Anonymous
Post 09/09/2024 20:55     Subject: Running Advice - Prioritize Volume Over All?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Flat feet + running hours each week + half marathon = arthritic knees by 60

Sorry to be harsh, but you haven't said anything about how you plan to avoid longterm damage. Ask any runner over 60. I'd wager all PPs are in their 40s.


Why do you feel the need to spread false information. Please cite the peer reviewed studies that support your claim that distance runs leads to arthritic knees. If you can’t cite it, don’t spread bullshit you heard from your aunt 20 years ago.
You skipped over the flat feet part of the equation. Likely OP is a heel strike runner, since she had a very detailed post with no mention of gait. I think OP is unaware she may have poor gait.


More misinformation. There’s nothing wrong with being a heal strike runner.
ok. Don't be mad at yourself when you realize too late that I was right.
Anonymous
Post 09/09/2024 20:01     Subject: Running Advice - Prioritize Volume Over All?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Flat feet + running hours each week + half marathon = arthritic knees by 60

Sorry to be harsh, but you haven't said anything about how you plan to avoid longterm damage. Ask any runner over 60. I'd wager all PPs are in their 40s.


Why do you feel the need to spread false information. Please cite the peer reviewed studies that support your claim that distance runs leads to arthritic knees. If you can’t cite it, don’t spread bullshit you heard from your aunt 20 years ago.
You skipped over the flat feet part of the equation. Likely OP is a heel strike runner, since she had a very detailed post with no mention of gait. I think OP is unaware she may have poor gait.


More misinformation. There’s nothing wrong with being a heal strike runner.
Anonymous
Post 09/09/2024 09:28     Subject: Re:Running Advice - Prioritize Volume Over All?
Anonymous wrote:Me again. I reread your posts. I think it's possible you're running too much. Are you still biking?

Running is very trendy with fitness influencers right now. Some of their tips are bound to be bad. When you said you were looking at 7 or 8 hours of running -- that sets off an alarm for me. I'm older than you and have been running for a long time. I probably run about 4 hours per week. Two 30-minute runs and two hour-long runs. I don't have any more time than that.


Sorry I didn't see this and both your responses were really helpful. No I haven't been biking, have really eased off everything and have been sitting around wondering how on earth people find time to exercise as much as they say! I have yet to manage that many hours and have been feeling insufficient so this type of 'real people don't do this' is exactly the kind of reality check I needed.

I was doing a lot of concentrated speed work over the summer, 400s and 800s on a track for the 10k. But figured I needed to shift to distance for the half so have been doing much less speed work and more just increasing mileage.
Anonymous
Post 09/09/2024 09:24     Subject: Running Advice - Prioritize Volume Over All?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Flat feet + running hours each week + half marathon = arthritic knees by 60

Sorry to be harsh, but you haven't said anything about how you plan to avoid longterm damage. Ask any runner over 60. I'd wager all PPs are in their 40s.


Why do you feel the need to spread false information. Please cite the peer reviewed studies that support your claim that distance runs leads to arthritic knees. If you can’t cite it, don’t spread bullshit you heard from your aunt 20 years ago.
You skipped over the flat feet part of the equation. Likely OP is a heel strike runner, since she had a very detailed post with no mention of gait. I think OP is unaware she may have poor gait.


I have worked very hard at improving my gait actually and am not a heel striker thanks very much. I also have gotten inserts to help with my flat feet. Ironically I have actually had LESS problems with my feet after increasing my running. And no problems with my knees.
Anonymous
Post 09/08/2024 21:50     Subject: Running Advice - Prioritize Volume Over All?
Two things…First of all. Congrats!!!! Pat yourself on the back and give yourself some grace. Second, even just doing what you are doing if you simply found a late fall race where the temp at start time was below 60 you would see a massive improvement. Did you know that a study looking at 1.8 million marathoners over a 10 year period showed that the optimal temperature was 43.2f!! Why are you trying to PR in the summer? Even if you do focused heat training and your body adjusts to increase your plasma volume, improved vascular function, and better thermal tolerance at the cellular level, you will absolutely run slower as the temps increase. You add in high humidity…game over for your PR chances. You need to account for a significant decrease in performance. Think 8% worse. Don’t try for a PR in the summer
Anonymous
Post 09/08/2024 21:35     Subject: Running Advice - Prioritize Volume Over All?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Flat feet + running hours each week + half marathon = arthritic knees by 60

Sorry to be harsh, but you haven't said anything about how you plan to avoid longterm damage. Ask any runner over 60. I'd wager all PPs are in their 40s.


Why do you feel the need to spread false information. Please cite the peer reviewed studies that support your claim that distance runs leads to arthritic knees. If you can’t cite it, don’t spread bullshit you heard from your aunt 20 years ago.
You skipped over the flat feet part of the equation. Likely OP is a heel strike runner, since she had a very detailed post with no mention of gait. I think OP is unaware she may have poor gait.
Anonymous
Post 09/08/2024 21:27     Subject: Running Advice - Prioritize Volume Over All?
Anonymous wrote:Flat feet + running hours each week + half marathon = arthritic knees by 60

Sorry to be harsh, but you haven't said anything about how you plan to avoid longterm damage. Ask any runner over 60. I'd wager all PPs are in their 40s.


Why do you feel the need to spread false information. Please cite the peer reviewed studies that support your claim that distance runs leads to arthritic knees. If you can’t cite it, don’t spread bullshit you heard from your aunt 20 years ago.
Anonymous
Post 09/08/2024 20:56     Subject: Running Advice - Prioritize Volume Over All?
Flat feet + running hours each week + half marathon = arthritic knees by 60

Sorry to be harsh, but you haven't said anything about how you plan to avoid longterm damage. Ask any runner over 60. I'd wager all PPs are in their 40s.
Anonymous
Post 09/03/2024 21:07     Subject: Running Advice - Prioritize Volume Over All?
Also make sure you're not just doing junk miles. Don't run every day. Seriously. Run 3-4 times a week and do something else on the other days- weights, the bike, the arc trainer. When people tell me they are running every day, that makes me worry for them.
Anonymous
Post 09/03/2024 21:05     Subject: Running Advice - Prioritize Volume Over All?
I'd do speed work if I was trying to increase my speed. (Sounds obvious, right?) I did weekly track work for that- 1-1.5 miles warmup, 2.5-3 miles of laps (like 10-12 400's or 6 800's), mile of cooldown.

But if I were trying to increase my distance I would focus on that, not speed. You can't focus on both at the same time. So if you're trying to get faster, keep your distance the same and hit the track once a week. If you're trying to go longer, do an increasingly longer run once a week.
Anonymous
Post 09/03/2024 11:56     Subject: Re:Running Advice - Prioritize Volume Over All?
Me again. I reread your posts. I think it's possible you're running too much. Are you still biking?

Running is very trendy with fitness influencers right now. Some of their tips are bound to be bad. When you said you were looking at 7 or 8 hours of running -- that sets off an alarm for me. I'm older than you and have been running for a long time. I probably run about 4 hours per week. Two 30-minute runs and two hour-long runs. I don't have any more time than that.
Anonymous
Post 09/03/2024 11:47     Subject: Re:Running Advice - Prioritize Volume Over All?
OK, OP, you're off to a great start. I suspect that you are overthinking AND getting too much information from Instagram.

I'm not sure I caught this, but how often are you running? Let's say four days. I would keep three days easy -- easy according to YOU, so let's say 13:30. That's fine.

On one of the days, start playing around with speed. A great way for beginners to start adopting some speedwork is "fartlek." Head out for an ordinary run, let's say 4 miles. Do your first mile slow to warm up. Then, start picking out landmarks to "sprint" to. (Sprinting is relative, too ... just run at a pace that feels hard, but you won't injure yourself. You don't need a watch.) Sprint to a tree, then jog for a while. Then sprint to a mailbox, then jog for a while. Do this over the course of your middle two miles. Then jog for the final mile.)

The next week, do the same thing: Three runs at easy pace (sounds like you are already doing a weekly long run, and that is great). One run with speedwork.

I'd do fartlek for a few weeks. Once your body is getting the hang of it, you could go to a track or a marked trail and start doing some quarter-mile intervals at a "fast" pace.

Another thing that will help you in your race is just getting some experience. Start trying to "pick people off." Pick someone up ahead who looks like you could overtake them. Then do it. Then pick a new person. Repeat, repeat. Practice finishing with a little burst of speed. It's fun!
Anonymous
Post 09/03/2024 11:39     Subject: Running Advice - Prioritize Volume Over All?
Anonymous wrote:There are 10ks every weekend. Sounds like you are down on yourself for your Aug time. Why not just pick one in Nov and run it! I think you will be pleasantly surprised how much better one does in cool vs horribly hot and humid weather.

Good rule of thumb 80% runs zone 2, and about 1 speed work per week. There are many well known websites with plans for half marathons and all race distances. To stop overthinking it, google, print it out, and follow it.


I'm going to start by seconding this person. Then I'll reply separately to tell you what I would do in your shoes.
Anonymous
Post 09/03/2024 11:26     Subject: Running Advice - Prioritize Volume Over All?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Sorry in advance this is long but I'm just getting overwhelmed by instagram feeding me running advice reels. I am a not serious not elite recreational runner. Just to start out here. I'm not breaking any records. My average outdoor pace is like 11:30. So, just to start the conversation where it belongs haha. I'm a 39 year old woman with three small kids who weighed 50 pounds more three years ago and am still overweight. Again, just to establish what kind of person you're giving advice to.

I spent the 1-2 years losing weight on the peloton. Changed my life! I ran a local 10k that year too just to see if I could do it and have run it every year since. The first year I was at 1:08, the second 1:04. This year I was at 1:05 which was disappointing because I had been doing a LOT of speed work and training on tracks to try to beat an hour but the race itself was on a hot and extremely humid day and the whole pack had higher times than previous years so it was what it was.

I have my eyes set on breaking an hour next summer though. Historically I have done more cycling than running during the year and then ramped up running in June/July for the early August race, but with almost no road running because I had a belief that I had bad feet. And I do have flat feet. But I signed up for a half marathon in October to keep me motivated and have been doing a lot more road running the last few weeks to try to get more exposure to the elements and hills/etc and my feet have been alright. I think weight loss and good shoes are doing the heavy lifting here.

Anyway, my primary focus the last few weeks has been adding volume, but I'm slow! Basically I want to use this year to substantially improve my overall running ability, rather than try to rush progress in the weeks before the race next summer. And trying to sign up for things in the interim to help nudge me along. So my goal is to get to 25 miles this week but since I'm slow this takes a lot of TIME. And then I read online I should be aiming for 7-8 hours of running total. This week I did a long run on Sunday (10.5 miles road/trail, 2:20), a hard outdoor run on Tuesday (5miles, 58min). I intended that run to be a mix of easy and moderate but it was hot out so my HR was pretty high the whole time. Yesterday I did an easy climate controlled zone 2 treadmill run (4miles, just under an hour) intentionally trying to make it EASY to keep zone 2. It felt like, embarrassingly slow. But it also felt manageable even though it was another hour of running. So I'm looking at today and tomorrow and just trying to think.

Do I need to prioritize a speed day? Or should I focus on this zone 2 strategy where it feels really manageable to add volume, but is going to take a lot of time.

Additionally, my husband tore his ACL in June which has meant I have to do a not insubstantial amount of yardwork on the weekend including mowing our lawn with a push mower on a challenging large hill. This seems perhaps unrelated but our yard is really challenging to mow and so while I have been trying to have a 'rest' day on Saturday, it frequently involves this lawn mow which is honestly just not a true rest day. I think mowing my lawn is not insignificantly harder than my hour long zone 2 frankly.

Anyway I don't even know what I'm asking. I feel bombarded by running advice videos on social media that I didn't even sign up for its like the internet just sees me logging more miles so is filling my feed with reinforcing concepts which is scary from the big brother perspective but also kind of messing with my head. My current focus was just 'add volume'. I spent the summer working on speed and feel like volume is where I should have started. Does this seem right? Sorry if this is all over the place. And thanks in advance for any thoughts/advice!


Your first paragraph made me smile!

I haven’t been a decent runner in years, but I do remember that I surprised myself on a 10k race by finishing in my fastest time after having run far less than is usually recommended before a race. I did, however, do regular weight training (which I wasn’t doing previously). I don’t know if this is the proper approach though! I just know that it worked for me.

Have you also checked out your running form to make sure it’s not slowing you down? That is what happened to me over time. I just could not go faster on a run unless I was full on sprinting, so no middle ground pace and I could either shuffle or sprint (although I felt like I was working very hard when shuffling, as if I was maximizing the movements/biomechanics of my body). I stopped running entirely, bought barefoot shoes to walk around in, and could finally feel my hamstrings for the first time in years. I had a profoundly impactful realization that because my hamstrings were both weak and really tight, my running form had devolved as a result. I watched a bunch of YouTube videos on form, walked around in our backyard for months, trying out different versions of basically the high knees warm up but also trying to imitate the forms I saw on YouTube, and slowly but surely relearned/taught my body how to run properly. I also started doing active hamstring and hip flexor stretches to decrease the tightness that was, in conjunction with my weakness, holding up my leg from properly raising up high enough. My cadence count went way up, I ran faster when I started again, I finally understood what it feels like to fully activate your hamstrings while running (for me I have to say “pull up high with hamstring, small V (the angle at the back of my knee), swing knee, drop leg”), and my knee that has been hurting for a decade no longer hurts. I also feel very dumb for not studying my form years ago. I had taken my form for granted when I was young so it didn’t used to need intentional adjusting and accountability. Form matters an extra amount if you gained weight from your normal weight, which also happened to me in my form devolving era.

Anyways, sorry to write so much on this. I just wanted to share my anecdotal running improvement experience as a non-competitive runner in a similar life stage to yours!


This is OP here. I never ran before, I was quite the couch potato for the first half of my life so I wouldn't have a good idea of what good form is but I really relate to the 'I shuffle or I sprint' feeling. I have also had extremely tight hamstrings my entire life (never able to touch my toes, even as a kid). And I have always felt like I'm not lifting up my feet enough. Even when I walk I sometimes do that dreaded thing we yell at kids for for dragging feet across the ground (my kids do this!).

A lot to think about here thank you very much! I have been focusing so much on mileage just to like, get used to being on my feet for a longer amount of time to get through this half but this sounds like an excellent thing to think about over the winter to set myself up for success in the spring.
Anonymous
Post 09/02/2024 15:03     Subject: Running Advice - Prioritize Volume Over All?
Anonymous wrote:Sorry in advance this is long but I'm just getting overwhelmed by instagram feeding me running advice reels. I am a not serious not elite recreational runner. Just to start out here. I'm not breaking any records. My average outdoor pace is like 11:30. So, just to start the conversation where it belongs haha. I'm a 39 year old woman with three small kids who weighed 50 pounds more three years ago and am still overweight. Again, just to establish what kind of person you're giving advice to.

I spent the 1-2 years losing weight on the peloton. Changed my life! I ran a local 10k that year too just to see if I could do it and have run it every year since. The first year I was at 1:08, the second 1:04. This year I was at 1:05 which was disappointing because I had been doing a LOT of speed work and training on tracks to try to beat an hour but the race itself was on a hot and extremely humid day and the whole pack had higher times than previous years so it was what it was.

I have my eyes set on breaking an hour next summer though. Historically I have done more cycling than running during the year and then ramped up running in June/July for the early August race, but with almost no road running because I had a belief that I had bad feet. And I do have flat feet. But I signed up for a half marathon in October to keep me motivated and have been doing a lot more road running the last few weeks to try to get more exposure to the elements and hills/etc and my feet have been alright. I think weight loss and good shoes are doing the heavy lifting here.

Anyway, my primary focus the last few weeks has been adding volume, but I'm slow! Basically I want to use this year to substantially improve my overall running ability, rather than try to rush progress in the weeks before the race next summer. And trying to sign up for things in the interim to help nudge me along. So my goal is to get to 25 miles this week but since I'm slow this takes a lot of TIME. And then I read online I should be aiming for 7-8 hours of running total. This week I did a long run on Sunday (10.5 miles road/trail, 2:20), a hard outdoor run on Tuesday (5miles, 58min). I intended that run to be a mix of easy and moderate but it was hot out so my HR was pretty high the whole time. Yesterday I did an easy climate controlled zone 2 treadmill run (4miles, just under an hour) intentionally trying to make it EASY to keep zone 2. It felt like, embarrassingly slow. But it also felt manageable even though it was another hour of running. So I'm looking at today and tomorrow and just trying to think.

Do I need to prioritize a speed day? Or should I focus on this zone 2 strategy where it feels really manageable to add volume, but is going to take a lot of time.

Additionally, my husband tore his ACL in June which has meant I have to do a not insubstantial amount of yardwork on the weekend including mowing our lawn with a push mower on a challenging large hill. This seems perhaps unrelated but our yard is really challenging to mow and so while I have been trying to have a 'rest' day on Saturday, it frequently involves this lawn mow which is honestly just not a true rest day. I think mowing my lawn is not insignificantly harder than my hour long zone 2 frankly.

Anyway I don't even know what I'm asking. I feel bombarded by running advice videos on social media that I didn't even sign up for its like the internet just sees me logging more miles so is filling my feed with reinforcing concepts which is scary from the big brother perspective but also kind of messing with my head. My current focus was just 'add volume'. I spent the summer working on speed and feel like volume is where I should have started. Does this seem right? Sorry if this is all over the place. And thanks in advance for any thoughts/advice!


Your first paragraph made me smile!

I haven’t been a decent runner in years, but I do remember that I surprised myself on a 10k race by finishing in my fastest time after having run far less than is usually recommended before a race. I did, however, do regular weight training (which I wasn’t doing previously). I don’t know if this is the proper approach though! I just know that it worked for me.

Have you also checked out your running form to make sure it’s not slowing you down? That is what happened to me over time. I just could not go faster on a run unless I was full on sprinting, so no middle ground pace and I could either shuffle or sprint (although I felt like I was working very hard when shuffling, as if I was maximizing the movements/biomechanics of my body). I stopped running entirely, bought barefoot shoes to walk around in, and could finally feel my hamstrings for the first time in years. I had a profoundly impactful realization that because my hamstrings were both weak and really tight, my running form had devolved as a result. I watched a bunch of YouTube videos on form, walked around in our backyard for months, trying out different versions of basically the high knees warm up but also trying to imitate the forms I saw on YouTube, and slowly but surely relearned/taught my body how to run properly. I also started doing active hamstring and hip flexor stretches to decrease the tightness that was, in conjunction with my weakness, holding up my leg from properly raising up high enough. My cadence count went way up, I ran faster when I started again, I finally understood what it feels like to fully activate your hamstrings while running (for me I have to say “pull up high with hamstring, small V (the angle at the back of my knee), swing knee, drop leg”), and my knee that has been hurting for a decade no longer hurts. I also feel very dumb for not studying my form years ago. I had taken my form for granted when I was young so it didn’t used to need intentional adjusting and accountability. Form matters an extra amount if you gained weight from your normal weight, which also happened to me in my form devolving era.

Anyways, sorry to write so much on this. I just wanted to share my anecdotal running improvement experience as a non-competitive runner in a similar life stage to yours!