Anonymous
09/04/2024 15:10
Subject: Help me with mornings for my terrible sleeper
Could it be her guanfacine is too high? My kid was overtired and like a ragdoll at 1 mg over her optimal dose.
Anonymous
09/04/2024 08:43
Subject: Help me with mornings for my terrible sleeper
This isn’t something that can easily be fixed, and it is not your fault. That said, DO NOT try to force them to wake up at the ‘correct’ time on weekends, that will cripple them even more than our damnable organizations are doing already. Look up circadian rhythm. Your body has a genetically defined clock for when it wants to sleep, and cannot be meaningfully changed. 1, maybe 2 hours at most.
The proper solution to this would be to let her sleep when she feels like it till she naturally wakes up. This is not realistic because the government has decided to mandate you torture your child for little real benefit. Your other option is medication, which might or might not work.
This is called dspd, and there aren’t any real cures.
This is good for support: https://www.reddit.com/r/DSPD/
https://www.sleepfoundation.org/how-sleep-works/chronotypes
The proper solution to this would be to let her sleep when she feels like it till she naturally wakes up. This is not realistic because the government has decided to mandate you torture your child for little real benefit. Your other option is medication, which might or might not work.
This is called dspd, and there aren’t any real cures.
This is good for support: https://www.reddit.com/r/DSPD/
https://www.sleepfoundation.org/how-sleep-works/chronotypes
Anonymous
05/10/2024 14:24
Subject: Help me with mornings for my terrible sleeper
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I am an adult with ADHD with kids with ADHD, so sleep has been a problem at various times for various people.
Others have said the guafacine may be the problem, but I know many parents try non-stimulant meds like Guafacine first. Guafacine is an alpha agonist. There is another non-stimulant medication Stratterra (generic- Atomoxetine) which is a selective-norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor (SNRI).
I take Straterra and one of my kids has taken it. My personal experience is that it is very helpful - enables me to feel all my emotions without being overpowered by them, and decreases the amount my mind "wanders". I am ADHD Inattentive and the "wandering" is my mind thinking about other things when something is boring or I can't move - it is an aspect of imagination I suppose but on atomoxetine it is much less intrusive when I am focusing on something. When it happens at night it can be difficult to fall asleep.
I also take a stimulant. Truthfully, I don't feel "awake" without it.
One family member has used light therapy to help regulate sleep - a 10,000 lux lamp for 30 mins in the AM while eating breakfast.
Try to be kind to her - I wake my kids kindly and softly at first - with a cheerful voice and gentle pats on the arm. Yes, I might have to do it several times. I try really hard not to be angry since that ruins the whole morning for everyone. I try to remind myself that kids grow and acquire skills at different rates and sleep regulation is one of them.
For myself, I also have to pair things I must do with things I want to do - so is there something motivating you can allow your kid to do, but only at the breakfast table?
Light in the evening also regulates sleep - low lights in the house after 6 pm. In the bedroom, low lights also. I like to read, but it has to be something that hits the sweet spot of interesting enough that I will read but nog so interesting that it makes me alert. Reading occupies my mind enough that I don't ruminate.
Exercise, regular sleep wake hours even on the weekend are all good recs, but sometimes medicine is necessary.
How do you get yourself up at a decent time? I always set my alarm optimistically about the next morning and inevitably procrastinate or snooze till we have to rush!
I have an old digital clock/alarm/radio across the room and I set it to go off loudly to a really annoying radio station so I have to get out of bed and walk across the room to turn it off. Once I'm upright, I go straight to the shower. There's no hope for me to do anything if I don't shower first thing. I also *cannot* get sucked into my phone - so I have it locked down until later.
It's lane - I wish I operated like a normal person, but ADHD hyperfocus is a great strength so - a double-edged sword.
Anonymous
05/10/2024 11:58
Subject: Help me with mornings for my terrible sleeper
Try moving the guanfacine to morning--it caused a lot of bad dreams and sleep disruption for my kid.
Anonymous
05/10/2024 10:38
Subject: Help me with mornings for my terrible sleeper
Anonymous wrote:I am an adult with ADHD with kids with ADHD, so sleep has been a problem at various times for various people.
Others have said the guafacine may be the problem, but I know many parents try non-stimulant meds like Guafacine first. Guafacine is an alpha agonist. There is another non-stimulant medication Stratterra (generic- Atomoxetine) which is a selective-norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor (SNRI).
I take Straterra and one of my kids has taken it. My personal experience is that it is very helpful - enables me to feel all my emotions without being overpowered by them, and decreases the amount my mind "wanders". I am ADHD Inattentive and the "wandering" is my mind thinking about other things when something is boring or I can't move - it is an aspect of imagination I suppose but on atomoxetine it is much less intrusive when I am focusing on something. When it happens at night it can be difficult to fall asleep.
I also take a stimulant. Truthfully, I don't feel "awake" without it.
One family member has used light therapy to help regulate sleep - a 10,000 lux lamp for 30 mins in the AM while eating breakfast.
Try to be kind to her - I wake my kids kindly and softly at first - with a cheerful voice and gentle pats on the arm. Yes, I might have to do it several times. I try really hard not to be angry since that ruins the whole morning for everyone. I try to remind myself that kids grow and acquire skills at different rates and sleep regulation is one of them.
For myself, I also have to pair things I must do with things I want to do - so is there something motivating you can allow your kid to do, but only at the breakfast table?
Light in the evening also regulates sleep - low lights in the house after 6 pm. In the bedroom, low lights also. I like to read, but it has to be something that hits the sweet spot of interesting enough that I will read but nog so interesting that it makes me alert. Reading occupies my mind enough that I don't ruminate.
Exercise, regular sleep wake hours even on the weekend are all good recs, but sometimes medicine is necessary.
How do you get yourself up at a decent time? I always set my alarm optimistically about the next morning and inevitably procrastinate or snooze till we have to rush!
Anonymous
05/10/2024 09:59
Subject: Help me with mornings for my terrible sleeper
I wake my child up with medicine and water ready and they take it with their eyes closed. Have you noticed the label now says take 30m before food? It works!
Anonymous
05/10/2024 07:22
Subject: Help me with mornings for my terrible sleeper
Just commiserating. We're going through this with an older kid and it's rough. Agree with posters who says I'd keep helping her. She's still really young and I also wouldn't worry as much about her being late to school sometimes for now.
Med switch as others have pointed out is probably the way to go.
Med switch as others have pointed out is probably the way to go.
Anonymous
05/10/2024 00:43
Subject: Re:Help me with mornings for my terrible sleeper
You mentioned you went to the sleep specialist at children's (you are so lucky you got in!) but did you do the nighttime study and the daytime one? Narcolepsy also can present as not falling asleep at night. Our kid always was a terrible sleeper. Took us years to get a good sleep study (long story) and in fact, as I long suspected, he has narcolepsy. Make sure to get the studies and repeat them. Things change.
Anonymous
05/09/2024 19:02
Subject: Help me with mornings for my terrible sleeper
Anonymous wrote:clonidine!
I was going to ask this too, have you looked into switching her non-stimulant? Clonidine helps with sleep for my kid who struggled with sleep. It’s not perfect but it helps.
Anonymous
05/09/2024 17:07
Subject: Help me with mornings for my terrible sleeper
Anonymous wrote:You aren't "dressing her like a baby." You are dressing her like the 7 year old, sleep deprived, exhausted, ADHD child she is. And that's ok.
+1
I had to do the same with my daughter (later dx with adhd and autism) at that age. If things were going nowhere, I would give her the choice of me dressing her or her dressing herself quickly. She seemed to enjoy going completely floppy and letting me do it. She is almost 9 now. I’ve gotten her into pjs maybe twice in the past year — after particularly exhausting days and late bedtimes. By the way, my daughter sort of requires a late bedtime. We say bedtime is at 8:30pm, but that’s the time we prompt her to go get ready. She is unmedicated at this time and takes forever. She goes to sleep at about 9:30-9:45.
Anonymous
05/09/2024 15:18
Subject: Help me with mornings for my terrible sleeper
I am an adult with ADHD with kids with ADHD, so sleep has been a problem at various times for various people.
Others have said the guafacine may be the problem, but I know many parents try non-stimulant meds like Guafacine first. Guafacine is an alpha agonist. There is another non-stimulant medication Stratterra (generic- Atomoxetine) which is a selective-norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor (SNRI).
I take Straterra and one of my kids has taken it. My personal experience is that it is very helpful - enables me to feel all my emotions without being overpowered by them, and decreases the amount my mind "wanders". I am ADHD Inattentive and the "wandering" is my mind thinking about other things when something is boring or I can't move - it is an aspect of imagination I suppose but on atomoxetine it is much less intrusive when I am focusing on something. When it happens at night it can be difficult to fall asleep.
I also take a stimulant. Truthfully, I don't feel "awake" without it.
One family member has used light therapy to help regulate sleep - a 10,000 lux lamp for 30 mins in the AM while eating breakfast.
Try to be kind to her - I wake my kids kindly and softly at first - with a cheerful voice and gentle pats on the arm. Yes, I might have to do it several times. I try really hard not to be angry since that ruins the whole morning for everyone. I try to remind myself that kids grow and acquire skills at different rates and sleep regulation is one of them.
For myself, I also have to pair things I must do with things I want to do - so is there something motivating you can allow your kid to do, but only at the breakfast table?
Light in the evening also regulates sleep - low lights in the house after 6 pm. In the bedroom, low lights also. I like to read, but it has to be something that hits the sweet spot of interesting enough that I will read but nog so interesting that it makes me alert. Reading occupies my mind enough that I don't ruminate.
Exercise, regular sleep wake hours even on the weekend are all good recs, but sometimes medicine is necessary.
Others have said the guafacine may be the problem, but I know many parents try non-stimulant meds like Guafacine first. Guafacine is an alpha agonist. There is another non-stimulant medication Stratterra (generic- Atomoxetine) which is a selective-norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor (SNRI).
I take Straterra and one of my kids has taken it. My personal experience is that it is very helpful - enables me to feel all my emotions without being overpowered by them, and decreases the amount my mind "wanders". I am ADHD Inattentive and the "wandering" is my mind thinking about other things when something is boring or I can't move - it is an aspect of imagination I suppose but on atomoxetine it is much less intrusive when I am focusing on something. When it happens at night it can be difficult to fall asleep.
I also take a stimulant. Truthfully, I don't feel "awake" without it.
One family member has used light therapy to help regulate sleep - a 10,000 lux lamp for 30 mins in the AM while eating breakfast.
Try to be kind to her - I wake my kids kindly and softly at first - with a cheerful voice and gentle pats on the arm. Yes, I might have to do it several times. I try really hard not to be angry since that ruins the whole morning for everyone. I try to remind myself that kids grow and acquire skills at different rates and sleep regulation is one of them.
For myself, I also have to pair things I must do with things I want to do - so is there something motivating you can allow your kid to do, but only at the breakfast table?
Light in the evening also regulates sleep - low lights in the house after 6 pm. In the bedroom, low lights also. I like to read, but it has to be something that hits the sweet spot of interesting enough that I will read but nog so interesting that it makes me alert. Reading occupies my mind enough that I don't ruminate.
Exercise, regular sleep wake hours even on the weekend are all good recs, but sometimes medicine is necessary.
Anonymous
05/09/2024 14:18
Subject: Help me with mornings for my terrible sleeper
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:OP here. She has ADHD (mostly inattentive presentation).
She’s a hot sleeper so we can’t have her sleep in her clothes. She likes to sleep in underwear and a tank top but she wears jeans/leggings to school even when it’s hot because the AC in her classroom makes her class super cold.
She slept great as a baby and then, when we took her pacifiers away at 2.5 it was like a flip switched and her sleep became terrible and it still is!
She does not have adhd.
How could you possibly know that?
Anonymous
05/09/2024 13:20
Subject: Help me with mornings for my terrible sleeper
clonidine!
Anonymous
05/09/2024 12:20
Subject: Re:Help me with mornings for my terrible sleeper
I empathize OP. My adhd DD has always been a terrible sleeper. She was 3 years old when she finally slept through the night.
Now as a teen, it is still a struggle for her to get her 8 hours of sleep per night (sorry, you probably don’t want to hear that). What has helped (a little) is playing soothing music at bedtime. She loves classical music and it helps relax her. Back rubs or massages if I’m around, melatonin (but this makes her groggy the next day). Limiting screen time an hour before bed is also important but is really hard to do as a teen. She wants to text her friends, work on assignments, etc… I suggest when your DD gets a phone in the future to be very, very strict about no phone before bedtime.
Now as a teen, it is still a struggle for her to get her 8 hours of sleep per night (sorry, you probably don’t want to hear that). What has helped (a little) is playing soothing music at bedtime. She loves classical music and it helps relax her. Back rubs or massages if I’m around, melatonin (but this makes her groggy the next day). Limiting screen time an hour before bed is also important but is really hard to do as a teen. She wants to text her friends, work on assignments, etc… I suggest when your DD gets a phone in the future to be very, very strict about no phone before bedtime.