I think some jerk kids have really passive doormat parents who can't enforcing limits with their kid.

I don't think so. Some of the most poorly behaved, jerk kids in elementary had the most lovely parents. I think they were allowed to be jerks because the lovely parents were allergic to using the word "no" or otherwise disciplining them. That might work for a docile, kind kid but some of these more "spirited" kids clearly needed some boundaries the parents would have felt were mean or just not unconditionally loving and accepting.

I know so many poorly behaved kids with lovely parents that are very hands on with behavior. And so many great kids whose parents think they are doing a fantastic job parenting, when they are doing nothing out of the norm. We like to think we have so much control over kids behavior, but so much of it circles back to the individual temperament they were born with and optimizing the environment they are in (eg. neighborhood, school). So no, I don’t think jerk parents necessarily beget jerk kids, nor do I think amazing parents necessarily beget amazing kids.

I was a bit of a jerk as a kid. My parents had Issues. My father only this spring agreed he might be on the autistic spectrum. My mother was wildly insecure and should have had therapy for a couple of things she went through before I was born. In their own ways they each taught me terrible social skills. Oh plus I got diagnosed with ADhd in 2nd grade and then just … never got treated for it except by being severely punished. Plus I’m probably also autistic. So none of us MEANT to be jerks, but we were in different ways, accidentally.

The apple does not fall far from the tree.

I don’t think so. I feel like I know all the possible combinations of kids and parents and they don’t seem to be reliably correlated.

I don't know a lot of total jerks, but the overly dramatic, gossipy girls who my DD knows have moms that are the same way. I think what passes for conversation in some households is just a bunch of busy bodying. Not saying I am a saint, but I literally have zero bandwidth to sit around gossiping about people and would prefer to spend my chit chat on other things--probably too often politics, the state of the world, my own work, etc. I think when your home culture involves gossip and drama, it is only natural that you behave a certain way...

The two most consistently awful girls (now teens) I have known, it was specifically checked out mothers. One was physically absent and the other the mom had an intense job. Dad was a nice guy but just clueless. Horrible behavior right in front of the dads and just nothing.

Parenting well is freaking exhausting. I don't agree with doing nothing and letting everything go, but I also why some people don't bother.

The biggest jerk kid I know who has been awful all through elementary school and now middle school, the parents are lovely people.

But I think both parents work a lot and there are 3 kids. I think it's just not paying attention by some parents. Being otherwise occupied and so sphere of influence on the kid is rather small.

The ones who are jerks with jerk parents, it's more obvious and predictable what's happened.

Some jerk kids have parents that are well-meaning and perhaps TOO nice.

IME, jerk parents raise the sweetest, well mannered kids. Not sure how this happens. I guess DH and I are jerks, because our kids are phenomenal.

Anonymous wrote:Some kids learn (or don't unlearn) jerk behavior because their parents are jerks themselves and don't see the need to correct it. Others have pushover parents who don't correct the behavior, but they may not be jerks themselves. Either way, it is poor parenting.

This, this, a thousand times this.

The sweetest but laziest (or boundary-less) parents can have awful kids.

My friend’s kids are kind of mean, and she is not at all. But after spending some time with them, I realized she doesn’t really discipline them for meanness. Like they are mean to her and she sort of shrugs. Once another parent told her hey your kid was mean to mine and she said she prefers natural consequences (basically hoping her child would be excluded or whatever to teach them that being mean has consequences?). I have no idea what this parenting style is called but it doesn’t seem effective to actually make kids nicer.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Controversial take here but most of the jerk kids I know have very nice parents who practice a little too much benign neglect. They work A LOT. They aren't around to supervise screen time and there's a ton of it. They don't like to be harsh disciplinarians because they already get so little time with their kids. The kids are mostly raised by an indulgent grandma or nanny.
The true jerk parents I can think of tend to be very hard on their kids, who often end up nicer than their parents.

+1 At its not just parents that are too busy. Some parents just don't want to enforce good behavior so they brush it off when their kids act badly. I know one mom that spends alot of time with her kids and has them doing volunteer work and talks alot about being kind and inclusive but her daughter is a mean girl and she brushes off alot of her behavior.

I have noticed that all the jerk kids i know were very much wanted by their parents. I.e. adopted after a long struggle, IVF after a long struggle, or the non-SN kid born after a severely SN sibling. I think their parents are so grateful to have them that they dont want to ever be negative with them.
One of my sons has natural jerk tendencies. We keep a close eye on him, call him out, and discipline him as needed (and differently from his very sensitive brother.) Hes definitely getting better with age.

Several jerk kids I know had lovely parents. One had older brothers who likely had insufficient parental oversight re: boys will be boys. The other turned out to have a father who was an alcoholic and probably made life miserable at home. But that elementary school girl was awful to my child. Ostracized her because she stood up to trying to kick one girl out of the friend group, so they kicked my daughter out of friend group she had all through elementary school. The other kids had seen what happens to they shrank and totally ignored her. Really messed up my DD self- esteem. The mother made sure my daughter was still invited to group sleepovers- which she went to. Life is hard. Hope that girl has improved with time, she had a great mom and a dad with an addiction. My son took care of the other one after one too many provocations. Hope that boy learned that you cannot always predict who will respond to bullying in a way you did not expect.