast. But my husband's greater capacity for risk is why it's grown at a higher rate. I would have much more of our money in ordinary savings were it not for his influence, and we would have missed out on massive gains in recent years. Also he makes sure we actually enjoy life, take real vacations, and reminds me that there's no prize for living like a pauper. We balance each other out and both come out ahead.

Good for you guys. It doesn't work that way for us, but we have complex family situations and conflicting priorities and values over money, so we both prefer to keep things separate. In some ways, we still balance each other out, as we have plenty of nice vacations and lifestyle creep whenever my spouse gets a raise or has a liquidity event. However, the money I save is for retirement, college, and emergencies only. Period. If I didn't lock it up and secure it, then it would already be spent. I realized this within the first 5 years of our marriage, and I stopped getting angry or trying to change my spouse; instead, I changed myself.

$600k is for 2, but 1 is almost nearing college and wants to get an aviation degree, so we'll definitely spend the first half between tuition and flight training. The other one keeps talking about medical school. Doubt we oversaved.

How you calculate it can vary based on how close you are to retirement. If you are within 15 years of retirement, I agree with PPs that it makes more sense to estimate how much you need and then figure out how much you should have invested in order to draw down your required retirement income at a sustainable rate.

However, going by multiples of income is totally fine if you are younger and retirement is still way off. Estimating your financial needs in retirement is really hard until 45-50, IMO. But it was around that time that certain things clicked into place, including having college funding fully figured out, and getting a better sense of what our housing needs would be.

Finances when you are 35 or 40 are very different from what they will be in retirement. At that age, a significant portion of my income was going to mortgage and childcare, plus we were saving aggressively in order to trade up to a larger house and lay the groundwork for college savings.

There's also a point at which your retirement investments start accelerating more rapidly. It felt like it took us a really long time to get the first 200k in 401k money. But then we hit 500k much faster than I anticipated. Now I don't even think about those accounts. We make out employer match and actually focus more on other investments outside 401ks at the point.

I'm just in a much different headspace at 48 than I was 10 years ago, and I don't think I could have realistically estimated my retirement financial picture at that age. Whereas now it's very clear.

Anonymous wrote:Well DH and I save and invest separately - spender (him) and saver (me).

Early 40s - I have 15x my income saved and invested (excluding significant home equity and $600k in 529 plans). About 50% of that is separate property (pre-marriage investments that I kept separate) and the other 50% of technically marital property, but that's only relevant if we get a divorce - I control it as long as we are married, and it's part of my estate.

DH is older and only has 3x saved.

Story of a spender versus a saver.

Whoa, 600k in 529s? I'm assuming you have 3 kids? I am also a saver but that's a very high number especially with your savings rate and investment property, you have many means of funding college for your kids.

It is weird to me how antagonistic you are towards your husband and the degree to which you keep your finances separate. My DH and I also have different financial personalities -- I'm more conservative and a saver, he's more risk taking and a spender. But we combine everything and I actually like how our tendencies balance each other out. We have way more total money saved/invested because of my influence -- I insist on high percentages of automatic savings and investing out of our income, and I don't allow lifestyle creep when we get raises, so the money builds up fast. But my husband's greater capacity for risk is why it's grown at a higher rate. I would have much more of our money in ordinary savings were it not for his influence, and we would have missed out on massive gains in recent years. Also he makes sure we actually enjoy life, take real vacations, and reminds me that there's no prize for living like a pauper. We balance each other out and both come out ahead.

Anonymous wrote:I’m piling on.

The multiplier of HHI is not helpful.

You should determine your own expenses and spending per year needed in retirement.

Calculating 3-4% of your portfolio needed to spend per year is a good place to start.

Agree. It doesn't matter what multiple of youe current income you have saved. That is not a useful number to base anything on.

I have never calculated this number before. Just did so and we have about 5x saved in retirement investments. Mid 40s. Feel very confident we will be fine in retirement.

But your current income can and will change, so again, not a reasonable calculation to rely on.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As always, it's all relative. Most of America retires with practically $0 saved. You're on a message board that obsesses about min-maxing retirement savings. You're in good shape.

Well retiring with basically $0 is not a fun way to live in "retirement" and I wouldnt' recommend it.

Most Americans also carry major debt. Also don't recommend that. Live within your means, if you cannot afford it don't buy it.

OP is not going into retirement with $0, yet most Americans do and somehow get along. In other words, OP is doing fine but has inadvertently provided content for this board to brag about their financial situations. Wash, rinse, repeat...

Anonymous wrote:As always, it's all relative. Most of America retires with practically $0 saved. You're on a message board that obsesses about min-maxing retirement savings. You're in good shape.

Well retiring with basically $0 is not a fun way to live in "retirement" and I wouldnt' recommend it.

Most Americans also carry major debt. Also don't recommend that. Live within your means, if you cannot afford it don't buy it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Multiple is not a good way to look at it. You need to look at future expenses and goals and net worth needed to pay expenses and achieve goals.

We’re early 40s. $750k HHI. $6.5 million net worth. $2 million in taxable investments. $3 million across retirement accounts - 401K, Roth IRA, HSA. $1 million in home equity. $600k in 529s for elementary school kids.

Hope is to retire early 50s with $10 million invested, enough money on top of the 10 million to pay remaining balance of $3 million in properties (will not pay off ahead of schedule), and private high school and college fully paid for.

Your first paragraph is accurate but why do you think your next two paragraphs are helpful to OP? They have nothing to do with the point in your first paragraph because you don’t even discuss your own expenses or metrics. Were you just looking for internet validation that your numbers are high?

The OP asked where others were at. The answer was provided…

OP didn't provide numbers, but their tone clearly suggested that they don't have the same financial situation as you. Nobody (and I mean nobody) GAF about the kind of details you provided. Your post is embarrassing.

Well DH and I save and invest separately - spender (him) and saver (me).

Early 40s - I have 15x my income saved and invested (excluding significant home equity and $600k in 529 plans). About 50% of that is separate property (pre-marriage investments that I kept separate) and the other 50% of technically marital property, but that's only relevant if we get a divorce - I control it as long as we are married, and it's part of my estate.

DH is older and only has 3x saved.

Story of a spender versus a saver.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Multiple is not a good way to look at it. You need to look at future expenses and goals and net worth needed to pay expenses and achieve goals.

We’re early 40s. $750k HHI. $6.5 million net worth. $2 million in taxable investments. $3 million across retirement accounts - 401K, Roth IRA, HSA. $1 million in home equity. $600k in 529s for elementary school kids.

Hope is to retire early 50s with $10 million invested, enough money on top of the 10 million to pay remaining balance of $3 million in properties (will not pay off ahead of schedule), and private high school and college fully paid for.

Your first paragraph is accurate but why do you think your next two paragraphs are helpful to OP? They have nothing to do with the point in your first paragraph because you don’t even discuss your own expenses or metrics. Were you just looking for internet validation that your numbers are high?

The OP asked where others were at. The answer was provided…

Anonymous wrote:Multiple is not a good way to look at it. You need to look at future expenses and goals and net worth needed to pay expenses and achieve goals.

We’re early 40s. $750k HHI. $6.5 million net worth. $2 million in taxable investments. $3 million across retirement accounts - 401K, Roth IRA, HSA. $1 million in home equity. $600k in 529s for elementary school kids.

Hope is to retire early 50s with $10 million invested, enough money on top of the 10 million to pay remaining balance of $3 million in properties (will not pay off ahead of schedule), and private high school and college fully paid for.

Your first paragraph is accurate but why do you think your next two paragraphs are helpful to OP? They have nothing to do with the point in your first paragraph because you don’t even discuss your own expenses or metrics. Were you just looking for internet validation that your numbers are high?

Multiple is not a good way to look at it. You need to look at future expenses and goals and net worth needed to pay expenses and achieve goals.

We’re early 40s. $750k HHI. $6.5 million net worth. $2 million in taxable investments. $3 million across retirement accounts - 401K, Roth IRA, HSA. $1 million in home equity. $600k in 529s for elementary school kids.

Hope is to retire early 50s with $10 million invested, enough money on top of the 10 million to pay remaining balance of $3 million in properties (will not pay off ahead of schedule), and private high school and college fully paid for.

Fidelity has some articles suggesting milestones for what multiples to have saved at different ages. Just rough suggestions but you might want to look them uo

Anonymous wrote:I’m piling on.

The multiplier of HHI is not helpful.

You should determine your own expenses and spending per year needed in retirement.

Calculating 3-4% of your portfolio needed to spend per year is a good place to start.

+1 although 3% is way too conservative. 3.5% is considered a perpetual withdraw rate more applicable to young FIRE people, not the 4-4.7% that aims for a standard 30 year retirement.

I’m piling on.

The multiplier of HHI is not helpful.

You should determine your own expenses and spending per year needed in retirement.

Calculating 3-4% of your portfolio needed to spend per year is a good place to start.

We have about 8.5x our current income saved, not including our home equity, and I still sometimes worry that it isn’t enough (early 50s). Not for any rational reason, though: The PPs here all have good suggestions and perspectives for you, OP. It’s hard to really know what you’ll need or what’s reasonable.