Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:thank you! this is helpful, but only goes to 220 or something. what do difficult questions look like?

There are no difficult questions on the MAP. It is a test of basic grade level math. There are higher grade level questions on the MAP.

Be aware that level 220 material means "if you get half of these questions correct, you'll get a score of 220".

It's the same as main math content through Algebra 2 / Integrated Math 3(including statistics modules)

230+ is prealgrebra
235+ is algebra 1
245+ is high school geometry
~255+ is algebra 2

Your score is the level where you get 50% correct.
So if you know 100% of algebra and 50% of Algebra 2, you'll get a score around 260.


https://www.khanacademy.org/math

Where did you get those numbers from? My kid got 270 at the start of 6th and not only is unfamiliar with algebra 2, but certainly doesn’t know all of algebra 1, or likely, any geometry.

On the 6-8 MAP-M, MCPS uses 250 as a benchmark for being Algebra ready. 275 indicates a solid grasp of Algebra. 285 indicates a solid grasp of geometry and 300 for Algebra 2. You see problems involving polynomials and trig in the 290s. The test used for grades 2-5 is different and honestly Khan Academy ceases to function well over about 225.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:thank you! this is helpful, but only goes to 220 or something. what do difficult questions look like?

Are you trying to have your kids study for the MAP? It is not a test you study for.

Tell that to the preppers angling for scarce magnet seats...

Won't matter anyway for MS Magnets because it's a lottery - it's not like a 99.99%ile makes it more likely you will get in.

How do you think those local norms get all skewed? And then it becomes ever closer to 99th just to get in the lottery pool. A 1 in 10 chance is better than 0 chance, and preppers clog the field.

My kid had 99.999% on their MAP-M and was not picked, whereas their friend with 95% was. Both were in the pool, but it's a lottery.

That's the nature of an unweighted lottery -- everyone, once in the same pool, has the same chance. 95th may have been good enough to be at or above the locally normed 85th percentile for your kid's friend's school. It's not at all surprising that some with lower scores got in and some with higher scores did not. Whether that's the right thing is another matter.

With an exposure based test like MAP, prepping shifts scores of those doing so to the right. The locally normed 85th percentile shifts with them. Where MAP is used as a proxy for ability (a whole other can of worms), a highly able student who does not prep then has a higher chance of being left out of the pool entirely. Not all highly able students are exposed in class (i.e., absent prep) to the material which would tend to produce a 95th or 96th to 99th percentile score. Meanwhile, many less highly able students who do prep achieve in that range. (I'm not saying they would be of low ability, just less so; also making no specific judgement, here, about your kid or their friend.)

If the magnet is about past exposure/achievement, that might be fine, but it is supposed to be there to address the needs of the highly able, and the content/pace/teaching approach is geared towards those students.

None of that is to say that outside enrichment is bad, in and of itself, or that all those who pursue it are not among the highly able. Just that MCPS should be taking a close look at the characteristics of the metric they have chosen, the intent of its use, and the likely dissonant effect.

Side note: while I'm sure you can impute, to a degree, extra decimal places, the percentiles only go up to 99th. Anything above that is reported as...99th.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:thank you! this is helpful, but only goes to 220 or something. what do difficult questions look like?

Are you trying to have your kids study for the MAP? It is not a test you study for.

Tell that to the preppers angling for scarce magnet seats...

Won't matter anyway for MS Magnets because it's a lottery - it's not like a 99.99%ile makes it more likely you will get in.

How do you think those local norms get all skewed? And then it becomes ever closer to 99th just to get in the lottery pool. A 1 in 10 chance is better than 0 chance, and preppers clog the field.

It is not the 99th percentile to get in with any local norming. The MCCPTA GEC published them in their Facebook group.

I have a kid at TPMS currently and one before the lottery. The lottery kids are bright and capable of doing the work, but not many are 99% like before. I hope they improve their process to better identify kids who can do well in the program. The lottery seems to have a higher attrition rate than before.

I’ve also had a kids in before and after and I do not share your experience. There doesn’t seem to be a significant difference and my litter kid seems to be scoring much higher on standardized tests (if that’s a reasonable measure) than older sibling.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:thank you! this is helpful, but only goes to 220 or something. what do difficult questions look like?

There are no difficult questions on the MAP. It is a test of basic grade level math. There are higher grade level questions on the MAP.

Be aware that level 220 material means "if you get half of these questions correct, you'll get a score of 220".

It's the same as main math content through Algebra 2 / Integrated Math 3(including statistics modules)

230+ is prealgrebra
235+ is algebra 1
245+ is high school geometry
~255+ is algebra 2

Your score is the level where you get 50% correct.
So if you know 100% of algebra and 50% of Algebra 2, you'll get a score around 260.


https://www.khanacademy.org/math

Where did you get those numbers from? My kid got 270 at the start of 6th and not only is unfamiliar with algebra 2, but certainly doesn’t know all of algebra 1, or likely, any geometry.

Are the 4 subscores the same or unbalanced?

Are you sure your kid doesn't know any? Basic geometry ramps up through elementary school. Talented kids can work out higher level problems using their intuition, if they have had exposure to the symbols or get word problems. Most of the data&statistics topics can be solved totally intuitively as long as you know arithmetic. The 50% "RIT" standard is 50% of the content of the basic non-honors curriculum, which includes review and respin of earlier year content.

Also, due to the "50%" logic, if your kid knows 100% of something and 0% of something else, the scoring algorithm can get confused trying to give a final rating.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:thank you! this is helpful, but only goes to 220 or something. what do difficult questions look like?

Are you trying to have your kids study for the MAP? It is not a test you study for.

Tell that to the preppers angling for scarce magnet seats...

Won't matter anyway for MS Magnets because it's a lottery - it's not like a 99.99%ile makes it more likely you will get in.

How do you think those local norms get all skewed? And then it becomes ever closer to 99th just to get in the lottery pool. A 1 in 10 chance is better than 0 chance, and preppers clog the field.

It is not the 99th percentile to get in with any local norming. The MCCPTA GEC published them in their Facebook group.

Ever closer to the 99th. Think through it.

The local norms MCPS shared with MCCPTA GEC are from 2-3 years back. There should be some similarity, but anecdotal evidence, here and elsewhere, says the local 85th%ile norm for low-FARMS schools went up. Maybe from 93rd/94th to 96th or something. MCPS isn't sharing the current actuals.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:thank you! this is helpful, but only goes to 220 or something. what do difficult questions look like?

Are you trying to have your kids study for the MAP? It is not a test you study for.

Tell that to the preppers angling for scarce magnet seats...

Won't matter anyway for MS Magnets because it's a lottery - it's not like a 99.99%ile makes it more likely you will get in.

How do you think those local norms get all skewed? And then it becomes ever closer to 99th just to get in the lottery pool. A 1 in 10 chance is better than 0 chance, and preppers clog the field.

It is not the 99th percentile to get in with any local norming. The MCCPTA GEC published them in their Facebook group.

I have a kid at TPMS currently and one before the lottery. The lottery kids are bright and capable of doing the work, but not many are 99% like before. I hope they improve their process to better identify kids who can do well in the program. The lottery seems to have a higher attrition rate than before.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:thank you! this is helpful, but only goes to 220 or something. what do difficult questions look like?

There are no difficult questions on the MAP. It is a test of basic grade level math. There are higher grade level questions on the MAP.

Be aware that level 220 material means "if you get half of these questions correct, you'll get a score of 220".

It's the same as main math content through Algebra 2 / Integrated Math 3(including statistics modules)

230+ is prealgrebra
235+ is algebra 1
245+ is high school geometry
~255+ is algebra 2

Your score is the level where you get 50% correct.
So if you know 100% of algebra and 50% of Algebra 2, you'll get a score around 260.


https://www.khanacademy.org/math

Where did you get those numbers from? My kid got 270 at the start of 6th and not only is unfamiliar with algebra 2, but certainly doesn’t know all of algebra 1, or likely, any geometry.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:thank you! this is helpful, but only goes to 220 or something. what do difficult questions look like?

Are you trying to have your kids study for the MAP? It is not a test you study for.

Tell that to the preppers angling for scarce magnet seats...

Won't matter anyway for MS Magnets because it's a lottery - it's not like a 99.99%ile makes it more likely you will get in.

How do you think those local norms get all skewed? And then it becomes ever closer to 99th just to get in the lottery pool. A 1 in 10 chance is better than 0 chance, and preppers clog the field.

It is not the 99th percentile to get in with any local norming. The MCCPTA GEC published them in their Facebook group.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:thank you! this is helpful, but only goes to 220 or something. what do difficult questions look like?

Are you trying to have your kids study for the MAP? It is not a test you study for.

Tell that to the preppers angling for scarce magnet seats...

Won't matter anyway for MS Magnets because it's a lottery - it's not like a 99.99%ile makes it more likely you will get in.

How do you think those local norms get all skewed? And then it becomes ever closer to 99th just to get in the lottery pool. A 1 in 10 chance is better than 0 chance, and preppers clog the field.

My kid had 99.999% on their MAP-M and was not picked, whereas their friend with 95% was. Both were in the pool, but it's a lottery.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:thank you! this is helpful, but only goes to 220 or something. what do difficult questions look like?

Are you trying to have your kids study for the MAP? It is not a test you study for.

as far i as can tell (and both DH and i have engineering degrees, so we do know some math), the kids are good at math. their curriculum was fairly advanced, but it's different from the MCPS. for example, they started geometry in first grade, and built from there. the fourth-grader can already do some algebra and nontrivial geometry.

but on the other hand, they don't do quadratic equations in seventh grade (but they do, for example, geometric proofs, in sixth grade). so yes, i would like to know what holes the kids have compared to MCPS curriculum and yes, i would have them master that material, if it's not too difficult and too far removed from their base knowledge. it doesn't make sense to go to a slower track just because they didn't cover a topic or two, if that makes sense.

thank you for your help.

What kind of non-trivial geometry and geometric proofs?
MCPS does some geometry in ES and MS/prealgebra too.

in grade six they do proofs for congruent triangles. in fourth grade they do areas of squares, rectangles, cubes combined with some algebra. they did lines and line segments in first grade, angles in third etc.

MAP is a national test and our kids took it at our international school. So its not really focused to MCPS curriculum in particular.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:thank you! this is helpful, but only goes to 220 or something. what do difficult questions look like?

Are you trying to have your kids study for the MAP? It is not a test you study for.

Tell that to the preppers angling for scarce magnet seats...

Won't matter anyway for MS Magnets because it's a lottery - it's not like a 99.99%ile makes it more likely you will get in.

we are zoned for WJ - the magnet is likely not necessary (according to this board).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:thank you! this is helpful, but only goes to 220 or something. what do difficult questions look like?

There are no difficult questions on the MAP. It is a test of basic grade level math. There are higher grade level questions on the MAP.

Be aware that level 220 material means "if you get half of these questions correct, you'll get a score of 220".

It's the same as main math content through Algebra 2 / Integrated Math 3(including statistics modules)

230+ is prealgrebra
235+ is algebra 1
245+ is high school geometry
~255+ is algebra 2

Your score is the level where you get 50% correct.
So if you know 100% of algebra and 50% of Algebra 2, you'll get a score around 260.


https://www.khanacademy.org/math

oh thanks, this is great. i get it now.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:thank you! this is helpful, but only goes to 220 or something. what do difficult questions look like?

Are you trying to have your kids study for the MAP? It is not a test you study for.

Tell that to the preppers angling for scarce magnet seats...

Won't matter anyway for MS Magnets because it's a lottery - it's not like a 99.99%ile makes it more likely you will get in.

How do you think those local norms get all skewed? And then it becomes ever closer to 99th just to get in the lottery pool. A 1 in 10 chance is better than 0 chance, and preppers clog the field.

K-5 uses Eureka math and 6/7/8 Illustrative Math. You can look them up to find the pacing guides.