Anonymous
Post 05/23/2025 08:28     Subject: Maybe it would be a good thing if Trump limited international students at t100 schools?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I'm almost positive that the majority of international students at a school like Harvard are graduate students.


That is how it used to be. There has been an absolutely massive uptick in the number of international students at top schools for undergraduate. This is what has changed. International students used to be mainly graduate students. Now so many are undergraduate students. This is from Common Data Set for 23-24

Harvard Freshman Enrollment
In state students: 210. (12.7%)
Out of state students: 1167 (70.9%)
International Students: 268 (16.2%)
Total first time first degree seeking: 1645



That doesn’t look massive. So, call it 1,000 undergrads are international, out of 7700 international students. So, yes the vast majority are grad students.


It’s 16% of the undergraduate population; it should be 5%.
Back to the 1990s/2000s.


Well, it still just validates the point that the vast majority of international students at Harvard are grad students.

BTW, nearly 7% of Oxford students are American and nearly 40% are international…and that’s a public school.

I think the view is that international students are appreciated at all top universities and perhaps this will impact the many Americans that want to study abroad.
Anonymous
Post 05/23/2025 08:23     Subject: Maybe it would be a good thing if Trump limited international students at t100 schools?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I'm almost positive that the majority of international students at a school like Harvard are graduate students.


That is how it used to be. There has been an absolutely massive uptick in the number of international students at top schools for undergraduate. This is what has changed. International students used to be mainly graduate students. Now so many are undergraduate students. This is from Common Data Set for 23-24

Harvard Freshman Enrollment
In state students: 210. (12.7%)
Out of state students: 1167 (70.9%)
International Students: 268 (16.2%)
Total first time first degree seeking: 1645



That doesn’t look massive. So, call it 1,000 undergrads are international, out of 7700 international students. So, yes the vast majority are grad students.


It’s 16% of the undergraduate population; it should be 5%.
Back to the 1990s/2000s.
Anonymous
Post 05/23/2025 08:22     Subject: Maybe it would be a good thing if Trump limited international students at t100 schools?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:You would think they would start by limiting international enrollment at state schools first, by apparently Trump is on a revenge tour against Harvard for some reason.


Trump has no business dictating anything to states or private institutions.

For states there is a greater financial impact as OOS and International students pay substantially more. You could argue that the top 20 public institutions could fill their seats with domestic OOS but many public’s like Kansas, Iowa etc really struggle for OOS students and have to rely on international students.


Let foreigners go to red states then. Places like Harvard should prioritize Americans.
Anonymous
Post 05/23/2025 07:57     Subject: Maybe it would be a good thing if Trump limited international students at t100 schools?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I think it would be good but people don’t like it since it’s a Trump initiative.


It's not an initiative. It's revenge. He is going after Harvard because they won't give up their private student records. This was in the letter that Noem sent. If it were an initiative, it would apply to all schools or be thought out.



Yes, this is the same personally motivated attack as his targeting of individual judges who disagree with him and attorneys who prosecuted Jan 6 rioters and journalists who point out his failings, etcetcetc. He is an old-time mafioso using the executive branch to settle his own personal scores.
Anonymous
Post 05/23/2025 07:51     Subject: Re:Maybe it would be a good thing if Trump limited international students at t100 schools?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Not when Trump expects to appoint his own idiots to select the curriculum, hire faculty, and admit students. We live in a democracy and these are independent institutions. It’s disgusting.

What is unfortunate is that there is a national discussion to be had about affordable and equitable access to college. It shouldn’t be considered a luxury to attend but an imperative to attend. Taxpayers should be paying more to ensure the next generation is educated and able to contribute to the economy.

International students do bring value but you can’t claim their presence is to provide a global environment when the overwhelming majority come from 2-3 countries. There is no reason to bring so many in if there are equally or better qualified domestic candidates willing to full pay. If there are not enough domestic candidates to sustain a graduate program then there could be an exception.


Perhaps we should ban international students from graduate STEM programs in order to better protect our intellectual property and research.


Any American worth $.02 who pursues a graduate STEM program is essentially guaranteed admission because we don’t have enough pursing it in the most in demand fields, and yes there is a preference for Americans.
Anonymous
Post 05/23/2025 07:48     Subject: Maybe it would be a good thing if Trump limited international students at t100 schools?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I'm almost positive that the majority of international students at a school like Harvard are graduate students.


That is how it used to be. There has been an absolutely massive uptick in the number of international students at top schools for undergraduate. This is what has changed. International students used to be mainly graduate students. Now so many are undergraduate students. This is from Common Data Set for 23-24

Harvard Freshman Enrollment
In state students: 210. (12.7%)
Out of state students: 1167 (70.9%)
International Students: 268 (16.2%)
Total first time first degree seeking: 1645



That doesn’t look massive. So, call it 1,000 undergrads are international, out of 7700 international students. So, yes the vast majority are grad students.
Anonymous
Post 05/23/2025 07:44     Subject: Maybe it would be a good thing if Trump limited international students at t100 schools?
How about American kids get better education at Elementary and high school before throwing them into expensive country club universities they are academically unprepared for?
Anonymous
Post 05/23/2025 07:38     Subject: Maybe it would be a good thing if Trump limited international students at t100 schools?
Anonymous wrote:I think it would be good but people don’t like it since it’s a Trump initiative.


It's not an initiative. It's revenge. He is going after Harvard because they won't give up their private student records. This was in the letter that Noem sent. If it were an initiative, it would apply to all schools or be thought out.

Anonymous
Post 05/23/2025 07:35     Subject: Maybe it would be a good thing if Trump limited international students at t100 schools?
I think it would be good but people don’t like it since it’s a Trump initiative.
Anonymous
Post 05/23/2025 07:33     Subject: Maybe it would be a good thing if Trump limited international students at t100 schools?
I suspect OP is that political poster trying to softpedal autocratic porn.
Anonymous
Post 05/23/2025 07:28     Subject: Re:Maybe it would be a good thing if Trump limited international students at t100 schools?
Anonymous wrote:Not when Trump expects to appoint his own idiots to select the curriculum, hire faculty, and admit students. We live in a democracy and these are independent institutions. It’s disgusting.

What is unfortunate is that there is a national discussion to be had about affordable and equitable access to college. It shouldn’t be considered a luxury to attend but an imperative to attend. Taxpayers should be paying more to ensure the next generation is educated and able to contribute to the economy.

International students do bring value but you can’t claim their presence is to provide a global environment when the overwhelming majority come from 2-3 countries. There is no reason to bring so many in if there are equally or better qualified domestic candidates willing to full pay. If there are not enough domestic candidates to sustain a graduate program then there could be an exception.


Perhaps we should ban international students from graduate STEM programs in order to better protect our intellectual property and research.
Anonymous
Post 05/23/2025 07:27     Subject: Maybe it would be a good thing if Trump limited international students at t100 schools?
Doesn't the president of the United States have bigger things to worry about than this? Most of the whining I heard prior to the election was about inflation and how much things cost because Biden was horrible.

Well, Trump is just making this worse with all of his economic policy. Perhaps he should focus more on bringing prices down and less on performative, childish gestures towards a few schools that rejected his child.

It is truly sad that he has fooled so much of America to prioritize the dumb things that he turns into a big deal and make them forget about the issues that impact their daily lives.
Anonymous
Post 05/23/2025 06:50     Subject: Maybe it would be a good thing if Trump limited international students at t100 schools?
To create more space for good students, they should rather stop recruiting legacy students and athletes. It would raise the overall academic level rather than reducing it.
Anonymous
Post 05/23/2025 05:03     Subject: Maybe it would be a good thing if Trump limited international students at t100 schools?
From Common Data Set

24-25 Princeton 11.2%
396 International students out of 3,525 enrolled freshman

John Hopkins 17%
236 international out of 1389 enrolled freshman

23-24, 24-25 Stanford Section C1 listing of international students Blank

23-24, 24-25 MIT Section Blank

Cornell 11.2%
396 International freshman out of 3525

Dartmouth 14.3%
170 freshman out of 1,182 enrolled freshman

Brown 17.6%
304 international out of 1719 enrolled freshman

Anonymous
Post 05/23/2025 04:58     Subject: Maybe it would be a good thing if Trump limited international students at t100 schools?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't it be a good thing if the top US schools educated and prepared more US students? Is what's happening at harvard a blessing in disguise?

Maybe the government should limit the number of international students at all top schools. Getting in and the cost of attending is just too much.



International students are a major source of funding. They are almost all full pay (sometimes at higher rates than Americans) so they subsidize financial aid as well as their programs of study.

If the government were paying for universities - as it could and arguably should, so that everyone could have a low-cost or free education - then maybe we could talk about it. But as it is, limiting international students would just reduce what the university can afford to do for Americans.


I am for intl students being enrolled, but my kid is at a T20, and I am surprised that probably the 25 I have spoken to are all receiving aid. Zero told me they are full pay. I used to think as you do now.