^ should say that when they are around others who want to gossip and trash you, they'll participate because they want those people to like them. Typed too fast!

Anonymous wrote:So... they're just awful people? What do they gain, though? People do things for a reason. Doesn't mean it's a good reason, but...

What is the motivation for this behavior? Power? Sadistic desire to hurt people just because they can? Boredom? I just don't get it.

In some cases I really don't think it's intentional, but reflects a lack of character or values.

I have known women who are just people pleasers and they'll say whatever they think the person they are with wants to hear. So they'll be super nice to your face and tell you how much they like you and how you are really close friends, but then if they are around people who want to gossip about you or trash you, they'll participate because in that moment they want those people to like you. It doesn't feel inconsistent to them even though it is literally two-faced, because they are engaging in the same social behavior every time, just with different people (and with a total disregard to the impact of their behavior, of course).

Also some people are incredibly good at convincing themselves that their behavior is okay even when confronted with obvious evidence they have at least screwed up, even if unintentionally. I had a friend once who I'd confided in about some really upsetting things that had happened to me at work. She decided to share the stuff I'd told her with another person who also worked with me, which is just.... why. Anyway I later found out and got upset with her because I'd obviously told her that in confidence, and of all the people for her to discuss it with, WHY would she choose someone who also worked with me? I didn't expect the conflict to end our friendship because I honestly assumed that she'd be like "yes I screwed up, I'm sorry, I don't know what I was thinking" and we'd move on. Instead she was first like "I didn't do that" and then I showed her the email from my coworker that showed she was lying, she got mad at me and said I'd violated her privacy (by reading an email sent to me by my colleague about things that had happened to me?), and then she got mad at me for confronting her about it at all and then we weren't friends anymore. I think she honestly just couldn't confront the idea that she'd screwed up.

Anyway, I don't think people who do this stuff would think of it as manipulation because I think they are usually not machiavellian plotters. They are weak and sort of oblivious and don't understand that in order to be a good person, a loyal friend, you have to act with intention in your life. You can't just stumble around doing whatever occurs to you in the moment and expect it all to work out in the end. They lack character.

"Do you love me?"
"Of course I love you!"
"Well, you're stupid for loving me. Hey, (friend's name)! Look at how stupid this one is!"

Anonymous wrote:What does "toy with" mean? Examples?

There's a former friend who treated me like crap, then ghosted. But instead of, you know, ghosting and moving on with her life, she has made multiple sockpuppet profiles, regularly monitors anything I post publicly, and clearly still has a head full of me and her eyes all over my life. Why? If you won't talk to my face, why leave "dear you..." style not-so-anonymous posts about me elsewhere? It's not even just talking about me; I might be able to understand gossip, but this isn't about me to other people. It's passive-aggressively @ing me instead of speaking to my face like a reasonable, sane adult.

Another is a hot/cold relationship with someone who regularly begs for my attention, but then turns nasty or absent when he gets it. Why? It's like being punished for trying to care about someone. Why ask me if I care only to ignore me when I say I do?

These are just examples, but none of it makes sense to me. Why play games with anyone when you can speak your piece and dial direct? And if you can't be direct, why engage at all? What is the gain from this passive-aggressive nonsense? Wasting my time confusing me by looking stupid?