Anonymous wrote:No, not feeling that way. Celebrating Hanukkah doesn't have anything to do with supporting nor condemning the state of Israel.

This^. Its an old tradition, not related to government, army or politics. Be the light for others.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like this post was written by someone who is not Jewish the same way conservative trolls will try to post things from the perspective of "a lifelong liberal who is now disillusioned".

Judaism is not Israel. I'm ashamed of Israel's war crimes the same way I am ashamed of the US war crimes following 9-11. That doesn't mean I don't still believe in democracy.

I'm the pp from previous page that said I was struggling with the war crimes. I feel the same way about 9/11. If 9/11 was actually 6/11, would you still feel so jolly about celebrating 7/4 so soon after? IMO no, it would certainly dampen the mood. I get that 7/4 isnt religious, but the "feeling" is missing, related directly to crimes being committed by what I'm supposed to celebrate.

you have a lot of angst and struggle going on, having to exist in a world where the Jews are so evil but at the same time, we need to see them celebrate their holidays. So angsty.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like this post was written by someone who is not Jewish the same way conservative trolls will try to post things from the perspective of "a lifelong liberal who is now disillusioned".

Judaism is not Israel. I'm ashamed of Israel's war crimes the same way I am ashamed of the US war crimes following 9-11. That doesn't mean I don't still believe in democracy.

I'm the pp from previous page that said I was struggling with the war crimes. I feel the same way about 9/11. If 9/11 was actually 6/11, would you still feel so jolly about celebrating 7/4 so soon after? IMO no, it would certainly dampen the mood. I get that 7/4 isnt religious, but the "feeling" is missing, related directly to crimes being committed by what I'm supposed to celebrate.

If 9/11 had happened on June 11, there is no question that the U.S. would have celebrated July 4. It's not like the attack deflated patriotism!

But that analogy is sort of imperfect for this situation, anyway — if what's hanging you up on Chanukah now is Israel's conduct of the war, that's not the same as missing the spirit for an American national holiday because of 9/11, is it? It'd be more like not wanting to celebrate July 4 a week after the Abu Ghraib photos came out...

Youre right the dates and analogy arent quite correct, more like, after 9/11 when we found out all the atrocities that were being committed in the name of the USA, that I personally did not agree with. I would have struggled with that as well.

I'm clearly not great at articulating my feelings, but I'm definitely torn and struggling with all the loss and violence on both sides.

yeah you would have struggled because you symphathize with the cause of the attackers

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like this post was written by someone who is not Jewish the same way conservative trolls will try to post things from the perspective of "a lifelong liberal who is now disillusioned".

Judaism is not Israel. I'm ashamed of Israel's war crimes the same way I am ashamed of the US war crimes following 9-11. That doesn't mean I don't still believe in democracy.

Sounds like YOU are cosplaying as the people you think should be ashamed. Who in real life uses the word "ashamed" in relation to what a country they lived in has done. Normal people don't personalize in themselves what their government has done.

Normal people do this all the time, if they want to be critical of their government. It's not personal shame, but the idea that you're ashamed that your country has fallen short of its own ideals/of the ideals you want it to live up to is completely normal.

I said what I said, people do not personalize what their country does. We on the inside know that one, we are not able to give a yay or no vote to everything our conuntry does, all we can do is vote and advocate. When that fails, we acknowledge the consequences, more like an I told you so, but shame, no. But outsiders love telling Americans to feel ashamed (or in a twisted ways telling Jews to be ashamed for Israel even though Jewish does not equal Israeli) so when we are attacked, verbally or tangibly (such as terrorism), it can be hinted at that we deserve it.

Hanukkah is observed, not celebrated. And the reason for observing it is the same today as it has been.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like this post was written by someone who is not Jewish the same way conservative trolls will try to post things from the perspective of "a lifelong liberal who is now disillusioned".

Judaism is not Israel. I'm ashamed of Israel's war crimes the same way I am ashamed of the US war crimes following 9-11. That doesn't mean I don't still believe in democracy.

I'm the pp from previous page that said I was struggling with the war crimes. I feel the same way about 9/11. If 9/11 was actually 6/11, would you still feel so jolly about celebrating 7/4 so soon after? IMO no, it would certainly dampen the mood. I get that 7/4 isnt religious, but the "feeling" is missing, related directly to crimes being committed by what I'm supposed to celebrate.

If 9/11 had happened on June 11, there is no question that the U.S. would have celebrated July 4. It's not like the attack deflated patriotism!

But that analogy is sort of imperfect for this situation, anyway — if what's hanging you up on Chanukah now is Israel's conduct of the war, that's not the same as missing the spirit for an American national holiday because of 9/11, is it? It'd be more like not wanting to celebrate July 4 a week after the Abu Ghraib photos came out...

Youre right the dates and analogy arent quite correct, more like, after 9/11 when we found out all the atrocities that were being committed in the name of the USA, that I personally did not agree with. I would have struggled with that as well.

I'm clearly not great at articulating my feelings, but I'm definitely torn and struggling with all the loss and violence on both sides.

Quoting to add, those photos are exactly the analogy. Apologies, I didnt immediately recognize the name and just googled and yeah, I would not be feeling so patriotic and wanting to celebrate the country abusing those people, and definitely not the military connection/free country while they are subjecting other countries to that sort of thing.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like this post was written by someone who is not Jewish the same way conservative trolls will try to post things from the perspective of "a lifelong liberal who is now disillusioned".

Judaism is not Israel. I'm ashamed of Israel's war crimes the same way I am ashamed of the US war crimes following 9-11. That doesn't mean I don't still believe in democracy.

I'm the pp from previous page that said I was struggling with the war crimes. I feel the same way about 9/11. If 9/11 was actually 6/11, would you still feel so jolly about celebrating 7/4 so soon after? IMO no, it would certainly dampen the mood. I get that 7/4 isnt religious, but the "feeling" is missing, related directly to crimes being committed by what I'm supposed to celebrate.

If 9/11 had happened on June 11, there is no question that the U.S. would have celebrated July 4. It's not like the attack deflated patriotism!

But that analogy is sort of imperfect for this situation, anyway — if what's hanging you up on Chanukah now is Israel's conduct of the war, that's not the same as missing the spirit for an American national holiday because of 9/11, is it? It'd be more like not wanting to celebrate July 4 a week after the Abu Ghraib photos came out...

Youre right the dates and analogy arent quite correct, more like, after 9/11 when we found out all the atrocities that were being committed in the name of the USA, that I personally did not agree with. I would have struggled with that as well.

I'm clearly not great at articulating my feelings, but I'm definitely torn and struggling with all the loss and violence on both sides.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like this post was written by someone who is not Jewish the same way conservative trolls will try to post things from the perspective of "a lifelong liberal who is now disillusioned".

Judaism is not Israel. I'm ashamed of Israel's war crimes the same way I am ashamed of the US war crimes following 9-11. That doesn't mean I don't still believe in democracy.

Sounds like YOU are cosplaying as the people you think should be ashamed. Who in real life uses the word "ashamed" in relation to what a country they lived in has done. Normal people don't personalize in themselves what their government has done.

Normal people do this all the time, if they want to be critical of their government. It's not personal shame, but the idea that you're ashamed that your country has fallen short of its own ideals/of the ideals you want it to live up to is completely normal.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like this post was written by someone who is not Jewish the same way conservative trolls will try to post things from the perspective of "a lifelong liberal who is now disillusioned".

Judaism is not Israel. I'm ashamed of Israel's war crimes the same way I am ashamed of the US war crimes following 9-11. That doesn't mean I don't still believe in democracy.

I'm the pp from previous page that said I was struggling with the war crimes. I feel the same way about 9/11. If 9/11 was actually 6/11, would you still feel so jolly about celebrating 7/4 so soon after? IMO no, it would certainly dampen the mood. I get that 7/4 isnt religious, but the "feeling" is missing, related directly to crimes being committed by what I'm supposed to celebrate.

If 9/11 had happened on June 11, there is no question that the U.S. would have celebrated July 4. It's not like the attack deflated patriotism!

But that analogy is sort of imperfect for this situation, anyway — if what's hanging you up on Chanukah now is Israel's conduct of the war, that's not the same as missing the spirit for an American national holiday because of 9/11, is it? It'd be more like not wanting to celebrate July 4 a week after the Abu Ghraib photos came out...

Anonymous wrote:I feel like this post was written by someone who is not Jewish the same way conservative trolls will try to post things from the perspective of "a lifelong liberal who is now disillusioned".

Judaism is not Israel. I'm ashamed of Israel's war crimes the same way I am ashamed of the US war crimes following 9-11. That doesn't mean I don't still believe in democracy.

I'm the pp from previous page that said I was struggling with the war crimes. I feel the same way about 9/11. If 9/11 was actually 6/11, would you still feel so jolly about celebrating 7/4 so soon after? IMO no, it would certainly dampen the mood. I get that 7/4 isnt religious, but the "feeling" is missing, related directly to crimes being committed by what I'm supposed to celebrate.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like this post was written by someone who is not Jewish the same way conservative trolls will try to post things from the perspective of "a lifelong liberal who is now disillusioned".

Judaism is not Israel. I'm ashamed of Israel's war crimes the same way I am ashamed of the US war crimes following 9-11. That doesn't mean I don't still believe in democracy.

Sounds like YOU are cosplaying as the people you think should be ashamed. Who in real life uses the word "ashamed" in relation to what a country they lived in has done. Normal people don't personalize in themselves what their government has done.

Not this poster, but this is kind of a weird take - people project their country's activities onto their own personas all the time. I mean, rah-rah! We're #1! We feel proud when our country wins the Olympics, frustrated when our country ranks last in *whatever* and ashamed when our country does something we believe is wrong. It's as normal as can be.

Anonymous wrote:I feel like this post was written by someone who is not Jewish the same way conservative trolls will try to post things from the perspective of "a lifelong liberal who is now disillusioned".

Judaism is not Israel. I'm ashamed of Israel's war crimes the same way I am ashamed of the US war crimes following 9-11. That doesn't mean I don't still believe in democracy.

Sounds like YOU are cosplaying as the people you think should be ashamed. Who in real life uses the word "ashamed" in relation to what a country they lived in has done. Normal people don't personalize in themselves what their government has done.

Anonymous wrote:I feel like this post was written by someone who is not Jewish the same way conservative trolls will try to post things from the perspective of "a lifelong liberal who is now disillusioned".

Judaism is not Israel. I'm ashamed of Israel's war crimes the same way I am ashamed of the US war crimes following 9-11. That doesn't mean I don't still believe in democracy.

Yes, this post 100% feels like pro-Palestinian j**k-off fantasy. "I'm soooooooooo ashamed of Israel that I can't celebrate Hanukkah". Rational people realize that the actions of a certain group (in this case, a foreign government) don't influence the religious practice of an entire worldwide ethnic group.

I mean, did anyone expect Muslims to stop celebrating Eid out of shame after 9/11? No, because that would be crazy. And yet here we are...

I feel like this post was written by someone who is not Jewish the same way conservative trolls will try to post things from the perspective of "a lifelong liberal who is now disillusioned".

Judaism is not Israel. I'm ashamed of Israel's war crimes the same way I am ashamed of the US war crimes following 9-11. That doesn't mean I don't still believe in democracy.

Not at all.

What Hamas and Hamas-apologists want is for the Jewish people to stop existing. I won’t help them with that project.

“I promise to love being Jewish 10x more than anyone hates me for it.”