Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My fed attorney position is relatively unscathed. However, the new attorney hires are in a much worse position. We are fed attorneys that have a union and all our new hires cannot be part of the bargaining unit. They have far fewer protections than I have.

I'm still WAH. My position was protected from DOGE and I never had to go back to the office. However, my manager, because he lives in the area had to come back to the office. The office is having trouble filling the managment positions because those are all back in the office. Very few people want to give up WAH.

What agency has protection from DOGE and still WAH for anyone? Do you mean you have an RA?

Exactly.
Has to be on an RA or
Live 50 + miles from an office and your agency cant find a location for you to RTO

I know my agency isnt moving the 50+ miles remote people because they dont want to pay relocation costs.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My fed attorney position is relatively unscathed. However, the new attorney hires are in a much worse position. We are fed attorneys that have a union and all our new hires cannot be part of the bargaining unit. They have far fewer protections than I have.

I'm still WAH. My position was protected from DOGE and I never had to go back to the office. However, my manager, because he lives in the area had to come back to the office. The office is having trouble filling the managment positions because those are all back in the office. Very few people want to give up WAH.

What agency has protection from DOGE and still WAH for anyone? Do you mean you have an RA?

Exactly.
Has to be on an RA or
Live 50 + miles from an office and your agency cant find a location for you to RTO

I'm an attorney at a finreg and my work has been mostly unaffected by the change in administration, but 5 days/week in the office is taking its toll on me. I thought I'd get used to it, but I'm actually despising it more day by day. I like my job and never thought I'd leave it, but now I'm really considering trying to find a job with more flexibility.

Anonymous wrote:This is OP. Thanks for the pulse check. I am content with my private sector job, and it pays more. But I’ll always miss being a civil servant and really hope to get back to it down the road. Hopefully sooner than later.

My former office is hiring scores of people. All in all it’s probably a decent job - not really in a controversial area - and I think things have settled down a lot since past year. Last year a ton of people took the VERA or otherwise left and now, what a surprise, they are incredibly understaffed. People also keep leaving and retiring.

I’m a fed, although not an attorney, and while it’s a bit better now than the previous year, it’s still a sh*t show in many aspects and nothing like “normal”.

If you’re happy where you are, I’d suggest staying put until a new Admin and some changes.

I took the Fork at a non DOJ agency. 1/3 of my office took it and it was a range of folks, some retirement/almost eligible and some mid-career people who just noped out of there. I'm still in touch with co-workers still there. They have not hired any replacements nor have the work requirements lessened and they are full RTO.

At least some of these postings are fake. I have a former colleague who was detailed to one agency from another. She has been very popular with political leadership in the agency that she was detailed to and now they are keeping her permanently. HR required them to post a job opening for the permanent position that she has already been offered and accepted.

Anonymous wrote:DOGE might be done but the mountains of $hit they left all over the federal government aren’t going anywhere.

True but they’re still there just under other titles. Like special assistant or White House liaison.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They're hiring attorneys because the existing attorneys are leaving. They're not leaving because things are awesome.

+1. I read yesterday that in the last year DOJ has lost about 3,400 out of roughly 10,000 attorneys. 34% attrition in one year is insane.

It is wild to have that much attrition in one year, I agree. But for context -- in my Division, most of the attorneys who left were already considering retirement within the next year or two, and were already eligible for retirement and took the fork. So, they were retiring soon anyway and thought "Hmm, why not get paid for months of not working with this deferred resignation thing?" The statement from PP that "They're not leaving because things are awesome" is a bit misleading, at least in regard to many of the resignations that made up that 34% attrition in my Division (I use your number, 34% here, but I think it is pretty spot on for our reduction in attorneys, even if not exact -- we lost about 1/3).

Yes, we joke in my office that DOGE was the only way to get the Boomers to retire.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They're hiring attorneys because the existing attorneys are leaving. They're not leaving because things are awesome.

+1. I read yesterday that in the last year DOJ has lost about 3,400 out of roughly 10,000 attorneys. 34% attrition in one year is insane.

It is wild to have that much attrition in one year, I agree. But for context -- in my Division, most of the attorneys who left were already considering retirement within the next year or two, and were already eligible for retirement and took the fork. So, they were retiring soon anyway and thought "Hmm, why not get paid for months of not working with this deferred resignation thing?" The statement from PP that "They're not leaving because things are awesome" is a bit misleading, at least in regard to many of the resignations that made up that 34% attrition in my Division (I use your number, 34% here, but I think it is pretty spot on for our reduction in attorneys, even if not exact -- we lost about 1/3).

Something must really suck at DOJ for Chad Mizelle to be recruiting via Twitter/X. I remember back in law school getting to work for the DOJ was considered a prestigious position. This is the article I was referencing: https://www.wsj.com/us-news/law/prosecutor-justice-department-trump-79bc6772

It specifically states that "On average, the departing employees had about 14 years of service" so sure some of them were probably retiring but a fair number of them just left. A few other select quotes:

"Keenan embodies the trend, though his sharp rise in the agency is particularly unusual, current and former prosecutors said. Until recently a line prosecutor near the bottom of the Justice Department org chart, he has become a key courtroom warrior for the administration, taking an ax to Biden-era cases and pursuing politically charged new ones that others have declined."

"Before Trump came along, Keenan, 60, was one of the longest-tenured and least-productive federal prosecutors in the Orange County branch of the U.S. Attorney’s Office for the Central District of California, according to former assistant U.S. attorneys.

As a veteran assistant U.S. attorney, passed over for promotions repeatedly in his 24-year career, Keenan was still handling low-level cases typically reserved for first-year federal prosecutors. But his fortunes have flipped: Keenan is now one of the most senior officials in the Justice Department’s Civil Rights Division, parachuting into cases around the country. "

"His colleagues described Keenan as smart and a strong writer. But they said he was a challenge for supervisors and frustrated line prosecutors and federal agents, frequently turning in work late or at the last minute. One colleague became so infuriated with Keenan that he grabbed Keenan by the neck, an incident that became office lore, they said.

Federal court records show that Keenan was lead prosecutor on a total of four indicted cases in 2023 and 2024, all of them for drugs or possession of child pornography, matters often handled by inexperienced assistant U.S. attorneys."

"Some of his more productive colleagues brought nearly eight times as many cases in that time. Others worked fewer but more complex matters that former prosecutors said Keenan rarely handled.

“People would constantly come up to him, ‘What’s going on with this case?’” recalled Richard Cutler, a former prosecutor in the Orange County office who was friends with Keenan. “I remember investigative agencies being loath to bring him anything because he was a black hole.”

Keenan told a story at lunch one day that colleagues said neatly captured what they saw as his lack of urgency: A critter of some sort had broken into his apartment the previous night, leaving behind a pile of feces. Keenan said he’d been pressed for time and left the mess there. He’d get to it later."

This administration does everything via Twitter/X.

And the Keenan story does not reflect on DOJ as a whole in any way; it reflects on how this administration recruits for and manages leadership, especially with regard to certain priorities. Which is apparent to anyone who watches the news.

Something must be going on over there for 3.4K attorneys to leave with an average tenure of 14 years. That's not just people retiring.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They're hiring attorneys because the existing attorneys are leaving. They're not leaving because things are awesome.

+1. I read yesterday that in the last year DOJ has lost about 3,400 out of roughly 10,000 attorneys. 34% attrition in one year is insane.

It is wild to have that much attrition in one year, I agree. But for context -- in my Division, most of the attorneys who left were already considering retirement within the next year or two, and were already eligible for retirement and took the fork. So, they were retiring soon anyway and thought "Hmm, why not get paid for months of not working with this deferred resignation thing?" The statement from PP that "They're not leaving because things are awesome" is a bit misleading, at least in regard to many of the resignations that made up that 34% attrition in my Division (I use your number, 34% here, but I think it is pretty spot on for our reduction in attorneys, even if not exact -- we lost about 1/3).

Something must really suck at DOJ for Chad Mizelle to be recruiting via Twitter/X. I remember back in law school getting to work for the DOJ was considered a prestigious position. This is the article I was referencing: https://www.wsj.com/us-news/law/prosecutor-justice-department-trump-79bc6772

It specifically states that "On average, the departing employees had about 14 years of service" so sure some of them were probably retiring but a fair number of them just left. A few other select quotes:

"Keenan embodies the trend, though his sharp rise in the agency is particularly unusual, current and former prosecutors said. Until recently a line prosecutor near the bottom of the Justice Department org chart, he has become a key courtroom warrior for the administration, taking an ax to Biden-era cases and pursuing politically charged new ones that others have declined."

"Before Trump came along, Keenan, 60, was one of the longest-tenured and least-productive federal prosecutors in the Orange County branch of the U.S. Attorney’s Office for the Central District of California, according to former assistant U.S. attorneys.

As a veteran assistant U.S. attorney, passed over for promotions repeatedly in his 24-year career, Keenan was still handling low-level cases typically reserved for first-year federal prosecutors. But his fortunes have flipped: Keenan is now one of the most senior officials in the Justice Department’s Civil Rights Division, parachuting into cases around the country. "

"His colleagues described Keenan as smart and a strong writer. But they said he was a challenge for supervisors and frustrated line prosecutors and federal agents, frequently turning in work late or at the last minute. One colleague became so infuriated with Keenan that he grabbed Keenan by the neck, an incident that became office lore, they said.

Federal court records show that Keenan was lead prosecutor on a total of four indicted cases in 2023 and 2024, all of them for drugs or possession of child pornography, matters often handled by inexperienced assistant U.S. attorneys."

"Some of his more productive colleagues brought nearly eight times as many cases in that time. Others worked fewer but more complex matters that former prosecutors said Keenan rarely handled.

“People would constantly come up to him, ‘What’s going on with this case?’” recalled Richard Cutler, a former prosecutor in the Orange County office who was friends with Keenan. “I remember investigative agencies being loath to bring him anything because he was a black hole.”

Keenan told a story at lunch one day that colleagues said neatly captured what they saw as his lack of urgency: A critter of some sort had broken into his apartment the previous night, leaving behind a pile of feces. Keenan said he’d been pressed for time and left the mess there. He’d get to it later."

This administration does everything via Twitter/X.

And the Keenan story does not reflect on DOJ as a whole in any way; it reflects on how this administration recruits for and manages leadership, especially with regard to certain priorities. Which is apparent to anyone who watches the news.

DOGE might be done but the mountains of $hit they left all over the federal government aren’t going anywhere.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They're hiring attorneys because the existing attorneys are leaving. They're not leaving because things are awesome.

+1. I read yesterday that in the last year DOJ has lost about 3,400 out of roughly 10,000 attorneys. 34% attrition in one year is insane.

It is wild to have that much attrition in one year, I agree. But for context -- in my Division, most of the attorneys who left were already considering retirement within the next year or two, and were already eligible for retirement and took the fork. So, they were retiring soon anyway and thought "Hmm, why not get paid for months of not working with this deferred resignation thing?" The statement from PP that "They're not leaving because things are awesome" is a bit misleading, at least in regard to many of the resignations that made up that 34% attrition in my Division (I use your number, 34% here, but I think it is pretty spot on for our reduction in attorneys, even if not exact -- we lost about 1/3).

Something must really suck at DOJ for Chad Mizelle to be recruiting via Twitter/X. I remember back in law school getting to work for the DOJ was considered a prestigious position. This is the article I was referencing: https://www.wsj.com/us-news/law/prosecutor-justice-department-trump-79bc6772

It specifically states that "On average, the departing employees had about 14 years of service" so sure some of them were probably retiring but a fair number of them just left. A few other select quotes:

"Keenan embodies the trend, though his sharp rise in the agency is particularly unusual, current and former prosecutors said. Until recently a line prosecutor near the bottom of the Justice Department org chart, he has become a key courtroom warrior for the administration, taking an ax to Biden-era cases and pursuing politically charged new ones that others have declined."

"Before Trump came along, Keenan, 60, was one of the longest-tenured and least-productive federal prosecutors in the Orange County branch of the U.S. Attorney’s Office for the Central District of California, according to former assistant U.S. attorneys.

As a veteran assistant U.S. attorney, passed over for promotions repeatedly in his 24-year career, Keenan was still handling low-level cases typically reserved for first-year federal prosecutors. But his fortunes have flipped: Keenan is now one of the most senior officials in the Justice Department’s Civil Rights Division, parachuting into cases around the country. "

"His colleagues described Keenan as smart and a strong writer. But they said he was a challenge for supervisors and frustrated line prosecutors and federal agents, frequently turning in work late or at the last minute. One colleague became so infuriated with Keenan that he grabbed Keenan by the neck, an incident that became office lore, they said.

Federal court records show that Keenan was lead prosecutor on a total of four indicted cases in 2023 and 2024, all of them for drugs or possession of child pornography, matters often handled by inexperienced assistant U.S. attorneys."

"Some of his more productive colleagues brought nearly eight times as many cases in that time. Others worked fewer but more complex matters that former prosecutors said Keenan rarely handled.

“People would constantly come up to him, ‘What’s going on with this case?’” recalled Richard Cutler, a former prosecutor in the Orange County office who was friends with Keenan. “I remember investigative agencies being loath to bring him anything because he was a black hole.”

Keenan told a story at lunch one day that colleagues said neatly captured what they saw as his lack of urgency: A critter of some sort had broken into his apartment the previous night, leaving behind a pile of feces. Keenan said he’d been pressed for time and left the mess there. He’d get to it later."

You should go work for this guy at HUD. And yes, that is on the official HUD Youtube channel and was supposedly sent to all employees on Friday. Praise Jesus!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1bEFJlW5mI

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They're hiring attorneys because the existing attorneys are leaving. They're not leaving because things are awesome.

+1. I read yesterday that in the last year DOJ has lost about 3,400 out of roughly 10,000 attorneys. 34% attrition in one year is insane.

It is wild to have that much attrition in one year, I agree. But for context -- in my Division, most of the attorneys who left were already considering retirement within the next year or two, and were already eligible for retirement and took the fork. So, they were retiring soon anyway and thought "Hmm, why not get paid for months of not working with this deferred resignation thing?" The statement from PP that "They're not leaving because things are awesome" is a bit misleading, at least in regard to many of the resignations that made up that 34% attrition in my Division (I use your number, 34% here, but I think it is pretty spot on for our reduction in attorneys, even if not exact -- we lost about 1/3).