Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have also worked in publishing in many years. Unless you really can't bear not to, the best thing to do is not to bother getting published. It's brutal and thankless. But if you have the drive, then the advice here is decent.

NP and i’d love to hear more about this from those of you who worked in publishing/are authors.

I wouldn’t go so far as to say it’s brutal and thankless … I actually find it less work than self publishing (if you want to self publish and make your work stand out, you need to put a bunch of money out up front for editing, designers, etc). Unless your book sells really well, you will likely not make your advance back or you won’t make much after the advance. I would say writing books in general is not a lucrative career which is why it’s hard to make a decent living solely as an author.

Anonymous wrote:For non-fiction, how much does your social media following matter?

It always seems like book deals are handed out left and right to influencers (often for not very good books), but I've heard people with really good book proposals struggle because they don't have tens of thousands of Instagram followers.

Curious how much truth there is to this?

It matters a pretty decent amount. I did well enough with self publishing that I was able to get an agent and a book deal after. My self published work has been selling well for years now and I made quite a bit of money. Even with that, publishers were still not impressed because they want that large social media following and I’m unwilling to be that kind of public persona. So basically, you can get a book deal in non fiction without a social media following but it’s an uphill battle.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FWIW it doesn't need to be perfect to get an agent. It just needs to be good, and the agent needs to see something in the book they think they can work with.

Don't get psyched out, is what I am trying to say. Get your book in as close to great shape as you think you can, then start querying. Agents will have ideas of changes you should make before they start trying to sell your book, so be ready for rewrites.

Terrible advice for fiction.

My agent gets thousands of queries a week. She is looking for reasons to reject. That is typical.

No book is ever perfect and you can overwork a book, and at some point you do have to send it out, but it's a mistake to send it out when it has not been edited or is not in the best shape you can make it. If you get rejected, you won't be able to query that agents with that book again.

Waste of everyone's time.

+1 yeah that poster was just making Shxt up as they went along. There's a lot of that on DCUM, strong opinions based on zero actual knowledge.

Anonymous wrote:FWIW it doesn't need to be perfect to get an agent. It just needs to be good, and the agent needs to see something in the book they think they can work with.

Don't get psyched out, is what I am trying to say. Get your book in as close to great shape as you think you can, then start querying. Agents will have ideas of changes you should make before they start trying to sell your book, so be ready for rewrites.

Terrible advice for fiction.

My agent gets thousands of queries a week. She is looking for reasons to reject. That is typical.

No book is ever perfect and you can overwork a book, and at some point you do have to send it out, but it's a mistake to send it out when it has not been edited or is not in the best shape you can make it. If you get rejected, you won't be able to query that agents with that book again.

Waste of everyone's time.

Anonymous wrote:I have also worked in publishing in many years. Unless you really can't bear not to, the best thing to do is not to bother getting published. It's brutal and thankless. But if you have the drive, then the advice here is decent.

NP and i’d love to hear more about this from those of you who worked in publishing/are authors.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Second what all the published authors say. Listen to the Sh#t noone tells you about writing podcast to learn about the query letter and opening pages. It's not enough to write an amazing book, you have to write a killer query letter to even get agents to read your ms.

that is not entirely true. I worked as an agent for 10+ years and I ignored most of the stuff in the letters, it was the manuscript that I focused on. If the letter was a long ramble dropping names and such, it was off putting. A simple "here's my script, thanks for reading" I'd breathe a sigh of relief.

While I appreciate you worked in the industry, you must understand that not everyone works exactly like you did and that the industry has evolved? Do you know how many agents don't allow you to submit pages now? Nobody wants name dropping. They want book jacket copy and comp titles.

Sure, OP. Go ahead and try what this former agent says, and please share the data on your success rate.

Jacket copy is written by the Marketing Dept.

Haha. Spouse won major awards and publisher did zilch with marketing. Friend was on GMA to talk about book, and publisher did nothing. May as well self-publish.

FWIW it doesn't need to be perfect to get an agent. It just needs to be good, and the agent needs to see something in the book they think they can work with.

Don't get psyched out, is what I am trying to say. Get your book in as close to great shape as you think you can, then start querying. Agents will have ideas of changes you should make before they start trying to sell your book, so be ready for rewrites.

^^ My sister is a journalist and she had 85K followers she was keeping so she could promote her book, but I think most of them have jumped ship now.

Twitter was useful for us writers until Musk took over then it sort of died.

Anonymous wrote:For non-fiction, how much does your social media following matter?

It always seems like book deals are handed out left and right to influencers (often for not very good books), but I've heard people with really good book proposals struggle because they don't have tens of thousands of Instagram followers.

Curious how much truth there is to this?

You should get a subscription to Publisher's Marketplace, even if just for one month. Check out all the NF deals in your category and see what following they have. I often check people out (fiction and NF authors) and I've only seen one NF book deal go to a person without a following. If it's memoir, I think the hook matters more, but with other NF I think most have some following. But, you can also put in the marketing section of your proposal, what you plan to do. Any way you can help an agent pitch and position the book, the better. Also, if it's timely, a following may not matter. Like say you write a book about a pandemic, and then a pandemic happens.

Anonymous wrote:For non-fiction, how much does your social media following matter?

It always seems like book deals are handed out left and right to influencers (often for not very good books), but I've heard people with really good book proposals struggle because they don't have tens of thousands of Instagram followers.

Curious how much truth there is to this?

I'm a nonfiction writer (reporter) without a huge following who got a book deal. I had finished half the book when I queried -- I think those with lots of followers often get deals on the basis of much less (like on one good article, for example).

Anonymous wrote:For non-fiction, how much does your social media following matter?

It always seems like book deals are handed out left and right to influencers (often for not very good books), but I've heard people with really good book proposals struggle because they don't have tens of thousands of Instagram followers.

Curious how much truth there is to this?

Not an expert, but I assume publishers have some fixed percentage of followers they assume will buy a book from someone they like. That's X copies of the book the author has already sold for them. That understandably figures into what books they would publish, no? Assuming a standard publishing house -- I assume the academic presses are a bit different.

For non-fiction, how much does your social media following matter?

It always seems like book deals are handed out left and right to influencers (often for not very good books), but I've heard people with really good book proposals struggle because they don't have tens of thousands of Instagram followers.

Curious how much truth there is to this?

Anonymous wrote:I have also worked in publishing in many years. Unless you really can't bear not to, the best thing to do is not to bother getting published. It's brutal and thankless. But if you have the drive, then the advice here is decent.

So true. PP/published novelist here.

If I had poured half as many hours and work into anything else I would be successful in my field. Instead I am a mid-list author. If I could do it over, I would write as a hobby on the side and pursue a more lucrative career instead of the other way round.

I have also worked in publishing in many years. Unless you really can't bear not to, the best thing to do is not to bother getting published. It's brutal and thankless. But if you have the drive, then the advice here is decent.