Anonymous
Post 10/06/2024 14:17     Subject: What HHI is indisputably RICH in a HCOL area?
Looking at it a bit differently, from a spending perspective.

If you spend 500k a year, excluding housing, I think the lifestyle will be that of someone who is rich. High end clothes, newish luxury cars, 5 star vacations, vip seating at events, going out is style. That’s about 42k a month in discretionary spending.

How much does that require? Depends on how much you want to save and how fancy a house you want. But I think 500k of discretionary spending covers everything else for a Rich level spend.
Anonymous
Post 10/06/2024 12:44     Subject: What HHI is indisputably RICH in a HCOL area?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:NW over 10M.

Income is meaningless. If you bring in 1M and burn through it in a year, you're still poor.... and probably stupid too.


I take your point but sort of disagree. Like the other poster above, our hhi is around $2m. Obviously we are very lucky and don’t have to worry about money. But at that income, we also can’t just get whatever we want because as pp rightly points out, it would be very easy to burn through that money and not have much left over. Three one week vacations a year overseas on business class and high end hotels would be $150k for a family of 4. And then if you’re a clothes shopper, it would be really easy to spend $5k a month. Lots of things like this we -could- do (second houses, expensive private schools, college and grad school, home renovations, dining out, expensive cars every two years). Things that people at our income often spend money on and none of which, by itself, is extravagant. But if we did ALL those things, we would be in the red. So at our income, of course we are rich, but we’re not rich enough to not think about money at all. I work in biglaw and have a lot of partners who make a lot more than me like $3-4m and honestly they are all the same. None of them can just stop thinking about money. Also, most of us didn’t make that kind of money until middle age or later, and then there’s always the question of how much longer can I keep making this money (or so I have to keep making this money).

I would assume $5m or even better $10m takes those questions away and you can spend pretty much what you want (save for yachts and jets).


Pp with 2-3m HHI. We have neighbors and colleagues who probably have a similar or even lower HHI and they really live it up. Our one neighbor is in the same field and likely has lower HHI but they live a very flashy life. DH has colleagues who drive around Ferraris and have jet memberships, yachts, etc. I’m sure many people would consider us rich but we live a relatively modest lifestyle. DH earns a seven figure bonus and we always invest that. We live off his base.


Maybe we are misunderstanding the point. Do we define rich by how much money we have to hand (by income one way or another) or by what we spend? You are still rich with a 7 figure bonus you invest every year (!) even if you feel like you are spending enough for a modest income. The fact you feel like you would spend all your money if you took 4 biz class vacations a year, $60k on clothes, and a second house…the fact that you *could* do those things makes you rich. You are still rich even if you choose to spend modestly and sack the money away for some future desire.
Anonymous
Post 10/06/2024 12:39     Subject: What HHI is indisputably RICH in a HCOL area?
Anonymous wrote:NW over 10M.

Income is meaningless. If you bring in 1M and burn through it in a year, you're still poor.... and probably stupid too.

Stupid yes, but not poor.
Anonymous
Post 10/06/2024 12:38     Subject: Re:What HHI is indisputably RICH in a HCOL area?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:5 mil a year minimum.


This sounds right.

We have a $2-3m HHI and while we know our incomes puts us in the top 1%, we are not that rich. We only recently started flying business class and that is only when prices are reasonable. We will upgrade for $2k but not 5k per person.


Anonymous
Post 10/06/2024 12:36     Subject: What HHI is indisputably RICH in a HCOL area?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:NW over 10M.

Income is meaningless. If you bring in 1M and burn through it in a year, you're still poor.... and probably stupid too.


I take your point but sort of disagree. Like the other poster above, our hhi is around $2m. Obviously we are very lucky and don’t have to worry about money. But at that income, we also can’t just get whatever we want because as pp rightly points out, it would be very easy to burn through that money and not have much left over. Three one week vacations a year overseas on business class and high end hotels would be $150k for a family of 4. And then if you’re a clothes shopper, it would be really easy to spend $5k a month. Lots of things like this we -could- do (second houses, expensive private schools, college and grad school, home renovations, dining out, expensive cars every two years). Things that people at our income often spend money on and none of which, by itself, is extravagant. But if we did ALL those things, we would be in the red. So at our income, of course we are rich, but we’re not rich enough to not think about money at all. I work in biglaw and have a lot of partners who make a lot more than me like $3-4m and honestly they are all the same. None of them can just stop thinking about money. Also, most of us didn’t make that kind of money until middle age or later, and then there’s always the question of how much longer can I keep making this money (or so I have to keep making this money).

I would assume $5m or even better $10m takes those questions away and you can spend pretty much what you want (save for yachts and jets).


Pp with 2-3m HHI. We have neighbors and colleagues who probably have a similar or even lower HHI and they really live it up. Our one neighbor is in the same field and likely has lower HHI but they live a very flashy life. DH has colleagues who drive around Ferraris and have jet memberships, yachts, etc. I’m sure many people would consider us rich but we live a relatively modest lifestyle. DH earns a seven figure bonus and we always invest that. We live off his base.


And your neighbors and colleagues who live it up may not have much saved. We didn't start flying business routinely until we were UHNW. Before that, we might do business for us (not the kids) for Europe trips. The kids (teens) would sit tighter in economy plus/premium. We would search for discounted hotels. Now at UHNW, we all take business (sometimes the kids are still premium if it's too much---we view they should be happy the are not stuck in basic economy and grateful they are getting such nice vacations--they don't need to be spoiled by business). But the $50K for a 7-10 day trip to Europe is an accurate cost. We do it now, but didn't at $10-15M NW.
We have enough saved that now we can generate $1M (pre tax) yearly and retire in mid-50s. We can do that for 40 years and still leave each kid $5-7M. And in reality, we likely won't spend that much after 70/75 (less travel, might only want one home then, etc so costs will go down).

Anonymous
Post 10/06/2024 12:36     Subject: What HHI is indisputably RICH in a HCOL area?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:NW over 10M.

Income is meaningless. If you bring in 1M and burn through it in a year, you're still poor.... and probably stupid too.


I take your point but sort of disagree. Like the other poster above, our hhi is around $2m. Obviously we are very lucky and don’t have to worry about money. But at that income, we also can’t just get whatever we want because as pp rightly points out, it would be very easy to burn through that money and not have much left over. Three one week vacations a year overseas on business class and high end hotels would be $150k for a family of 4. And then if you’re a clothes shopper, it would be really easy to spend $5k a month. Lots of things like this we -could- do (second houses, expensive private schools, college and grad school, home renovations, dining out, expensive cars every two years). Things that people at our income often spend money on and none of which, by itself, is extravagant. But if we did ALL those things, we would be in the red. So at our income, of course we are rich, but we’re not rich enough to not think about money at all. I work in biglaw and have a lot of partners who make a lot more than me like $3-4m and honestly they are all the same. None of them can just stop thinking about money. Also, most of us didn’t make that kind of money until middle age or later, and then there’s always the question of how much longer can I keep making this money (or so I have to keep making this money).

I would assume $5m or even better $10m takes those questions away and you can spend pretty much what you want (save for yachts and jets).


Pp with 2-3m HHI. We have neighbors and colleagues who probably have a similar or even lower HHI and they really live it up. Our one neighbor is in the same field and likely has lower HHI but they live a very flashy life. DH has colleagues who drive around Ferraris and have jet memberships, yachts, etc. I’m sure many people would consider us rich but we live a relatively modest lifestyle. DH earns a seven figure bonus and we always invest that. We live off his base.


I have friends in the 1 to 3 million hhi range (we’re at 2m) and you get into no savings territory very quickly. My best friend has a hhi of $1.2m (he makes 1m and she makes the balance) and he’s taken on a lot of debt for dumb financial decisions, still carrying med school loans at age 50, and has a penchant for buying semi expensive cars every year or two (kids got bmws, he has a fun jeep plus an every day Audi, wife has brand new Audi) . Kids in public school, vacations are pretty on par with their peers. She confides in me they have zero savings, no retirement, and tons of debt. So point being is that seven figure incomes does not put you in devil may care territory; you still need to be mindful of your spending.
Anonymous
Post 10/06/2024 11:13     Subject: What HHI is indisputably RICH in a HCOL area?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:NW over 10M.

Income is meaningless. If you bring in 1M and burn through it in a year, you're still poor.... and probably stupid too.


I take your point but sort of disagree. Like the other poster above, our hhi is around $2m. Obviously we are very lucky and don’t have to worry about money. But at that income, we also can’t just get whatever we want because as pp rightly points out, it would be very easy to burn through that money and not have much left over. Three one week vacations a year overseas on business class and high end hotels would be $150k for a family of 4. And then if you’re a clothes shopper, it would be really easy to spend $5k a month. Lots of things like this we -could- do (second houses, expensive private schools, college and grad school, home renovations, dining out, expensive cars every two years). Things that people at our income often spend money on and none of which, by itself, is extravagant. But if we did ALL those things, we would be in the red. So at our income, of course we are rich, but we’re not rich enough to not think about money at all. I work in biglaw and have a lot of partners who make a lot more than me like $3-4m and honestly they are all the same. None of them can just stop thinking about money. Also, most of us didn’t make that kind of money until middle age or later, and then there’s always the question of how much longer can I keep making this money (or so I have to keep making this money).

I would assume $5m or even better $10m takes those questions away and you can spend pretty much what you want (save for yachts and jets).


Pp with 2-3m HHI. We have neighbors and colleagues who probably have a similar or even lower HHI and they really live it up. Our one neighbor is in the same field and likely has lower HHI but they live a very flashy life. DH has colleagues who drive around Ferraris and have jet memberships, yachts, etc. I’m sure many people would consider us rich but we live a relatively modest lifestyle. DH earns a seven figure bonus and we always invest that. We live off his base.
Anonymous
Post 10/06/2024 10:29     Subject: What HHI is indisputably RICH in a HCOL area?
$25-30M in liquid, non retirement assets

Or about $2m+ a year of income

25-30m will get you close to 1M a year of income with a low tax bill. You can do most things in like with 70k/mo post tax.
Anonymous
Post 10/06/2024 10:17     Subject: What HHI is indisputably RICH in a HCOL area?
Anonymous wrote:$0


If I was indisputably rich I would not work. I would make money off my assets.


You’re confusing income with wage earnings. “Making money off [my] assets” is still income.

But that’s sort of my response - if the majority of your income is from earnings, you’re not truly rich.
Anonymous
Post 10/06/2024 09:58     Subject: What HHI is indisputably RICH in a HCOL area?
$0


If I was indisputably rich I would not work. I would make money off my assets.
Anonymous
Post 10/06/2024 09:26     Subject: Re:What HHI is indisputably RICH in a HCOL area?
I live in a high cost suburb in NY. $1MM+ consistent HHI is probably wealthy. In Manhattan that doesn’t go nearly as far and you will be surrounded by far wealthier peers.

what is “considered” wealthy is somewhat relative and hyper localized. Will literally vary by zip code, your immediate neighborhood and peer group.

Anonymous
Post 10/06/2024 08:53     Subject: What HHI is indisputably RICH in a HCOL area?
Between 500k and 1M?
Anonymous
Post 10/06/2024 08:41     Subject: What HHI is indisputably RICH in a HCOL area?
1 million in income plus $20 million in assets MINIMUM
Anonymous
Post 10/06/2024 08:40     Subject: Re:What HHI is indisputably RICH in a HCOL area?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:5 mil a year minimum.


This sounds right.

We have a $2-3m HHI and while we know our incomes puts us in the top 1%, we are not that rich. We only recently started flying business class and that is only when prices are reasonable. We will upgrade for $2k but not 5k per person.


You serious, Clark?
Anonymous
Post 10/06/2024 08:19     Subject: What HHI is indisputably RICH in a HCOL area?
Anonymous wrote:NW over 10M.

Income is meaningless. If you bring in 1M and burn through it in a year, you're still poor.... and probably stupid too.


I take your point but sort of disagree. Like the other poster above, our hhi is around $2m. Obviously we are very lucky and don’t have to worry about money. But at that income, we also can’t just get whatever we want because as pp rightly points out, it would be very easy to burn through that money and not have much left over. Three one week vacations a year overseas on business class and high end hotels would be $150k for a family of 4. And then if you’re a clothes shopper, it would be really easy to spend $5k a month. Lots of things like this we -could- do (second houses, expensive private schools, college and grad school, home renovations, dining out, expensive cars every two years). Things that people at our income often spend money on and none of which, by itself, is extravagant. But if we did ALL those things, we would be in the red. So at our income, of course we are rich, but we’re not rich enough to not think about money at all. I work in biglaw and have a lot of partners who make a lot more than me like $3-4m and honestly they are all the same. None of them can just stop thinking about money. Also, most of us didn’t make that kind of money until middle age or later, and then there’s always the question of how much longer can I keep making this money (or so I have to keep making this money).

I would assume $5m or even better $10m takes those questions away and you can spend pretty much what you want (save for yachts and jets).