Anonymous
Post 02/01/2024 10:24     Subject: ROI Question
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:The interaction between kid and school is dynamic, not static. It's less about what the school "gives" than about what the kid puts in, and in a variety of ways. Is she the kind of kid who will throw her full self in regardless of where she winds up? Maybe it doesn't matter. Does she feel like she'll thrive at one more than the other, and if so, why?

When you close your eyes and picture her at both places, do you see a difference in terms of little things -- how she greets the day, whether and how she asks questions of professors, the likelihood of her putting herself forward to work on projects, the width of the net she casts socially, etc.?


I'm a new poster ... just wanted to say that this is great! My kid is in a similar decision-making process. This is a good exercise!


I'm not that PP but one who just mentioned "fit" and this is not just a thought exercise, it's crucial to choosing based on more than the cost of a school. I've had friends, and my DD (recent college grad) has had friends, who did not look at whether they actually wanted to LIVE at their college for four years of their young lives, did not did not delve into how the classes and major programs were structured and what they'd actually be doing with their time for four years of study, etc. I'm amazed how many threads on DCUM are entirely about costs and give the impression that no students or parents think to ask much about curriculum structure, ease of taking courses across departments, colleges' processes for helping students who need academic--or just as important, mental health--help, etc. etc. Those things all matter. Your kid has to live at this place and navigate its academic and social structures for four years.

To be clear, I"m speaking generally and not bashing OP, who seems to be trying to win a money discussion with her DH. But wow, his site overall often comes across as not looking very hard into anything more than costs and where schools fall on "ranking" lists.

I think the assumption is that kids are resilient and will thrive anywhere. Not sure if that’s true.
Anonymous
Post 02/01/2024 10:16     Subject: ROI Question
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:The interaction between kid and school is dynamic, not static. It's less about what the school "gives" than about what the kid puts in, and in a variety of ways. Is she the kind of kid who will throw her full self in regardless of where she winds up? Maybe it doesn't matter. Does she feel like she'll thrive at one more than the other, and if so, why?

When you close your eyes and picture her at both places, do you see a difference in terms of little things -- how she greets the day, whether and how she asks questions of professors, the likelihood of her putting herself forward to work on projects, the width of the net she casts socially, etc.?


I'm a new poster ... just wanted to say that this is great! My kid is in a similar decision-making process. This is a good exercise!


I'm not that PP but one who just mentioned "fit" and this is not just a thought exercise, it's crucial to choosing based on more than the cost of a school. I've had friends, and my DD (recent college grad) has had friends, who did not look at whether they actually wanted to LIVE at their college for four years of their young lives, did not did not delve into how the classes and major programs were structured and what they'd actually be doing with their time for four years of study, etc. I'm amazed how many threads on DCUM are entirely about costs and give the impression that no students or parents think to ask much about curriculum structure, ease of taking courses across departments, colleges' processes for helping students who need academic--or just as important, mental health--help, etc. etc. Those things all matter. Your kid has to live at this place and navigate its academic and social structures for four years.

To be clear, I"m speaking generally and not bashing OP, who seems to be trying to win a money discussion with her DH. But wow, his site overall often comes across as not looking very hard into anything more than costs and where schools fall on "ranking" lists.
Anonymous
Post 02/01/2024 10:15     Subject: ROI Question
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP here- Indiana is an interesting one. I agree that Kelly has a great reputation, but she only got $8000 merit which might make it considerably more than some of the other schools. She has also expressed interest in real estate which would be a better fit in Wisconsin's business school.

For that reason, I am trying to get an overall feel of paying more for an out-of-state flagship vs Towson specifically. Once merit comes out at all of the different schools, we will help her narrow it down- she got into so many great options that it's almost an embarrassment of riches- except of course UMD.

Do students leaving Towson's business school have good career options? Or would really any flagship offer better options?


OP—please hear this. Your DD does. It want to go to Towson. She will be “embarrassed” to go there. (Her words as told to us by you.)
I know you want a good ROI, but if you make her go to a school she expressly doesn’t want, she may be a lot more likely to drop out of school bc she hates it so much that she can’t bear to be there. And that ROI will not be so great.
You have said you have the money to send her elsewhere (even though it will be tight), so IMO, that is your answer.


That should be “Your DD does NOT want to go to Towson.”
Anonymous
Post 02/01/2024 10:14     Subject: ROI Question
Anonymous wrote:OP here- Indiana is an interesting one. I agree that Kelly has a great reputation, but she only got $8000 merit which might make it considerably more than some of the other schools. She has also expressed interest in real estate which would be a better fit in Wisconsin's business school.

For that reason, I am trying to get an overall feel of paying more for an out-of-state flagship vs Towson specifically. Once merit comes out at all of the different schools, we will help her narrow it down- she got into so many great options that it's almost an embarrassment of riches- except of course UMD.

Do students leaving Towson's business school have good career options? Or would really any flagship offer better options?


OP—please hear this. Your DD does. It want to go to Towson. She will be “embarrassed” to go there. (Her words as told to us by you.)
I know you want a good ROI, but if you make her go to a school she expressly doesn’t want, she may be a lot more likely to drop out of school bc she hates it so much that she can’t bear to be there. And that ROI will not be so great.
You have said you have the money to send her elsewhere (even though it will be tight), so IMO, that is your answer.
Anonymous
Post 02/01/2024 10:06     Subject: ROI Question
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP here- Indiana is an interesting one. I agree that Kelly has a great reputation, but she only got $8000 merit which might make it considerably more than some of the other schools. She has also expressed interest in real estate which would be a better fit in Wisconsin's business school.

For that reason, I am trying to get an overall feel of paying more for an out-of-state flagship vs Towson specifically. Once merit comes out at all of the different schools, we will help her narrow it down- she got into so many great options that it's almost an embarrassment of riches- except of course UMD.

Do students leaving Towson's business school have good career options? Or would really any flagship offer better options?


I don’t get it. Do you want peoples input and then they give it to you and then you’re fighting them on it.



Sorry, you’re right. I guess I was writing to settle an argument with DH about in-state option vs out-of-state rather than focusing too much on the actual schools (although we can take a $12000 extra hit annually, $20000 would be way harder so we are not planning on having her commit anywhere until we see the actual financial papers. Due to Indiana’s lower merit, it might take that school out of contention, even if it has the best ROI).


NP. She already knows she's been accepted to other schools she has clearly told you she prefers to Towson.

She also knows you can pay for OOS up to a point.

You do realize that if any of the other schools, or maybe several, are options at just $12,000 more/year (AND the FA packages are acceptable), but you push her into Towson, she may develop a serious case of "I could have gone to X but my parents made me go here instead"? That's a recipe for her to dislike, and possibly not care as much about working hard during, her college career. Tell your DH to push Towson only if he's ready to deal with a student who might spend four years resentful about her parents pushing the one place she had clearly said she didn't want. And yes, "embarrassing" is an OK reason at this point for her to want to leave the state. Consder--as an earlier PP rightly noted -- the actual "fit" of schools. If Towson is the wrong fit, the $$ you save, especially if you could have swung the costs of another school, will come at a high cost in her relationship with you, and possibly her relationship to academics while she's there.
Anonymous
Post 02/01/2024 09:59     Subject: ROI Question
Anonymous wrote:The interaction between kid and school is dynamic, not static. It's less about what the school "gives" than about what the kid puts in, and in a variety of ways. Is she the kind of kid who will throw her full self in regardless of where she winds up? Maybe it doesn't matter. Does she feel like she'll thrive at one more than the other, and if so, why?

When you close your eyes and picture her at both places, do you see a difference in terms of little things -- how she greets the day, whether and how she asks questions of professors, the likelihood of her putting herself forward to work on projects, the width of the net she casts socially, etc.?


I'm a new poster ... just wanted to say that this is great! My kid is in a similar decision-making process. This is a good exercise!
Anonymous
Post 02/01/2024 09:53     Subject: ROI Question
Just chiming in to suggest checking out Towson thoroughly. My initial reaction was the same when considering schools for my kid a few years ago, but I've come to learn it's a pretty good school!
Anonymous
Post 02/01/2024 09:51     Subject: ROI Question
Anonymous wrote:DD did not get admitted into our state flagship (UMD). Her state backup is Towson.

DH and I are disagreeing about what is her better option long term and I am curious what DCUM has to say!

With that said, would you rather...

1) Attend the in-state school for the cost savings
2) Attend an out-of-state flagship for approximately 12,000 more annually (school is unknown- there are many choices including Indiana- Kelly direct admit, Wisconsin, Penn State- UP, Ohio State, South Carolina, Clemson)

The degree is business- though she is not sure what area.

Would a state flagship's ROI be substantial enough to offset the cost difference? The $12,000 annually is not a deal breaker for us, but will also be felt at home.

Also, our daughter is adamantly against Towson and feels it is embarrassing, so you can guess which direction she is going in!

What say you DCUM?


Unless she is direct admit to Smeal, I'd take IU-Kelly.
Anonymous
Post 02/01/2024 09:48     Subject: ROI Question
If you are in Kelley direct admit, go there. Best reputation.
Anonymous
Post 02/01/2024 09:23     Subject: ROI Question
make sure you know the goa requirement to keep merit for 4 years.
Anonymous
Post 02/01/2024 09:16     Subject: ROI Question
also does the roi consider loan interest? I don’t agree with it.

Separately, what is the WI aid option? I heard they don’t give much?
Anonymous
Post 02/01/2024 09:14     Subject: Re:ROI Question
Anonymous wrote:Using this website https://public.flourish.studio/visualisation/7583742/

ROI business degree

Towson $317k

Penn State $1,190k
Indiana- Kelly $1,167k
Wisconsin $871k
South Carolina $783k
Ohio State $689k
Clemson $321k

Therefore, yes, the right OOS school is going to offset the cost difference between that and Towson.


Is there a way to narrow down the search in that link? It shows random colleges by major.
Anonymous
Post 02/01/2024 09:13     Subject: ROI Question
that roi website is suspicious. Does it take into consideration opportunity cost of investing the savings in the market, real estate or grad school? I am bracing for a similar situation next year. 3 things:

1) does kid want to live in dmv after school? I worked for 2 fortune 500 companies that recruited at towson and umd. Local companies recruit at towson. after her first job it doesn’t matter.

2) Towson accepts 3 and above for APs. For my 12 AP kid, this could free up time to do double major, 5th year masters or graduate early.

3) Business is a broad topic. If she wants to get a CPA, it doesn’t matter where she goes, she will get a decent roi. If she is set on IB or top consulting, she might not get that at either school and might not even stick with it for more than a couple years.





Anonymous
Post 02/01/2024 09:07     Subject: ROI Question
All of those choices will provide a better ROI over Towson unless your daughter would be willing to transfer to UMD after a year or two.

I would shell out the money as it will give her a lot more opportunities in the future.
Anonymous
Post 02/01/2024 08:27     Subject: ROI Question
I'd take any of those schools even over UMD.