Anonymous
11/25/2023 12:19
Subject: The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes
Anonymous wrote:He was obsessed with her. And he loved power and control more. In the end he realized he could never control her.Anonymous wrote:So if he didn’t love her why did her request to go to her district?
I saw it more as obsession too. I don’t think it excuses Snow at all; more depicts the descent into his narcissism, power hungry life.
Anonymous
11/25/2023 11:08
Subject: The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes
Anonymous wrote:Much better than I expected. I didn't think the ending was unclear, though it sounds like it didn't capture the nuances of the book.
I agree. I hadn't read the book, and all of the nuances conveyed came across to me.
Snow had many, many opportunities to develop a better character and choose loyalty or kindness. He never did. That was kind of the main point of the movie. Did the movie show his perspective with empathy? Yes. They never indicated that he had any though.
Anonymous
11/24/2023 19:23
Subject: The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes
Much better than I expected. I didn't think the ending was unclear, though it sounds like it didn't capture the nuances of the book.
Anonymous
11/21/2023 20:55
Subject: The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:There’s also a whole lot of possessiveness is how he thinks about her in the book. The power differential is on full display there. Not at all romantic when you’re essentially reading the thoughts of an inherently abusive person.Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I’m seeing a lot of reviews like this. I think the ending is probably one of those things that needed more dialogue/outright explaining in the movie version because not everyone has read the book.Anonymous wrote:It was a decent movie, but I did not get the ending.
I often find narration in films to be lazy, but this movie may have benefitted from having Donald Sutherland retelling the tale. That scene in the book is Snow doing mental gymnastics. His though process goes from "If I want to truly clean up the evidence, I'll have to get rid of Lucy Gray..." to "Hey, is she hiding from me? Why would she be afraid I'd hurt her?" in a single paragraph.
Good lord that's chilling. I may buy the book. Not so interested in the movie, but from that paragraph alone I recognize that the author knows how these people's minds work.
The book is a bit long winded. It took me months to read, because it could get tedious and repetitive, and I'd put it down with no interest of picking it up again. (It was a huge contrast from the original trilogy, which I breezed through all three books in a few days.) It makes sense for the character, though, because Snow fixates and obsessives over every little thing. It's a good book at its core, but I really have to slog through it.
Agreed. I am glad I read it before I saw the movie though - the inner monologue and some of the stuff that happened at the academy gave additional context that \i think was helpful.
Anonymous
11/21/2023 20:51
Subject: The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes
He was obsessed with her. And he loved power and control more. In the end he realized he could never control her.Anonymous wrote:So if he didn’t love her why did her request to go to her district?
Anonymous
11/21/2023 20:39
Subject: The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes
So if he didn’t love her why did her request to go to her district?
Anonymous
11/20/2023 19:53
Subject: The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:There’s also a whole lot of possessiveness is how he thinks about her in the book. The power differential is on full display there. Not at all romantic when you’re essentially reading the thoughts of an inherently abusive person.Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I’m seeing a lot of reviews like this. I think the ending is probably one of those things that needed more dialogue/outright explaining in the movie version because not everyone has read the book.Anonymous wrote:It was a decent movie, but I did not get the ending.
I often find narration in films to be lazy, but this movie may have benefitted from having Donald Sutherland retelling the tale. That scene in the book is Snow doing mental gymnastics. His though process goes from "If I want to truly clean up the evidence, I'll have to get rid of Lucy Gray..." to "Hey, is she hiding from me? Why would she be afraid I'd hurt her?" in a single paragraph.
Good lord that's chilling. I may buy the book. Not so interested in the movie, but from that paragraph alone I recognize that the author knows how these people's minds work.
The book is a bit long winded. It took me months to read, because it could get tedious and repetitive, and I'd put it down with no interest of picking it up again. (It was a huge contrast from the original trilogy, which I breezed through all three books in a few days.) It makes sense for the character, though, because Snow fixates and obsessives over every little thing. It's a good book at its core, but I really have to slog through it.
The audiobook is pure enjoyment. SANTINO FONTANA.
This is PP, and I actually used the audiobook after giving up on the ebook! Even the audiobook took me months to finish, because through so many scenes, they would state something clearly through the dialogue, and then Snow’s inner monologue would have to explain it in detail in case the reader didn’t get it, which was not Suzanne Collin’s style at all in the original trilogy. Plus they had Santino Fontana and so many musical numbers, and he didn’t sing!
Anonymous
11/20/2023 19:42
Subject: The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:There’s also a whole lot of possessiveness is how he thinks about her in the book. The power differential is on full display there. Not at all romantic when you’re essentially reading the thoughts of an inherently abusive person.Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I’m seeing a lot of reviews like this. I think the ending is probably one of those things that needed more dialogue/outright explaining in the movie version because not everyone has read the book.Anonymous wrote:It was a decent movie, but I did not get the ending.
I often find narration in films to be lazy, but this movie may have benefitted from having Donald Sutherland retelling the tale. That scene in the book is Snow doing mental gymnastics. His though process goes from "If I want to truly clean up the evidence, I'll have to get rid of Lucy Gray..." to "Hey, is she hiding from me? Why would she be afraid I'd hurt her?" in a single paragraph.
Good lord that's chilling. I may buy the book. Not so interested in the movie, but from that paragraph alone I recognize that the author knows how these people's minds work.
The book is a bit long winded. It took me months to read, because it could get tedious and repetitive, and I'd put it down with no interest of picking it up again. (It was a huge contrast from the original trilogy, which I breezed through all three books in a few days.) It makes sense for the character, though, because Snow fixates and obsessives over every little thing. It's a good book at its core, but I really have to slog through it.
The audiobook is pure enjoyment. SANTINO FONTANA.
Anonymous
11/20/2023 19:37
Subject: The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:So here's my question for people who have watched it: does it somehow excuse or justify President Snow's psychopathy?
Haven't read any of the books. Watched the film trilogy and loved it more on re-watches. I have dealt with President Snow-types at work and in my family, and at this point I can't deal with a villain origin story if the villain's choices are not made clear/if the villain isn't held accountable for their choices.
I also would love to hear how this movie's romance is portrayed, since I don't think a psychopath is capable of falling in love.
I may sound like a stickler, but after you actually literally deal with these people in RL, you become very wary of the subconscious messaging in movies.
I have not seen the movie, but I don't think the book excuses him. Snow is the main character and you're in his head, and I think it's meant to show how selfishness and petty concerns lead someone to true evil even as they themselves think they are making defensible choices. There are so many opportunities to make other choices, and he doesn't, and you the reader know where it leads.
I agree with you that often people take the "narrator" as correct. I don't think the book intends that; not sure about the movie.
NP. This is a helpful distinction. I really didn't get this vibe from the romanticized movie trailer, which is why I'm not going to watch the movie now. Shame because the original story seems far less romantic and far more honest...and relevant for our times!
Anonymous
11/20/2023 18:25
Subject: The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes
Going by the reviews, I'm glad I didn't let DW convince me to go for this movie. Might check out the book by the sounds of this, though YA novels aren't usually my thing.
Anonymous
11/20/2023 17:38
Subject: The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes
Love that 13:57 PP. You've basically sold me on the book.
14:49 PP, it might be a slog for you to read because you (fortunately!) haven't had recurring encounters with Snow-type people. I'm glad you haven't, because these types are a sinister, covert nightmare.
I basically need to buy the book some time this week because as part of my lifelong recovery from psychopathic abuse, I feel deeply seen and heard whenever an author gets these type of people right.
One reason why I also love Gillian Flynn's novels. I recognize all of the female psychopaths in her novels. Literally all of them. My life has been interesting.
14:49 PP, it might be a slog for you to read because you (fortunately!) haven't had recurring encounters with Snow-type people. I'm glad you haven't, because these types are a sinister, covert nightmare.
I basically need to buy the book some time this week because as part of my lifelong recovery from psychopathic abuse, I feel deeply seen and heard whenever an author gets these type of people right.
One reason why I also love Gillian Flynn's novels. I recognize all of the female psychopaths in her novels. Literally all of them. My life has been interesting.
Anonymous
11/20/2023 14:49
Subject: The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes
Anonymous wrote:There’s also a whole lot of possessiveness is how he thinks about her in the book. The power differential is on full display there. Not at all romantic when you’re essentially reading the thoughts of an inherently abusive person.Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I’m seeing a lot of reviews like this. I think the ending is probably one of those things that needed more dialogue/outright explaining in the movie version because not everyone has read the book.Anonymous wrote:It was a decent movie, but I did not get the ending.
I often find narration in films to be lazy, but this movie may have benefitted from having Donald Sutherland retelling the tale. That scene in the book is Snow doing mental gymnastics. His though process goes from "If I want to truly clean up the evidence, I'll have to get rid of Lucy Gray..." to "Hey, is she hiding from me? Why would she be afraid I'd hurt her?" in a single paragraph.
Good lord that's chilling. I may buy the book. Not so interested in the movie, but from that paragraph alone I recognize that the author knows how these people's minds work.
The book is a bit long winded. It took me months to read, because it could get tedious and repetitive, and I'd put it down with no interest of picking it up again. (It was a huge contrast from the original trilogy, which I breezed through all three books in a few days.) It makes sense for the character, though, because Snow fixates and obsessives over every little thing. It's a good book at its core, but I really have to slog through it.
Anonymous
11/20/2023 13:57
Subject: The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes
There’s also a whole lot of possessiveness is how he thinks about her in the book. The power differential is on full display there. Not at all romantic when you’re essentially reading the thoughts of an inherently abusive person.Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I’m seeing a lot of reviews like this. I think the ending is probably one of those things that needed more dialogue/outright explaining in the movie version because not everyone has read the book.Anonymous wrote:It was a decent movie, but I did not get the ending.
I often find narration in films to be lazy, but this movie may have benefitted from having Donald Sutherland retelling the tale. That scene in the book is Snow doing mental gymnastics. His though process goes from "If I want to truly clean up the evidence, I'll have to get rid of Lucy Gray..." to "Hey, is she hiding from me? Why would she be afraid I'd hurt her?" in a single paragraph.
Good lord that's chilling. I may buy the book. Not so interested in the movie, but from that paragraph alone I recognize that the author knows how these people's minds work.
Anonymous
11/20/2023 13:10
Subject: The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I’m seeing a lot of reviews like this. I think the ending is probably one of those things that needed more dialogue/outright explaining in the movie version because not everyone has read the book.Anonymous wrote:It was a decent movie, but I did not get the ending.
I often find narration in films to be lazy, but this movie may have benefitted from having Donald Sutherland retelling the tale. That scene in the book is Snow doing mental gymnastics. His though process goes from "If I want to truly clean up the evidence, I'll have to get rid of Lucy Gray..." to "Hey, is she hiding from me? Why would she be afraid I'd hurt her?" in a single paragraph.
Good lord that's chilling. I may buy the book. Not so interested in the movie, but from that paragraph alone I recognize that the author knows how these people's minds work.
Anonymous
11/20/2023 08:46
Subject: The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes
Anonymous wrote:I’m seeing a lot of reviews like this. I think the ending is probably one of those things that needed more dialogue/outright explaining in the movie version because not everyone has read the book.Anonymous wrote:It was a decent movie, but I did not get the ending.
I often find narration in films to be lazy, but this movie may have benefitted from having Donald Sutherland retelling the tale. That scene in the book is Snow doing mental gymnastics. His though process goes from "If I want to truly clean up the evidence, I'll have to get rid of Lucy Gray..." to "Hey, is she hiding from me? Why would she be afraid I'd hurt her?" in a single paragraph.