Anonymous
Post 05/31/2023 16:26     Subject: Re:Stroller in European Cities
Anonymous wrote:Another Parisian

No stroller and no scooter

If you brought a stroller, you would need a very light and compact one to fold it up in restaurants and navigate narrow sidewalks - and I find those are very hard to push an older, heavier child in. It might be easier in a jogging type stroller, but those are too big for European cities.

I'd also advise against the scooter. My preschooler has one and it has taken a lot of work to teach her how to navigate the crowded sidewalks and busy urban streets - much busier than anyplace in DC. It will just be more stress on you.

I disagree. A cheap umbrella stroller is lightweight and so easy to push around. We used it all around Athens/Greek islands with bumpy sidewalks and it was a life saver! No whining or complaining heard and naps could be easily taken when adults wanted to continue sightseeing.
Anonymous
Post 05/31/2023 14:51     Subject: Stroller in European Cities
This is one of the reasons the US has an obesity problem. Seriously, kids are carted around in strollers instead of using their legs, they get a general sense that being lazy is the way to go and don't walk enough in their lifetime.
Anonymous
Post 05/31/2023 11:39     Subject: Stroller in European Cities
We took our DS to Paris at 5 and had no need for a stroller but he also didn't need one at 4 in Disney. He doesn't mind walking and we just took breaks at parks, cafes, etc or took cabs/public transportation if needed. Obviously kids are different but a stroller just seems like a massive headache.
Anonymous
Post 05/31/2023 11:36     Subject: Re:Stroller in European Cities
FWIW, I took a stroller to Paris when my DD was 3 -- she got sick while we were visiting friends in London, sick enough that we almost cancelled our quick side-trip to Paris with them. We ended up borrowing a stroller so we would have it in case she wasn't feeling well.

It was a major PITA. I really regretted bringing it -- in part because she bounced back fast and maybe used it once, but mostly because it was really hard to get around with it.
Anonymous
Post 05/31/2023 10:17     Subject: Re:Stroller in European Cities
Anonymous wrote:No, that’s way too old for a stroller.


I’m the one saying, why not just get lodging by a great neighborhood in a fun neighborhood and avoid long walks?

If the parents do want to walk around a lot, there’s not anything so terrible about letting a 5-year-old ride in a stroller.

But I think the disadvantages of relying heavily on a stroller in a place like Paris are:

- Schlepping the stroller around and keeping it from getting lost or stolen.

- Narrow, bumpy, crowded streets.

- The need to deal with subway stairs, escalators, etc.

If parents really want to go on a trip to a European city and walk around a lot, and the parents are strong people with good backs, it might be better to get a backpack child carrier:

https://mumsonflipflops.com/best-carriers-for-toddlers-preschool/

The disadvantage is figuring out how to get the kid and carrier on your back, but the advantage is that you can go up and down steps.
Anonymous
Post 05/31/2023 10:13     Subject: Stroller in European Cities
I have always been one to say "no" to strollers; I have had my kids walk or wore them in a baby/toddler carrier.

The EXCEPTION was this spring break when I took my kids (almost 5 yr old) and 7.5 yr old to London for a week. My younger child is extremely petite and I brought the GB pockit stroller. It was a godsend! Our trip would have been A LOT different and less enjoyable without it.

I will say that London was AWESOME with a stroller, I think that Copenhagen would be fine with a stroller, but cities like Paris, Porto, and Lisbon would NOT be good with a stroller. My kids DID walk Portugal, France, Germany, and Copenhagen BUT my DH carried our then 4 yr old on his shoulders A LOT.

It all depends on WHERE you are going, your child's abilities, and if you can carry them if need be.
Anonymous
Post 05/31/2023 10:09     Subject: Re:Stroller in European Cities
Anonymous wrote:Another Parisian

No stroller and no scooter

If you brought a stroller, you would need a very light and compact one to fold it up in restaurants and navigate narrow sidewalks - and I find those are very hard to push an older, heavier child in. It might be easier in a jogging type stroller, but those are too big for European cities.

I'd also advise against the scooter. My preschooler has one and it has taken a lot of work to teach her how to navigate the crowded sidewalks and busy urban streets - much busier than anyplace in DC. It will just be more stress on you.


Former Londoner – agree on both. People often suggest scooters for little kids (and local kids use them from a crazy early age!) but unless your child has already mastered urban scootering, it’s not worth the anxiety and annoyance that will result. We travel back often and did not use a stroller from age 3. We stopped when needed and perched kid on shoulders when desperate. We stopped for playground breaks and snack breaks. If you’re planning a trip appropriate for a 5yo, it shouldn’t be an issue.

Our child is now 12 and he whined more about “being sooooooo tired” at 10-12 than he did at 3-5. At 3-5, a snack and the promise of something fun around the next corner was all it took to keep him moving.
Anonymous
Post 05/31/2023 09:59     Subject: Stroller in European Cities
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

Focus trips on lodging by glorious playgrounds in neighborhoods that are the local equivalent of Georgetown or Adams Morgan. Maybe go on one double decker bus tour to see the sights. Otherwise, don’t make a big effort to see sights; instead, have fun living like a local. Then, you won’t need a stroller, because you won’t walk that much.


Or you could bring a stroller and go see the sights. Why are people suggesting tailoring the entire trip around not bringing a stroller? They make these tiny, lightweight travel strollers now that are so easy to fly with and carry up stairs or onto a train or metro, and collapse down small enough to fit under your chair in a restaurant.


The best playgrounds in places like Manhattan, Paris and London are actually gorgeous works of interactive art themselves, and they’re often by a variety of nice restaurants, big and small museums, and historic churches.

If you want to keep doing the pre-kid kinds of trip to Europe, that’s great.

But the kid-focused kind of trip can be a lot of fun, too, and beautiful and informative in its own way.
Anonymous
Post 05/31/2023 09:57     Subject: Stroller in European Cities
I would prepare your kid for no stroller by doing daily long walks - maybe a few a day. Be prepared to take breaks and factor in that timing. My 6 year old would never be able to do what we did in Paris.
Anonymous
Post 05/31/2023 09:52     Subject: Re:Stroller in European Cities
No, that’s way too old for a stroller.

I just slowed down my pace and made more stops. If it were me alone, I’d try to fit in as a much as possible.

But it can be nice to take things more slowly and see the world through your child’s eyes. My DS at that age and even younger enjoyed seeing different city buses and trains and would want to observe these at length - just stand there observing for 10-15 min, or longer if we could sit.
Not my cup of tea at all, but I wanted to foster some curiosity and interest in the world and see what drew him. Many many years later, he would like to be a transportation engineer and just finished his first year of civil engineering at university.
Anonymous
Post 05/31/2023 09:30     Subject: Stroller in European Cities
When I traveled with kids that age we did not bring a stroller. its more bulk to bring around, would be bumpy on uneven streets and sidewalks. We don't need it for naps. We walked all over Rome and did not have a problem with the 5 year old as long as we were not on a forced march.
Anonymous
Post 05/31/2023 09:28     Subject: Re:Stroller in European Cities
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I'm American and wouldn't bring a stroller for a 5 year old, though I would for a 4 year old, so it might depend on whether your child is just-turned 5 or almost 6.

It is important to remember, before people get condescending and rude, that OP is asking about a stroller for vacation, not every day use. I live in a city and walk everywhere and so does my kid. But we have normal lives going to work and school and eating at home most nights, with typical bedtimes for a young child, etc.

On vacation, especially to a walkable foreign city, we can spend all day on our feet, sight seeing, exploring museums, etc. We may want to extend the day a bit and go for a walk after dinner, or just spend more time out and about enjoying our surroundings, and not hurry back to our hotel or rental at 6pm for dinner in and normal bedtime. For a young child, that is a lot and they get tired, and having a stroller handy can offer them needed breaks and make it easier on the margins -- walking home after dinner, walking back to the hotel after a few hours at a garden or museum, etc.

Having said that, my almost-6 year old doesn't need a stroller anymore -- we can just take breaks as needed and she doesn't complain too much even when on her feet for long periods of time. But when we were in Montreal when she was just shy of 5, we brought our travel stroller and used it on the two longest days of sightseeing and were glad we had it.

No need to get smug about forcing a very young child to walk all day long instead of giving them a perfectly appropriate break in a stroller now and then.
The point is that you don't force them to walk all day long. You build in breaks. We don't take the exact same vacations that we did pre-kid. They are still awesome, but they are different.


I don't know if you read my post or just have poor reading comprehension, but I have a kid and have traveled extensively with her. We walk a lot on this kind of trip -- the whole point of visiting a foreign city is to walk around, see the sights, experience the culture. I'm not taking my kid to Paris and spending half the time in the hotel. Once she was no longer napping, we started traveling more and she does great. But yes, until age 5 we brought a small travel stroller as a just in case, and it was very useful.

I do not understand why people are so weird about strollers. It's a useful parenting item! If you don't want to use it, that's fine, but people get so weird on this website about "well my child has not used a stroller since 2.5, we believe in walking!" Like, how do you think we are pushing the stroller, on a moped? We used a stroller extensively when our child was younger specifically because we walk so much and sometimes our kid needed a break.


Because it’s a fundamental difference in how people view handling transitional times. With a newly potty trained child, most people would be saying stop and find bathrooms along the way, with more frequency than you need yourself. You would be saying I only need the bathroom infrequently so even though my child is potty trained, I’m going to use a parenting tool designed for younger children (diapers) so I don’t have to stop so often to allow my child to use the toilet. You can do whatever you want. None of it affects anyone but you and your child, and I don’t think there are long-lasting harmful consequences. But people are reacting because you are infantilizing your child for your convenience/travel preferences and others would say why even bring a child on this type of trip if you’re going to run the 5 year old ragged to the point of needing a stroller.
Anonymous
Post 05/31/2023 09:21     Subject: Stroller in European Cities
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Taking a several week vacation this summer to several European cities. We plan to walk a ton in places like Paris, Rome and London. Our youngest child will just be 5. Would you bring a stroller or scooter for a kid that age? Or just have them tough it out? It is hard to imagine getting far in a timely manner with a 5 year old all on foot, but also she hasn’t used a stroller in a couple of years. What have others done with kids this age on trips with lots of walking?


Focus trips on lodging by glorious playgrounds in neighborhoods that are the local equivalent of Georgetown or Adams Morgan. Maybe go on one double decker bus tour to see the sights. Otherwise, don’t make a big effort to see sights; instead, have fun living like a local. Then, you won’t need a stroller, because you won’t walk that much.


Or you could bring a stroller and go see the sights. Why are people suggesting tailoring the entire trip around not bringing a stroller? They make these tiny, lightweight travel strollers now that are so easy to fly with and carry up stairs or onto a train or metro, and collapse down small enough to fit under your chair in a restaurant.

I guess if you have a really big kid, that's not practical. But if you have an average size preschooler or kindergartener and want to do more walking/exploring on your trip, just bring a stroller. What is the point in buying trans-Atlantic plane tickets and taking a week off work so that your kid can go to a fancy French playground? Makes no sense -- just stay home.
Anonymous
Post 05/31/2023 09:18     Subject: Re:Stroller in European Cities
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I'm American and wouldn't bring a stroller for a 5 year old, though I would for a 4 year old, so it might depend on whether your child is just-turned 5 or almost 6.

It is important to remember, before people get condescending and rude, that OP is asking about a stroller for vacation, not every day use. I live in a city and walk everywhere and so does my kid. But we have normal lives going to work and school and eating at home most nights, with typical bedtimes for a young child, etc.

On vacation, especially to a walkable foreign city, we can spend all day on our feet, sight seeing, exploring museums, etc. We may want to extend the day a bit and go for a walk after dinner, or just spend more time out and about enjoying our surroundings, and not hurry back to our hotel or rental at 6pm for dinner in and normal bedtime. For a young child, that is a lot and they get tired, and having a stroller handy can offer them needed breaks and make it easier on the margins -- walking home after dinner, walking back to the hotel after a few hours at a garden or museum, etc.

Having said that, my almost-6 year old doesn't need a stroller anymore -- we can just take breaks as needed and she doesn't complain too much even when on her feet for long periods of time. But when we were in Montreal when she was just shy of 5, we brought our travel stroller and used it on the two longest days of sightseeing and were glad we had it.

No need to get smug about forcing a very young child to walk all day long instead of giving them a perfectly appropriate break in a stroller now and then.
The point is that you don't force them to walk all day long. You build in breaks. We don't take the exact same vacations that we did pre-kid. They are still awesome, but they are different.


I don't know if you read my post or just have poor reading comprehension, but I have a kid and have traveled extensively with her. We walk a lot on this kind of trip -- the whole point of visiting a foreign city is to walk around, see the sights, experience the culture. I'm not taking my kid to Paris and spending half the time in the hotel. Once she was no longer napping, we started traveling more and she does great. But yes, until age 5 we brought a small travel stroller as a just in case, and it was very useful.

I do not understand why people are so weird about strollers. It's a useful parenting item! If you don't want to use it, that's fine, but people get so weird on this website about "well my child has not used a stroller since 2.5, we believe in walking!" Like, how do you think we are pushing the stroller, on a moped? We used a stroller extensively when our child was younger specifically because we walk so much and sometimes our kid needed a break.
Anonymous
Post 05/31/2023 09:11     Subject: Stroller in European Cities
Anonymous wrote:Taking a several week vacation this summer to several European cities. We plan to walk a ton in places like Paris, Rome and London. Our youngest child will just be 5. Would you bring a stroller or scooter for a kid that age? Or just have them tough it out? It is hard to imagine getting far in a timely manner with a 5 year old all on foot, but also she hasn’t used a stroller in a couple of years. What have others done with kids this age on trips with lots of walking?


Focus trips on lodging by glorious playgrounds in neighborhoods that are the local equivalent of Georgetown or Adams Morgan. Maybe go on one double decker bus tour to see the sights. Otherwise, don’t make a big effort to see sights; instead, have fun living like a local. Then, you won’t need a stroller, because you won’t walk that much.