Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Leave.

OP. Leaving makes it worse. Sitting with her, rubbing her back, and reminding her that she's a good kid usually ends it within a few minutes. Is it really better to leave and have her scream and destroy her room?

Yes. Take things out of her room that she is “destroying”. Or let it be and clean up later.

Consequences have to be relevant. Taking away sweets for hitting isn’t relevant. Walking away is. “I don’t want to be around a girl who hits me, I’m leaving.” There is a great class on consequences from PEP

Anonymous wrote:Haven't read all the comments but I specialize in pmt. First send her to a brief ( no me than 5 min time-out) where goal is sitting quietly without attention/reinforcement. Be in view. Don't send her to her room. Praise for going and praise again when done ( I'd probably do like 2 min on a stair). Reinforce all thr times she acts calm when upset and keeps hands to self ( avoid words like thanks for not hitting, instead praise what she did do). If she doesn't go calmly or goes screaming you calmly say you have a choice sit on this chair/step quietly for 1 min or I'm going to take away x. Key thing with whatever you take away is that it doesn't extend beyond the day and can be even less- like in taking this doll for an hour and she can say I don't care!! You take it anyway and then you're done... you don't go searching for more things to extend the time of the punishment

this sounds all very MAGA

Take her to be evaluated for autism. I know people blame autism or adhd for everything but the destroying her room is during a meltdown is a sign. Neurodivergence presents differently in girls than boys.

I don't think anyone has said the kid is a master mind in control of their emotions? Did i miss that? The goal of the time out is to give the child a break to work out their own feelings, similar to many of the other suggestions made.

If you have a child that responds well to a parent giving back rubs and telling them they're a good child, and that child learns to stop hitting, learns to follow directions from adults in the appropriate settings, and learns emotional regulation - that's wonderful. You have an easy kid and you found out what works.

If you have a child who responds well to holding their hands back and saying "I will not let you hit me," do that. I think many parents wish it would work for them. I did.

If your child responds well to a "time in" where you don't leave, and can help the child name their feelings and the better responses, that's great too. One of my kids responds well to a "time in," and so that's what we do.

If your child does not respond to any of these, then you end up with a parent who puts the child in the room and holds the door closed while the child calms down. You shouldn't have to do that a lot before the child starts to calm down on their own and sits in time out.

You have a child that chases you around the house hitting you. Sounds like you've already tried simply leaving and that hasn't worked. The next step is to pick another option, *be consistent,* and give it a couple months or more to see if this helps the child, before trying something different.

Haven't read all the comments but I specialize in pmt. First send her to a brief ( no me than 5 min time-out) where goal is sitting quietly without attention/reinforcement. Be in view. Don't send her to her room. Praise for going and praise again when done ( I'd probably do like 2 min on a stair). Reinforce all thr times she acts calm when upset and keeps hands to self ( avoid words like thanks for not hitting, instead praise what she did do). If she doesn't go calmly or goes screaming you calmly say you have a choice sit on this chair/step quietly for 1 min or I'm going to take away x. Key thing with whatever you take away is that it doesn't extend beyond the day and can be even less- like in taking this doll for an hour and she can say I don't care!! You take it anyway and then you're done... you don't go searching for more things to extend the time of the punishment

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Some of the responses in this thread directly contradict each other.

Either she is totally out of control, doesn't have the tools or knowledge to calm herself down, and needs my support to learn those tools (staying with her while of course not letting her hit).

OR

She is a sly mastermind - she can stop herself from hitting or screaming, but is taking advantage of me and I'm a bad parent letting her walk all over me. In which case I need to shut her in her room until she calms down.

Both of these cannot be true.

Based on observing her in the moment + talking to her after + reading Dr Becky, Dr Laura, Janet Lansbury, and other books about how kids' brains work, I thought it was the former. But still some people say that's wrong and the latter is true.

My brain is exploding here, ladies - what is the right answer?

What you’re doing right now isn’t working, so do the opposite.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Some of the responses in this thread directly contradict each other.

Either she is totally out of control, doesn't have the tools or knowledge to calm herself down, and needs my support to learn those tools (staying with her while of course not letting her hit).

OR

She is a sly mastermind - she can stop herself from hitting or screaming, but is taking advantage of me and I'm a bad parent letting her walk all over me. In which case I need to shut her in her room until she calms down.

Both of these cannot be true.

Based on observing her in the moment + talking to her after + reading Dr Becky, Dr Laura, Janet Lansbury, and other books about how kids' brains work, I thought it was the former. But still some people say that's wrong and the latter is true.

My brain is exploding here, ladies - what is the right answer?

The former. Do you really think your dc is a sly mastermind...? Some parents still have backward ideas but when you know better, you do better.

no, that’s wrong. stupid MAGA

When my 4 year old is like this I have to take him gently and bring him to his room or some other enclosed space, where i sit on the floor with him and try to calm him down. They aren’t learning anything once they get to that melt down mode, it’s just time to practice self regulation at that point.

We do natural consequences for little moments as well like, if he hits his sister with a toy then I take that toy. If he throws his food then we don’t move on to dessert until he cleans the kitchen floor. Etc. But always very calmly and not escalating the adrenaline. That gets the best results.

I'm the PP who did the 1-2-3 approach with time-outs. I don't do it because she's a sly mastermind and I need to punish her. I do the time-outs because she needs to have the experience of a hard limit so that she can feel safe within those limits. Now, if she hits me and I start to count, she knows she's gone too far and it helps her reel in her reactions so that she doesn't get a time-out. I also look at the time-outs as a safe way to have a temper tantrum and blow off steam. She can yell, hit the door, etc, but she doesn't actually have to worry that she's going to go too far / hit us / get out of control. By the time she's done, she calms down, gives a hug and apologizes, and we immediately forgive and move on. It has worked for us. But of course, also teach her coping skills when she's not too upset to be rational, and also model your own coping mechanisms. It's not either/or.

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Some of the responses in this thread directly contradict each other.

Either she is totally out of control, doesn't have the tools or knowledge to calm herself down, and needs my support to learn those tools (staying with her while of course not letting her hit).

OR

She is a sly mastermind - she can stop herself from hitting or screaming, but is taking advantage of me and I'm a bad parent letting her walk all over me. In which case I need to shut her in her room until she calms down.

Both of these cannot be true.

Based on observing her in the moment + talking to her after + reading Dr Becky, Dr Laura, Janet Lansbury, and other books about how kids' brains work, I thought it was the former. But still some people say that's wrong and the latter is true.

My brain is exploding here, ladies - what is the right answer?

The truth for most kids who have these episodes is somewhere in the middle. They don't have well developed tools for self regulating, and so when they encounter a problem, they kind of flail around (metaphorically, but some kids also do so literally) they hit on something that sort of works, which is communicating their distress in a way that causes the adults in their lives to step in and solve the problem themselves. They aren't consciously thinking about it that way, but behavior can be rewarded and reinforced without the person being rewarded having any sense that there's a pattern or they are being rewarded.

So, they definitely need adult help. They need adults to make sure that their needs are met most of the time, with antecedent strategies like making sure they have enough sleep, and providing food on a predictable schedule so they aren't hungry and anxious about hungry, and limiting overstimulation. They need adults to model and practice strategies for self regulating with them outside of the moments when they are tantrumming.

But they also need some clear bright lines that say "that strategy isn't an option", which may include consequences, and definitely includes not reinforcing the behavior by coming in and solving the problem. If your kid hits you, because that's easier than stopping to find the words "I'm hungry", and you come in and tell them not to hit, but you also offer them food, or cue them to say "I'm hungry" instead, then they're learning, subconsciously, that hitting works. If your kid hits you, because that's easier than admitting that they need to take a break from an overstimulating situation, and you comfort them and leave, they're learning that hitting works. Basically hitting becomes away of taking a problem that's hard for them to solve and turning it over to you to solve.

So, yes, teach her tools, and help her out. But don't do that in the moment of hitting. In the moment of hitting remove yourself (you don't have to lock her in her room, you can just back up, or turn your attention elsewhere) and let her solve the problem that she's dealing with on your own. My recommendation would be to reserve this just for hitting in the beginning to get that one thing under control.

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Some of the responses in this thread directly contradict each other.

Either she is totally out of control, doesn't have the tools or knowledge to calm herself down, and needs my support to learn those tools (staying with her while of course not letting her hit).

OR

She is a sly mastermind - she can stop herself from hitting or screaming, but is taking advantage of me and I'm a bad parent letting her walk all over me. In which case I need to shut her in her room until she calms down.

Both of these cannot be true.

Based on observing her in the moment + talking to her after + reading Dr Becky, Dr Laura, Janet Lansbury, and other books about how kids' brains work, I thought it was the former. But still some people say that's wrong and the latter is true.

My brain is exploding here, ladies - what is the right answer?

The former. Do you really think your dc is a sly mastermind...? Some parents still have backward ideas but when you know better, you do better.

OP here. Some of the responses in this thread directly contradict each other.

Either she is totally out of control, doesn't have the tools or knowledge to calm herself down, and needs my support to learn those tools (staying with her while of course not letting her hit).

OR

She is a sly mastermind - she can stop herself from hitting or screaming, but is taking advantage of me and I'm a bad parent letting her walk all over me. In which case I need to shut her in her room until she calms down.

Both of these cannot be true.

Based on observing her in the moment + talking to her after + reading Dr Becky, Dr Laura, Janet Lansbury, and other books about how kids' brains work, I thought it was the former. But still some people say that's wrong and the latter is true.

My brain is exploding here, ladies - what is the right answer?

Our six year old hit us until last year. The Janet Lansbury holding her hands approach worked pretty well when we were consistent - she didn’t like having her hands held. At age 5 we started the 1-2-3 method with time outs and that also helped - she was a bit older and able to rationally think through her actions a bit more. We still had to hold the door closed while she yelled at us during time out though. Now it’s been a long time since she has tried to hit us when she’s upset.

You don't punish or discipline. You say, hitting hurts, I won't let you hit me. You can either hold their hands or step back if they keep swinging at you. Stay calm and teach them the tools to express themselves without having to hit.

Anonymous wrote:I like the Janet Lansbury approach of saying "I won't let you hit me" and gently holding their arms. If you don't like "using force", then you say "I won't let you hit me" and you walk away.

Yes, this.