I think it’s the same. Bc of social media, we hear about it in real time - not the case when I was in college decades ago.
I do think some parents feel they should be totally hands-off, and this could drive a teen into isolation. It’s your kid, be there, be present.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kids at SEC schools like Alabama, Georgia, and Tennessee aren't having the problems described in this thread. They're having fun, loving life, tailgating and watching great football. And the academics are much better than they get credit for. Something to think about as your kids, perhaps as your behest, stress themselves out in high school and make themselves miserable to get into an "elite" college where they'll just be even more stressed out and miserable.

Drop-out rates within 6 years:

Alabama: 28%
Georgia: 12%
UTK: 28%
Penn State: 15%
Pitt: 16%
Umass: 17%

This makes sense to me, because I believe there is a large delta between Georgia and UTK/Alabama.

I won't even list the "high stress" schools because their drop-out rates are at most 5%, and most are just 1%-2%.

You missed the point of the thread. No one said kids aren't passing their classes and graduating at the high-stress schools. Just that they're miserable, many of them not making friends or creating the memories that we so fondly look back on from our college days. Kids don't drop out of Alabama or Tennessee because they're depressed but because they're having TOO much fun. They party and get laid so much that they forget to go to class or study for finals.

I love that everyone answering this thread is literally part of the problem. We, as parents, did this. We are not willing to change it either. God forbid there is an illusion that another kid or group of kids will get a leg up on your kid. Criticize the methods of other parents and the related behaviors without taking any accountability. Declare a handful of schools "worthy" and put down other kids and families who can't or don't want the "top" schools.

Take a look in the mirror, everyone! You're supporting this nonsense, voting for people who support this nonsense, pay obscene amounts of money for it all too. What are you willing to do to stop it? Are you willing to tell your middle school kid that it's ridiculous to travel across the country to play sports? Are you willing to tell your kid that taking 12 APs is too much and you'd like them to get a job, do chores at home, and hang out with siblings instead? Are you willing to forego paid college essay consultants for a less eloquent essay?

Anonymous wrote:My thoughts:

- More kids than ever in college. Many shouldn't be there. That creates misery.
- They have been achievement factories since they were born. Pre-k admissions, k admissions, signing up for every single AP, professional-level sports commitments, ECs, volunteering, "research" at 14 years old. There are no children just out playing in mud or biking in the neighborhood all summer. They are no longer allowed to be kids. Nevermind getting in trouble with the law - your life is over if that happens to you.
- We are an insanely individualistic society. Dorms and common spaces are not social, communal places any longer. Kids gravitate toward "like" and don't pay attention to anything else around them. There are no doors open, baking cookies, everyone watch a soap opera in the tv room kind of environment. You need to know your niche from day 1 and jump in. If you don't, you will be left behind.
- We are less and less social. Studies have shown kids don't hang out with peers as often as they used to. They sit on their phones and don't participate in a more natural way (it's all about the resume, or organized things). Loneliness is rampant.
- It's too expensive to attend, which causes parents to expect a return on investment and be over involved.

I feel absolutely horrible for kids today. I really wish parents would stop with all of the overachievement/developmentally inappropriate resume building. I wish schools would not allow more than 3-4 activities to be entered into the common app. No more tragedy porn essays. More education and encouragement/celebration of the trades and other non-college careers.

2013 was the peak year for college attendance. There are 1 million fewer college students, including at 4-year residential colleges, compared to 2013.

It feels more frantic because everyone now seems to want the same 100-150 schools. Behind the scenes, you have places like Indiana University of PA or Shippensburg that are 40% smaller.

Anonymous wrote:Agree with others. Kids have no resilience. They are helicoptered to perfection. If they don’t get an A, the parents call their teacher (or the principal) and complain so now everyone gets an A. In college, when in theory, they fall apart. In weeder classes (which they are all in because their helicopter parents require them to
Major in CS, engineering or pre-meds types of majors) Cs are not uncommon and they freak out.

People are doing their kids no favors with the intense helicoptering. Let them struggle or fail. Let them figure it out!

The number of freshman parents looking for computer science tutors on the Cornell parents Facebook page is shocking.

I think the phones are a big piece. They haven't spent their teens learning to socialize face-to-face and push through an uncomfortable social moment by talking with someone they don't know. It's just so easy to hide in your phone.

You have to be willing to try new things and new people over and over again.

Both my kids (and I!) had a hard time finding their place 1st year. I made sure to emphasize that it is totally normal, most people don't meet their BFFs on day one, social media is not real. If you end 1st semester with a few friendly acquaintances you are doing well. Parents overreacting to normal struggles doesn't help.

My senior who thought the social stuff was way harder than expected in 1st year now has a good group of friends, TAs for a professor, plays on rec soccer and volleyball teams, doing great in classes.

My sophomore started off 2nd year so much better than she ended 1st year. A starting-to-be-friends girl in 2nd semester freshman year became a great friend after they did a pre-semester activity together for one of her ECs, she finally followed through on getting support from academic services (ADHD), she's taking more classes with the same group of classmates as in the Spring and feeling more a part of a friend group in her major. I'm barely hearing from her now because she's happy.

Anonymous wrote:I’m struck by how many nice, social kids I know don’t seem to be enjoying college. It seems to be “ok” but their feelings about it seem more subdued and mixed than what I recall. I feel like the freedom of college was a huge positive change for my generation but for this generation maybe the QoL is worse compared to home?

This 💯

I know about 30 kids who are unhappy as freshman. Including mine.

My thoughts:

- More kids than ever in college. Many shouldn't be there. That creates misery.
- They have been achievement factories since they were born. Pre-k admissions, k admissions, signing up for every single AP, professional-level sports commitments, ECs, volunteering, "research" at 14 years old. There are no children just out playing in mud or biking in the neighborhood all summer. They are no longer allowed to be kids. Nevermind getting in trouble with the law - your life is over if that happens to you.
- We are an insanely individualistic society. Dorms and common spaces are not social, communal places any longer. Kids gravitate toward "like" and don't pay attention to anything else around them. There are no doors open, baking cookies, everyone watch a soap opera in the tv room kind of environment. You need to know your niche from day 1 and jump in. If you don't, you will be left behind.
- We are less and less social. Studies have shown kids don't hang out with peers as often as they used to. They sit on their phones and don't participate in a more natural way (it's all about the resume, or organized things). Loneliness is rampant.
- It's too expensive to attend, which causes parents to expect a return on investment and be over involved.

I feel absolutely horrible for kids today. I really wish parents would stop with all of the overachievement/developmentally inappropriate resume building. I wish schools would not allow more than 3-4 activities to be entered into the common app. No more tragedy porn essays. More education and encouragement/celebration of the trades and other non-college careers.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The book "How to raise an Adult" goes into some of this.

Don't look up what the author of that book did with a college freshman...

Then "the Anxious Generation" if you prefer that author. The content is the same. Overparenting has broken a Generation of young adults.

Anonymous wrote:Kids at SEC schools like Alabama, Georgia, and Tennessee aren't having the problems described in this thread. They're having fun, loving life, tailgating and watching great football. And the academics are much better than they get credit for. Something to think about as your kids, perhaps as your behest, stress themselves out in high school and make themselves miserable to get into an "elite" college where they'll just be even more stressed out and miserable.

Drop-out rates within 6 years:

Alabama: 28%
Georgia: 12%
UTK: 28%
Penn State: 15%
Pitt: 16%
Umass: 17%

This makes sense to me, because I believe there is a large delta between Georgia and UTK/Alabama.

I won't even list the "high stress" schools because their drop-out rates are at most 5%, and most are just 1%-2%.

Anonymous wrote:The book "How to raise an Adult" goes into some of this.

Don't look up what the author of that book did with a college freshman...

Anonymous wrote:Kids at SEC schools like Alabama, Georgia, and Tennessee aren't having the problems described in this thread. They're having fun, loving life, tailgating and watching great football. And the academics are much better than they get credit for. Something to think about as your kids, perhaps as your behest, stress themselves out in high school and make themselves miserable to get into an "elite" college where they'll just be even more stressed out and miserable.

You can’t generalize like this. My neighbor dropped out of Alabama this past weekend and is now taking a gap year. These are schools of tens of thousands of individuals. They aren’t all at tailgates.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s possible the struggles were always there, just internalized in a way they’re not today. I had a pretty miserable first year, but I wouldn’t have dared talk about it to friends or family because I felt like I was supposed to be having the time of my life. So I drank heavily.

This resonates with me. I didn’t even know what mental health was when I was a depressed freshman. That wasn’t a concept I had.

Very true. I had no idea what was happening to me was anxiety attacks. I remember them happening in HS and when I told my mom about one, she said it was because I hadn't studied hard enough for a test and was feeling the effects of being ill-prepared. So I never mentioned it again. When I got a bad one, I'd get a pass to the bathroom and lock myself away to "freak out" in private.

It wasn't until I was in a Psych 101 course in college that lightbulbs started going off and I was like "holy sh!t! how has NO adult ever recognized these symptoms in me??"

Anonymous wrote:Helicopter parents were very rare for previous generations. So were participation trophies.

Kids went off to college with a cheery wave from the driveway, not an angst filled send-off and dorm decoration.

I went to college in 1987 and my parents 100% dropped me off, moved me into my room after helping me unpack and make my bed, etc. There were parents everywhere at move in.

Agree with others. Kids have no resilience. They are helicoptered to perfection. If they don’t get an A, the parents call their teacher (or the principal) and complain so now everyone gets an A. In college, when in theory, they fall apart. In weeder classes (which they are all in because their helicopter parents require them to
Major in CS, engineering or pre-meds types of majors) Cs are not uncommon and they freak out.

People are doing their kids no favors with the intense helicoptering. Let them struggle or fail. Let them figure it out!