Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Peer group:
Grinnell: 1480, 51% submitting
Pittsburgh: 1360, 50% submitting

Grinnell's median and percent submitting are on par with schools like BC, UVA, W&M, BU, WFU, etc. while Pittsburgh's stats are closer to Virginia Tech's.

This stat is a little misleading, as are any when people want to hang their hat on the SAT score as a proxy for prestige, selectivity, worth, etc. That percentage of submitters is for both SAT and and ACT, so those median numbers don't mean quite as much. Also, the type of student who qualifies for Pitt's Honors College is absolutely in the same peer group as the students who matriculate at those other schools named above, their families just may not want to pay 80k+ for the privilege.

Professors notice and relate to the best, most engaged students in a class. I never felt "held back" by peers at Pitt. And I was an NMF at Pitt at a time when it was considered less selective. I think this a "run your own race" issue...other people's SATs have little to do with how much a student learns. Feeling underchallenged...do an honors paper, ask for extra reading, get a research assistantship, etc. I'd say coursework varies more due to the profs than the classmates.

This is a major difference--professors' commitment to UG teaching and research. That would be my only reservation about turning down Grinnell for Pitt. But if in the Honors College, shouldn't be a big issue.

PP...Good point...I had lots of contact with profs at Pitt because I sat up front in every class and showed interest. I did a research assistantship also.

I agree that a small school might be good for a person who wants more visibility with profs in an organic way (if that's what commitment to undergrad teaching is supposed to result in). I think profs just vary because they are people. I have a cousin who is a professor who is recognizable in her best online student reviews and unrecognizable in her worst. She recently won a teaching award. When you're in a small major at a small school, you need to like the core faculty. Otherwise, you're stuck.

Honestly, I didn't feel the need for a personal/name basis relationship with every prof. I had usually had stronger ties/interest to 1 or 2 profs a semester. I'm introverted so liked college better than high school.

Pre-med is also a different ballgame depending on how the school determines med school recommendations. I am far from that...I just know it's important to strategize for success.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Peer group:
Grinnell: 1480, 51% submitting
Pittsburgh: 1360, 50% submitting

Grinnell's median and percent submitting are on par with schools like BC, UVA, W&M, BU, WFU, etc. while Pittsburgh's stats are closer to Virginia Tech's.

This stat is a little misleading, as are any when people want to hang their hat on the SAT score as a proxy for prestige, selectivity, worth, etc. That percentage of submitters is for both SAT and and ACT, so those median numbers don't mean quite as much. Also, the type of student who qualifies for Pitt's Honors College is absolutely in the same peer group as the students who matriculate at those other schools named above, their families just may not want to pay 80k+ for the privilege.

Professors notice and relate to the best, most engaged students in a class. I never felt "held back" by peers at Pitt. And I was an NMF at Pitt at a time when it was considered less selective. I think this a "run your own race" issue...other people's SATs have little to do with how much a student learns. Feeling underchallenged...do an honors paper, ask for extra reading, get a research assistantship, etc. I'd say coursework varies more due to the profs than the classmates.

This is a major difference--professors' commitment to UG teaching and research. That would be my only reservation about turning down Grinnell for Pitt. But if in the Honors College, shouldn't be a big issue.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Peer group:
Grinnell: 1480, 51% submitting
Pittsburgh: 1360, 50% submitting

Grinnell's median and percent submitting are on par with schools like BC, UVA, W&M, BU, WFU, etc. while Pittsburgh's stats are closer to Virginia Tech's.

This stat is a little misleading, as are any when people want to hang their hat on the SAT score as a proxy for prestige, selectivity, worth, etc. That percentage of submitters is for both SAT and and ACT, so those median numbers don't mean quite as much. Also, the type of student who qualifies for Pitt's Honors College is absolutely in the same peer group as the students who matriculate at those other schools named above, their families just may not want to pay 80k+ for the privilege.

Professors notice and relate to the best, most engaged students in a class. I never felt "held back" by peers at Pitt. And I was an NMF at Pitt at a time when it was considered less selective. I think this a "run your own race" issue...other people's SATs have little to do with how much a student learns. Feeling underchallenged...do an honors paper, ask for extra reading, get a research assistantship, etc. I'd say coursework varies more due to the profs than the classmates.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Peer group:
Grinnell: 1480, 51% submitting
Pittsburgh: 1360, 50% submitting

Grinnell's median and percent submitting are on par with schools like BC, UVA, W&M, BU, WFU, etc. while Pittsburgh's stats are closer to Virginia Tech's.

Grinnell has about 400 students per class. You’d better hope they’re all top notch because there’s no one else for miles.

Pitt has about 4500 students per class. You could just hang out with the top 10% at Pitt and have a larger peer group than the entire school at Grinnell.

I am a Pitt grad. That's exactly how it feels. There are plenty of top of the class students. Anyway, college is mainly about what the student themself puts into it, not the credentials of the people seated behind the student in the lecture hall. Btw, I left PSU Honors College for Pitt because University Park was not a fun place...too isolated, too socially focused on watching sports and drinking, and the Honors Program was too slanted towards guys & engineers at that time. I hear they have fixed it. But I really think it makes a big difference to be in a city where you can escape from an undergrad monoculture.

I also think it's true that many SLACs have low national brand awareness and they do best in their home regions. That doesn't mean they aren't good schools - it means no immediate recognition bump from an HR person/employer unless tapping the alumni network or in region.

I also feel Pitt will have more internship and research opportunities. The scale of a major research university is much different.

Anonymous wrote:Peer group:
Grinnell: 1480, 51% submitting
Pittsburgh: 1360, 50% submitting

Grinnell's median and percent submitting are on par with schools like BC, UVA, W&M, BU, WFU, etc. while Pittsburgh's stats are closer to Virginia Tech's.

This stat is a little misleading, as are any when people want to hang their hat on the SAT score as a proxy for prestige, selectivity, worth, etc. That percentage of submitters is for both SAT and and ACT, so those median numbers don't mean quite as much. Also, the type of student who qualifies for Pitt's Honors College is absolutely in the same peer group as the students who matriculate at those other schools named above, their families just may not want to pay 80k+ for the privilege.

My son graduated from Grinnell a few years ago. He loved the school, but he was looking for the feel of a SLAC. However, know that Grinnell lacks the school spirit of a big state school like Pitt. Your son is looking at two very different schools - opposite ends of the spectrum. If he does not like the small size of Grinnell now, it will be claustrophobic for him after a year or two. My son did say that by the end of his senior year he was ready to go.

I actually think there are lots of people who like both cities and beautiful rural environments. If there weren’t, there wouldn’t be so many city dwellers with country houses. I’ve lived in the middle of DC for over 20 years but I know I could be happy in a house in rural Vermont. All that’s to say that I can see how a kid could find both schools appealing! (Also, my senior applied to both small liberal arts schools and large publics, including Pitt, as did many of his friends.)

I can only see a student being torn between these two schools if they are the rare person who is truly happy and comfortable in any environment or surroundings and with any group of people. Most people are going to have a preference in geography or size - which you say your kid does, so it should be an obvious choice.

Anonymous wrote:What’s the issue? He clearly won’t like Grinnell if he doesn’t like small colleges or rural environments; that’s kinda grinnell’s entire essence. It’s like asking if you should go to New York if you hate cities and have a sensitivity to loud noise.

+1, my question is why he applied to Grinnell in the first place? It’s clear he wasn’t ever going to go.

What’s the issue? He clearly won’t like Grinnell if he doesn’t like small colleges or rural environments; that’s kinda grinnell’s entire essence. It’s like asking if you should go to New York if you hate cities and have a sensitivity to loud noise.

Anonymous wrote:Peer group:
Grinnell: 1480, 51% submitting
Pittsburgh: 1360, 50% submitting

Grinnell's median and percent submitting are on par with schools like BC, UVA, W&M, BU, WFU, etc. while Pittsburgh's stats are closer to Virginia Tech's.

Grinnell has about 400 students per class. You’d better hope they’re all top notch because there’s no one else for miles.

Pitt has about 4500 students per class. You could just hang out with the top 10% at Pitt and have a larger peer group than the entire school at Grinnell.

Anonymous wrote:Grinell is a couple of blocks from a walkable, Democratic, college town downtown with good restaurants, coffee houses, movie theater, hotel, etc. A lot of suburban campuses can't offer that. And it's just an hour away from Democratic Des Moine and Iowa City. But it's not a city.

Pitt is definitely not suburban.

Anonymous wrote:Peer group:
Grinnell: 1480, 51% submitting
Pittsburgh: 1360, 50% submitting

Grinnell's median and percent submitting are on par with schools like BC, UVA, W&M, BU, WFU, etc. while Pittsburgh's stats are closer to Virginia Tech's.

On the other hand, a lot of folks have never heard of Grinnell and those who do well at Pitt have lots of opportunities. This shouldn't be a hard choice if your kid has reservations about being at a smaller school in a small town.

Peer group:
Grinnell: 1480, 51% submitting
Pittsburgh: 1360, 50% submitting

Grinnell's median and percent submitting are on par with schools like BC, UVA, W&M, BU, WFU, etc. while Pittsburgh's stats are closer to Virginia Tech's.

They are nothing alike. So, it should be an easy decision for your child.