Anonymous wrote:What’s crazy to me are parents that rationalize teen boy behavior like sneaking out, drinking, smoking, getting arrested etc… as “typical teen boy behavior”. Umm no it isn’t. You just have no control of your son. Once boys start pushing limits without boundaries from parents the sky is the limit for them.

+1

OP change the course right now

What’s crazy to me are parents that rationalize teen boy behavior like sneaking out, drinking, smoking, getting arrested etc… as “typical teen boy behavior”. Umm no it isn’t. You just have no control of your son. Once boys start pushing limits without boundaries from parents the sky is the limit for them.

OP, I didn’t nip this in the bud and I now have a 17yr ADHD teen boy who is still on the wrong side, has gotten in to trouble countless times, poor grades, and smokes weed a lot. It’s been a constant battle.

Step in now. Trust me. Be the parent.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow! My kids are younger, but I cannot imagine prohibiting a 22 year old from going on a trip to Florida… or being prohibited smth by my parents as a 22 year old.
How do they learn to make their own choices and learn from their mistakes?

There are mistakes and there are mistakes. Hanging with with that character may not be a learning experience you come back from.

But don’t you expect them to be able to make their own judgment calls on these things at 22? Honest question.

Again, my kids are younger, so I do not have that experience with my kids yet, but as a 22 year old, I lived in a different country from my parents, had a job, made decisions about career, moved to a different city, decided not to move in with a bf, knew when to extricate myself from situations, etc.

I would see it as a sign of disrespect and boundary crossing if my parents went to forbid me from making my own choices… and I would not become as confident in making my own choices and as independent as I did if my parents were telling me what to do/not do at that age…

DP. OP’s kid is 13. Not 22. You do your best to guide them at 13 so they can make good choices when they are on their own at 22. Why do you keep asking about 22?

I’m the PP with the 22 year old. I mentioned my tactics is culturally acceptable for us even though it’s unconventional for Americans. In our family, no one needs to walk a tightrope. The kids are allowed to express their opinions to us no matter what it is, and we’re able to do the same. There’s not only one way to skin a cat. We felt strongly about our son going to a possible hedonistic trip to South Beach and staying with some millionaires he’s never met, who gets chauffeured around. We use our wisdom, and expressed to him that we were not comfortable with the trip - We paid for other trips. He decided he didn’t need to have every experience under the sun, that one included. He could have decided to go anyway, but we longed ago built the type of relationship where they trust and respect our opinion.

I agree with you on that and we are all saying the same thing. We try to do our best to build trusting relationships with them and provide guidance. I would try to convince my kids not to go on that trip you described at any age. But agree that at 22, there’s not much you can do to stop them. At 13, you can physically alarm your door to see if they sneak out and call the police if the millionaire takes them to South Beach without your permission.

My situation was different than yours OP, but some things in common, so maybe my story will be helpful.

One of my DS had severe although not readily apparent mental illness. He fell in with a crowd that was doing all manner of illegal stuff, and many of the parents were completely fine with it. My son would have had problems no matter what, but this friend group exacerbated things with devastating results.

I did try to shut it down, but in retrospect I did not do enough. I was also so caught up in fixing issues (finding treatment, finding facilities) that I didn't put enough effort into returning him to positive spaces/relationships. If I had it to do over again I would
-pull him from his toxic school
-be much more assertive with the bad group parents about the absolute necessity of keeping themselves and their kids out of my son's life
-without neglecting treatment, I would put in a ton more energy into a better school solution, opportunities for connecting and reconnecting with positive peers and adults, and generally opening doors to good things instead of primarily trying to fix problems

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Bring these friends into your home regularly and make sure you judge them for yourself rather than some sort of “reputation” heard from gossipy adults.

Banning an impulsive kid with no other friends from hanging with his only friends is likely a fools task and honestly pretty cruel besides.

Tell him he can only hang out at your house with them for now. Get to know them. Don’t judge them but make sure they know your rules. Have awesome snacks and otherwise a relaxed environment and good video games. It’s my experience that these kinds of kids aren’t bad (after all they are including your son, who apparently is a bit of a school pariah) just poorly supervised and/or struggling with some home problems. Often these are the first kids to engage with me as a parent and be better with my kids when they don’t want to risk the same space of my home.

I was in scouts in a rural town; and it was full of kids like this. Yeah they aren’t evil per se, but they get up to a lot of no good and have very loose ideas of right and wrong. I was the world’s biggest prude and they knew it, so I was like a mascot or pet to them and didn’t get dragged along for the real bad things.

But don’t be fooled that a nice house or plenty of food will quell their impulses. If you do this I would keep eyes on them like a hawk. No liquor or weapons in the house, and never home alone. Maybe no matches or lighters too.

This all sounds like the typical mischief normal boys get into and grow out of.

NBD.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow! My kids are younger, but I cannot imagine prohibiting a 22 year old from going on a trip to Florida… or being prohibited smth by my parents as a 22 year old.
How do they learn to make their own choices and learn from their mistakes?

There are mistakes and there are mistakes. Hanging with with that character may not be a learning experience you come back from.

But don’t you expect them to be able to make their own judgment calls on these things at 22? Honest question.

Again, my kids are younger, so I do not have that experience with my kids yet, but as a 22 year old, I lived in a different country from my parents, had a job, made decisions about career, moved to a different city, decided not to move in with a bf, knew when to extricate myself from situations, etc.

I would see it as a sign of disrespect and boundary crossing if my parents went to forbid me from making my own choices… and I would not become as confident in making my own choices and as independent as I did if my parents were telling me what to do/not do at that age…

DP. OP’s kid is 13. Not 22. You do your best to guide them at 13 so they can make good choices when they are on their own at 22. Why do you keep asking about 22?

I’m the PP with the 22 year old. I mentioned my tactics is culturally acceptable for us even though it’s unconventional for Americans. In our family, no one needs to walk a tightrope. The kids are allowed to express their opinions to us no matter what it is, and we’re able to do the same. There’s not only one way to skin a cat. We felt strongly about our son going to a possible hedonistic trip to South Beach and staying with some millionaires he’s never met, who gets chauffeured around. We use our wisdom, and expressed to him that we were not comfortable with the trip - We paid for other trips. He decided he didn’t need to have every experience under the sun, that one included. He could have decided to go anyway, but we longed ago built the type of relationship where they trust and respect our opinion.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow! My kids are younger, but I cannot imagine prohibiting a 22 year old from going on a trip to Florida… or being prohibited smth by my parents as a 22 year old.
How do they learn to make their own choices and learn from their mistakes?

There are mistakes and there are mistakes. Hanging with with that character may not be a learning experience you come back from.

But don’t you expect them to be able to make their own judgment calls on these things at 22? Honest question.

Again, my kids are younger, so I do not have that experience with my kids yet, but as a 22 year old, I lived in a different country from my parents, had a job, made decisions about career, moved to a different city, decided not to move in with a bf, knew when to extricate myself from situations, etc.

I would see it as a sign of disrespect and boundary crossing if my parents went to forbid me from making my own choices… and I would not become as confident in making my own choices and as independent as I did if my parents were telling me what to do/not do at that age…

DP. OP’s kid is 13. Not 22. You do your best to guide them at 13 so they can make good choices when they are on their own at 22. Why do you keep asking about 22?

Anonymous wrote:Bring these friends into your home regularly and make sure you judge them for yourself rather than some sort of “reputation” heard from gossipy adults.

Banning an impulsive kid with no other friends from hanging with his only friends is likely a fools task and honestly pretty cruel besides.

Tell him he can only hang out at your house with them for now. Get to know them. Don’t judge them but make sure they know your rules. Have awesome snacks and otherwise a relaxed environment and good video games. It’s my experience that these kinds of kids aren’t bad (after all they are including your son, who apparently is a bit of a school pariah) just poorly supervised and/or struggling with some home problems. Often these are the first kids to engage with me as a parent and be better with my kids when they don’t want to risk the same space of my home.

I agree with this poster _and_ I think you want to be aware that he needs friends and belonging. If you want him to find alternatives, you need to build an entry ramp to alternatives. Does he like any sports? ADHD kids can be amazing athletes, spoken by a mom with a hockey-crazed basketball-crazed child. Kids like to be good at sports, so before you sign him up for a team, sign him up for private lessons and some age-approrpiate fun skills clinicis, so that he isn't coming onto a team as the "worst" on the team. If he doesn't like sports, look for a church group, a camp, another activity (photography, music, whatever) where he can find an additional community.

I would say "your house, your rules" and while you want to make your home fun, you can be clear that there will be no vaping in your home. But the idea of getting to know, observing without judgement, and learning more is excellent advice. You will not be able to make much progress with your son without more information.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You can’t control who he is friends with. If you try, you’ll only damage your own relationship with him.

This is not true. Sure, if you just bring the hammer down and end the discussion, maybe. But as more of a collaborative effort, with plenty of engagement on the parents' part, of course you can. And should.

+1. Especially at this age. Step in now, OP, while you still have ability to guide.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Bring these friends into your home regularly and make sure you judge them for yourself rather than some sort of “reputation” heard from gossipy adults.

Banning an impulsive kid with no other friends from hanging with his only friends is likely a fools task and honestly pretty cruel besides.

Tell him he can only hang out at your house with them for now. Get to know them. Don’t judge them but make sure they know your rules. Have awesome snacks and otherwise a relaxed environment and good video games. It’s my experience that these kinds of kids aren’t bad (after all they are including your son, who apparently is a bit of a school pariah) just poorly supervised and/or struggling with some home problems. Often these are the first kids to engage with me as a parent and be better with my kids when they don’t want to risk the same space of my home.

I was in scouts in a rural town; and it was full of kids like this. Yeah they aren’t evil per se, but they get up to a lot of no good and have very loose ideas of right and wrong. I was the world’s biggest prude and they knew it, so I was like a mascot or pet to them and didn’t get dragged along for the real bad things.

But don’t be fooled that a nice house or plenty of food will quell their impulses. If you do this I would keep eyes on them like a hawk. No liquor or weapons in the house, and never home alone. Maybe no matches or lighters too.

And lock up the ADHD meds and make sure your kid is taking them responsibly and not tempted to sell or give them away.

That said, a lot of the perceived "bad" crowd at my high school was made up of the nicest kids who dressed goth but were seriously kind and caring and had a whole lot less substance abuse and alcohol problems than the sporty preppy lax bro type who knew how to kiss up to teachers and parents but were really awful behind the scenes.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow! My kids are younger, but I cannot imagine prohibiting a 22 year old from going on a trip to Florida… or being prohibited smth by my parents as a 22 year old.
How do they learn to make their own choices and learn from their mistakes?

There are mistakes and there are mistakes. Hanging with with that character may not be a learning experience you come back from.

But don’t you expect them to be able to make their own judgment calls on these things at 22? Honest question.

Again, my kids are younger, so I do not have that experience with my kids yet, but as a 22 year old, I lived in a different country from my parents, had a job, made decisions about career, moved to a different city, decided not to move in with a bf, knew when to extricate myself from situations, etc.

I would see it as a sign of disrespect and boundary crossing if my parents went to forbid me from making my own choices… and I would not become as confident in making my own choices and as independent as I did if my parents were telling me what to do/not do at that age…

Anonymous wrote:Bring these friends into your home regularly and make sure you judge them for yourself rather than some sort of “reputation” heard from gossipy adults.

Banning an impulsive kid with no other friends from hanging with his only friends is likely a fools task and honestly pretty cruel besides.

Tell him he can only hang out at your house with them for now. Get to know them. Don’t judge them but make sure they know your rules. Have awesome snacks and otherwise a relaxed environment and good video games. It’s my experience that these kinds of kids aren’t bad (after all they are including your son, who apparently is a bit of a school pariah) just poorly supervised and/or struggling with some home problems. Often these are the first kids to engage with me as a parent and be better with my kids when they don’t want to risk the same space of my home.

I was in scouts in a rural town; and it was full of kids like this. Yeah they aren’t evil per se, but they get up to a lot of no good and have very loose ideas of right and wrong. I was the world’s biggest prude and they knew it, so I was like a mascot or pet to them and didn’t get dragged along for the real bad things.

But don’t be fooled that a nice house or plenty of food will quell their impulses. If you do this I would keep eyes on them like a hawk. No liquor or weapons in the house, and never home alone. Maybe no matches or lighters too.

Anonymous wrote:Wow! My kids are younger, but I cannot imagine prohibiting a 22 year old from going on a trip to Florida… or being prohibited smth by my parents as a 22 year old.
How do they learn to make their own choices and learn from their mistakes?

There are mistakes and there are mistakes. Hanging with with that character may not be a learning experience you come back from.