Anonymous
Post 12/04/2024 15:15     Subject: Re:SP500 and RTO brain drain
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I've talked to a lot of working mothers who've shared that they will be really stretched if they have to RTO full time. It's not the cost of child care for most of them - it's about missing hours a day with their families, about work life balance. They want to get the work done, even after the kids are bed. They aren't the ones abusing telework and watching a toddler while claiming they're working. A 9-year-old can get herself a snack and play independently until mom is off at 5pm - but they can't be home alone. And this seems especially impactful for single parents.

Sure, there are tons of dads who do tons of childcare. And full-time RTO may suck for them, too. But it seems like the evidence is that it's the women who quit.

For employers looking to hire top talent, you're going to lose a lot of quality employees by requiring butts in seats. A lot of jobs work just fine with hybrid or even full-time telework. For employers looking to reduce their rolls, it's an interesting strategy and not one that leads to top talent staying, it seems. I'm hoping we see a lot more data about RTO mandates.




Explain the golf course near me that is packed w30-50 year old men on weekdays since covid? pre-covid was just old retired people on weekdays.

Why are you at the golf course in the middle of the work day?
Anonymous
Post 12/04/2024 15:01     Subject: SP500 and RTO brain drain
Anonymous wrote:I am so tired of hearing the complaints of RTO. The pandemic was a special TEMPORARY event that propelled these decisions. Everyone’s life has returned to normal (school, travel, etc), but yet those working from home think RTO shouldn’t affect them. Quit, don’t quit, nobody cares.


I only worked in the office 1dayv a week for years before Covid. There was nothing special or temporary about the option. It was based on sound business decisions. Stick to topics you know something about.
Anonymous
Post 12/04/2024 14:54     Subject: Re:SP500 and RTO brain drain
Anonymous wrote:I've talked to a lot of working mothers who've shared that they will be really stretched if they have to RTO full time. It's not the cost of child care for most of them - it's about missing hours a day with their families, about work life balance. They want to get the work done, even after the kids are bed. They aren't the ones abusing telework and watching a toddler while claiming they're working. A 9-year-old can get herself a snack and play independently until mom is off at 5pm - but they can't be home alone. And this seems especially impactful for single parents.

Sure, there are tons of dads who do tons of childcare. And full-time RTO may suck for them, too. But it seems like the evidence is that it's the women who quit.

For employers looking to hire top talent, you're going to lose a lot of quality employees by requiring butts in seats. A lot of jobs work just fine with hybrid or even full-time telework. For employers looking to reduce their rolls, it's an interesting strategy and not one that leads to top talent staying, it seems. I'm hoping we see a lot more data about RTO mandates.




Explain the golf course near me that is packed w30-50 year old men on weekdays since covid? pre-covid was just old retired people on weekdays.
Anonymous
Post 12/04/2024 14:42     Subject: SP500 and RTO brain drain
Revolut a huge start up which was all remote pretty much and has no plans to do RTO or require days in the office is building a gigantic headquarters for staff in London.

Why the younger employees meaning 21-29 who are single or pre-kids are sick of sitting home alone and pushed the company to build a headquarters. Its in Canary Wharf.

I think if you have younger workers and a cool office in a cool location they want to go to work.

My kids have friends who moved to Manhattan by themselves after college graduation to work at Goldman, JP Morgan, PwC etc They did not move there to sit alone in a tiny walk up studio apt all day or jammed with several roomates in a two bedroom with split walls to hold four people.

But there friends hired in DC want to work from home as office 80 percent empty and full of 50 something people. No youth or energy.

Anonymous
Post 12/03/2024 19:38     Subject: SP500 and RTO brain drain
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:WFH was a gift sent from the heavens during the pandemic. We should keep it

Otherwise, I hope the Chinese or Fauci or whoever release another super contagious virus for another pandemic. I’d love to WFH indefinitely


This is a wildly inappropriate thing to say.


DP. But it’s true. All we need is another pandemic of reason to not RTO, and WFH is here to stay.

A depression that forces companies to sell office buildings would probably do it. Or another labor shortage which might just happen.

Technology has evolved and office buildings should increasingly be a thing of the past.
Anonymous
Post 12/03/2024 19:14     Subject: SP500 and RTO brain drain
Anonymous wrote:WFH was a gift sent from the heavens during the pandemic. We should keep it

Otherwise, I hope the Chinese or Fauci or whoever release another super contagious virus for another pandemic. I’d love to WFH indefinitely


This is a wildly inappropriate thing to say.
Anonymous
Post 12/03/2024 17:39     Subject: SP500 and RTO brain drain
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Amazon has the managerial talent and technology to actually enforce and implement RTO. The federal government isn’t even close to having either.


Amazon is doing a quiet layoff... they want to downsize.


... which is the goal of government RTO; enforce return to office so a bunch of people leave while implementing a general hiring freeze so the positions go unfilled and are eventually eliminated. Knock on bonus is that the remaining staff are overworked and maybe they'll quit too.


The thing is salaries and benefits(civilian and military) are not a huge percentage of the federal government. 6.75 trillion budget about 400 billion is employee compensation. People with little understanding of the government do not know the majority of the expenses of the US government is sending out checks/transfers of money to the states.


That's all true, but the point of eliminating federal positions is not to save money. It's to weaken the agencies and prevent them from enforcing the law.


But in that, there's a disagreement between the sides on how much is enforcing law and how much is creating it.
Anonymous
Post 12/03/2024 16:46     Subject: SP500 and RTO brain drain
WFH was a gift sent from the heavens during the pandemic. We should keep it

Otherwise, I hope the Chinese or Fauci or whoever release another super contagious virus for another pandemic. I’d love to WFH indefinitely
Anonymous
Post 12/03/2024 08:31     Subject: SP500 and RTO brain drain
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I am so tired of hearing the complaints of RTO. The pandemic was a special TEMPORARY event that propelled these decisions. Everyone’s life has returned to normal (school, travel, etc), but yet those working from home think RTO shouldn’t affect them. Quit, don’t quit, nobody cares.


Except what you’re missing is the nature of work changed and now most interaction is via a screen. The screen promotes sharing of documents and makes it better to conduct a meeting.

If we had been using faxes before Covid would you argue that we should drop email and return to faxing documents?


Unfortunately, the people that pay you don’t agree.


Don't agree that meetings and calls work better with a screen? I'm pretty sure they agree. Teams isn't going anywhere.

WFH has been better for measurable productivity, hiring, and retention. That's undisputed among anyone who keeps data on those.
RTO is about layoffs and commercial real estate values. Layoffs happen, but call it what it is instead of pretending there's some moral weight to working in an office building.
Anonymous
Post 12/03/2024 08:24     Subject: SP500 and RTO brain drain
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I am so tired of hearing the complaints of RTO. The pandemic was a special TEMPORARY event that propelled these decisions. Everyone’s life has returned to normal (school, travel, etc), but yet those working from home think RTO shouldn’t affect them. Quit, don’t quit, nobody cares.


Except what you’re missing is the nature of work changed and now most interaction is via a screen. The screen promotes sharing of documents and makes it better to conduct a meeting.

If we had been using faxes before Covid would you argue that we should drop email and return to faxing documents?


Unfortunately, the people that pay you don’t agree.


I guess. The people who pay me also work remotely. Very few senior leaders at any company are sitting in an office 5 days a week. Most are traveling and using video conferences.

Anonymous
Post 12/03/2024 08:23     Subject: SP500 and RTO brain drain
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I am so tired of hearing the complaints of RTO. The pandemic was a special TEMPORARY event that propelled these decisions. Everyone’s life has returned to normal (school, travel, etc), but yet those working from home think RTO shouldn’t affect them. Quit, don’t quit, nobody cares.


Except what you’re missing is the nature of work changed and now most interaction is via a screen. The screen promotes sharing of documents and makes it better to conduct a meeting.

If we had been using faxes before Covid would you argue that we should drop email and return to faxing documents?


Unfortunately, the people that pay you don’t agree.
Anonymous
Post 12/03/2024 08:19     Subject: Re:SP500 and RTO brain drain
I've talked to a lot of working mothers who've shared that they will be really stretched if they have to RTO full time. It's not the cost of child care for most of them - it's about missing hours a day with their families, about work life balance. They want to get the work done, even after the kids are bed. They aren't the ones abusing telework and watching a toddler while claiming they're working. A 9-year-old can get herself a snack and play independently until mom is off at 5pm - but they can't be home alone. And this seems especially impactful for single parents.

Sure, there are tons of dads who do tons of childcare. And full-time RTO may suck for them, too. But it seems like the evidence is that it's the women who quit.

For employers looking to hire top talent, you're going to lose a lot of quality employees by requiring butts in seats. A lot of jobs work just fine with hybrid or even full-time telework. For employers looking to reduce their rolls, it's an interesting strategy and not one that leads to top talent staying, it seems. I'm hoping we see a lot more data about RTO mandates.


Anonymous
Post 12/03/2024 07:57     Subject: SP500 and RTO brain drain
Anonymous wrote:I am so tired of hearing the complaints of RTO. The pandemic was a special TEMPORARY event that propelled these decisions. Everyone’s life has returned to normal (school, travel, etc), but yet those working from home think RTO shouldn’t affect them. Quit, don’t quit, nobody cares.


Why do you persist in thinking WFH is a covid thing? I've been teleworking since 2011. All covid did was force the technology to improve, and standardize (make more fair) what used to be individually negotiated situations.
Anonymous
Post 12/03/2024 06:51     Subject: SP500 and RTO brain drain
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I am so tired of hearing the complaints of RTO. The pandemic was a special TEMPORARY event that propelled these decisions. Everyone’s life has returned to normal (school, travel, etc), but yet those working from home think RTO shouldn’t affect them. Quit, don’t quit, nobody cares.


+1


We were working from home long before Covid.
Anonymous
Post 12/03/2024 06:48     Subject: Re:SP500 and RTO brain drain
Companies may lose one or two but not entire workforces. My company has been through this a year and a half ago. Everyone came back to work and is there today. Except one who had a baby.