Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you posting here and not driving there?

She's at work and told us she didn't want us to come

All the more reason TO GO.

This reminds me of my sister growing up. It was very tough and she's still not a happy person, but has a dog she's obsessed with and has "evened out" some. I touch base with her daily over dumb things like a movie I saw, some work anecdote, etc.

Therapy, SSRIs, and regular contact.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one has brought this up but this sounds like it might be part of BPD behavior.

Does your daughter have any of the other behaviors on this list?

If so, I strongly recommend you get her into DBT stat.

A pervasive pattern of instability of interpersonal relationships, self image and affects, and marked impulsivity beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by five (or more) of the following:

1. Fear of abandonment
2. Unstable or changing relationships
3. Unstable self-image; struggles with identity or sense of self
4. Impulsive or self-damaging behaviors (e.g., excessive spending, unsafe sex, substance abuse, reckless driving, binge eating).
5. Suicidal behavior or self-injury
6. Varied or random mood swings
7. Constant feelings of worthlessness or sadness
8. Problems with anger, including frequent loss of temper or physical fights
9. Stress-related paranoia or loss of contact with reality

Interesting. Most of these are yeses.

OP,

I'm sorry you have to deal with this situation. Given that your daughter displays many of these traits and that feeling suicidal one day but not remembering having felt so the next day is textbook BPD, it's likely that she does have it, but obviously, you'll want a confirmed diagnosis.
I second the advice for your daughter to start DBT as soon as possible if that is not the kind of therapy she's getting already--and with a therapist who specializes in personality disorders.

That said, there is no cure for BPD, only management of the condition which is impossible without genuine, consistent investment in long term therapy, and people with BPD have low capacity for maintaining stable, healthy relationships of any kind (you said that she is "doing great" with family relationships, but if you are referring to her relationships with you and your husband, I wonder how much accommodation you and he have been making in order to facilitate them, consciously or unconsciously as part of a longstanding pattern over the years. It's very telling that she has no longstanding friends). Indeed, telling people that one is suicidal every six months or so is not only manipulative but downright emotionally and psychologically abusive.

So you asked what you should do. Well, you are already on the right track in not overreacting when your daughter calls to say she's feeling suicidal. That is, aside from encouraging your daughter to get the therapy she needs, you and your husband need to create healthy boundaries by creating some emotional and psychological distance between yourselves and your daughter. Channel your energy into healthy relationships with friends and family. Prioritize your relationships with any healthy children you may have (your daughter's behavior didn't come out of nowhere; any immediate family members who have had to live with this dynamic have been affected by it and likely in ways that have sidelined them).

Get in the car and go.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm so sorry, OP. My DD25 has often been in that situation, though she's doing better now with an antidepressant that's been effective for her.

Has she ever made any attempts, or has she only threatened? Has she always contacted you? Does she live alone? What's her support system like?

She's never made an attempt, only idealization/planning. She contacts us sometimes but says, not all the time. She lives alone. She's shy and doesn't have much of a support system. She is doing great professionally! But has always struggled socially.

I think you're focusing on the wrong thing, OP. While it's good she's never made an attempt, it's *really* concerning that she has mentioned specific plans. Having a specific plan is always mentioned as a marker for serious concern or hospitalization.

She needs to be seeing a psychiatrist, not a PCP, and she may need help finding one and getting to the appointment. You might even go to the first one with her and share what she has told you for a few minutes at the beginning.

The fact that she is managing well in several areas but not socially, would really make me wonder about getting a complete neuropsych w/ some assessment of social pragmatic functioning.

Anonymous wrote:No one has brought this up but this sounds like it might be part of BPD behavior.

Does your daughter have any of the other behaviors on this list?

If so, I strongly recommend you get her into DBT stat.

A pervasive pattern of instability of interpersonal relationships, self image and affects, and marked impulsivity beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by five (or more) of the following:

1. Fear of abandonment
2. Unstable or changing relationships
3. Unstable self-image; struggles with identity or sense of self
4. Impulsive or self-damaging behaviors (e.g., excessive spending, unsafe sex, substance abuse, reckless driving, binge eating).
5. Suicidal behavior or self-injury
6. Varied or random mood swings
7. Constant feelings of worthlessness or sadness
8. Problems with anger, including frequent loss of temper or physical fights
9. Stress-related paranoia or loss of contact with reality

Interesting. Most of these are yeses.

I'm sorry you are all dealing with this.

When your daughter is no longer suicidal, YOU may want to call the suicide lifeline and ask for tips on how you can help her the next time. They will have that information to pass to you. And you may be able to help more than a stranger can the next time she is suicidal.

Your daughter had suicidal ideation and a plan but also a reason not to execute it. This is not a 911 situation. But she does need help. Her reason is somewhat situational so it may not be applicable the next time this happens.

I used to answer the suicide lifeline. Hope this was helpful.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pretty complicated issue, but I would think if she's doing this repeatedly, there are things in her life she wants to be different, but she isn't taking responsibility for why they are the way they are, or for changing them.

I think it's good you didn't go drive there. I need to feel valued or whatever other need would be met by that is not a healthy pattern to establish.

Is she a bit immature? Does she have OCD like tendencies or intrusive thoughts?

She might need a better therapist, but I think a full overall of what are her values and what are her morals would be most helpful.

I think lots of people sometimes imagine a suicide level "out". But for many they wouldn't do it because they wouldn't do that to their family and friends, the person who would find them, etc. Somehow in her mind being suicidal is acceptable behavior, and she feeds this by entertaining the thoughts, and not working to change things when she's not having the thoughts.

There are definitely things in her life she wants to change. She is in therapy and is doing great professionally and with family relationships, but has a hard time with peer relationships. She's pretty shy, anxious, a bit quirky. Very justice and value oriented. Yes, definitely OCD tendencies. I would assume yes to intrusive thoughts but I'm not sure.

There's a book "Breaking Free of Child Anxiety and OCD" by Eli R. Lebowitz. I read it for my 16 year old some time ago and it's helped quite a bit. No you're not parenting the same given she's an adult, but it might help you get into her mindset and help adjust things even just with weekly phone chats about nothing.

Sometimes we accommodated our kids issues so much while they were growing up that it's no wonder they have difficulty. Learning about this can help you see her through this. You become stable and a steady presence for her to start to shift her behavior patterns. You don't need to be with her all the time for this to happen.

The book will help. For example you might reassure her and yourself 'she's doing well!' She's got a good job, She excelled on her project, Her nieces adore her, She calls her brother. But kids (and adults) with anxiety/OCD traits don't benefit from this, and it can make it worse even - if I'm so good at x, so smart at y, why do I suck so terribly at z, there must be something really wrong with me.

There's a lot of spiraling that happens.

As a parent - hugs, it's a little traumatic to hear your kid say that stuff. But try to see it mostly as really inefficient unhelpful coping skills.

I would be concerned if the therapist gets it, or is reassuring her too much. Eg I had a therapist who was helping me with body image issues who always told me how great I looked. Not helpful.

She may need to learn to operate in the unknowns, without feedback, without criteria can she use to affirm herself in social situations.

Call 911 if she says she will jump out of an 11 story window.

No one has brought this up but this sounds like it might be part of BPD behavior.

Does your daughter have any of the other behaviors on this list?

If so, I strongly recommend you get her into DBT stat.

A pervasive pattern of instability of interpersonal relationships, self image and affects, and marked impulsivity beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by five (or more) of the following:

1. Fear of abandonment
2. Unstable or changing relationships
3. Unstable self-image; struggles with identity or sense of self
4. Impulsive or self-damaging behaviors (e.g., excessive spending, unsafe sex, substance abuse, reckless driving, binge eating).
5. Suicidal behavior or self-injury
6. Varied or random mood swings
7. Constant feelings of worthlessness or sadness
8. Problems with anger, including frequent loss of temper or physical fights
9. Stress-related paranoia or loss of contact with reality

Anonymous wrote:Why are you posting here and not driving there?

She's at work and told us she didn't want us to come

Why are you posting here and not driving there?

Anonymous wrote:Pretty complicated issue, but I would think if she's doing this repeatedly, there are things in her life she wants to be different, but she isn't taking responsibility for why they are the way they are, or for changing them.

I think it's good you didn't go drive there. I need to feel valued or whatever other need would be met by that is not a healthy pattern to establish.

Is she a bit immature? Does she have OCD like tendencies or intrusive thoughts?

She might need a better therapist, but I think a full overall of what are her values and what are her morals would be most helpful.

I think lots of people sometimes imagine a suicide level "out". But for many they wouldn't do it because they wouldn't do that to their family and friends, the person who would find them, etc. Somehow in her mind being suicidal is acceptable behavior, and she feeds this by entertaining the thoughts, and not working to change things when she's not having the thoughts.

There are definitely things in her life she wants to change. She is in therapy and is doing great professionally and with family relationships, but has a hard time with peer relationships. She's pretty shy, anxious, a bit quirky. Very justice and value oriented. Yes, definitely OCD tendencies. I would assume yes to intrusive thoughts but I'm not sure.

Pretty complicated issue, but I would think if she's doing this repeatedly, there are things in her life she wants to be different, but she isn't taking responsibility for why they are the way they are, or for changing them.

I think it's good you didn't go drive there. I need to feel valued or whatever other need would be met by that is not a healthy pattern to establish.

Is she a bit immature? Does she have OCD like tendencies or intrusive thoughts?

She might need a better therapist, but I think a full overall of what are her values and what are her morals would be most helpful.

I think lots of people sometimes imagine a suicide level "out". But for many they wouldn't do it because they wouldn't do that to their family and friends, the person who would find them, etc. Somehow in her mind being suicidal is acceptable behavior, and she feeds this by entertaining the thoughts, and not working to change things when she's not having the thoughts.

I am puzzled why you and your DH didn't drive down to see her last night. It's only two hours away.