Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know Amherst ranks well but I genuinely don't see how it's equally good as Williams when it comes to academics. If you go by raw academic stats (class sizes, student to faculty ratio, financial spending, etc.) Williams is the front runner. You have oxford style tutorials and some top notch academic centers at Williams too.

The alternate ranking below looks at professor quality, diversity, student happiness, and number of classes offered/class sizes. Unfortunately it only includes schools that required test scores in 2019, but for those in NESCAC that are included Williams placed significantly higher (#6) than Amherst (#39) and all the others. The list, btw, includes universities, too, and is ahead of all Ivies except Penn (#5).

https://lesshighschoolstress.com/blog/6/

That particular ranking does not look specifically at academic factors which is what OP was asking. If you're looking at other factors, one could pull data to support Amherst over Williams depending on what factor you are looking at. Back to academic factors though, Amherst has the 5 college consortium, including UMass Amherst, which Williams, being so remote, does not.

When we toured, it sounded like Amherst kids didn't really use classes at other campuses unless it was a very specific need. Not anything like Haverford/Bryn Mayer/Swath level of cooperation/shared campuses.

Anonymous wrote:In tiers, my perception is:
1. Williams
2. Amherst, Bowdoin
3. Tufts, Middlebury
4. Hamilton, Wesleyan
5. Colby, Bates
6. Trinity, Connecticut

This would be my answer - from the parent/aunt of kids at 4 different NESCACs

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know Amherst ranks well but I genuinely don't see how it's equally good as Williams when it comes to academics. If you go by raw academic stats (class sizes, student to faculty ratio, financial spending, etc.) Williams is the front runner. You have oxford style tutorials and some top notch academic centers at Williams too.

The alternate ranking below looks at professor quality, diversity, student happiness, and number of classes offered/class sizes. Unfortunately it only includes schools that required test scores in 2019, but for those in NESCAC that are included Williams placed significantly higher (#6) than Amherst (#39) and all the others. The list, btw, includes universities, too, and is ahead of all Ivies except Penn (#5).

https://lesshighschoolstress.com/blog/6/

That particular ranking does not look specifically at academic factors which is what OP was asking. If you're looking at other factors, one could pull data to support Amherst over Williams depending on what factor you are looking at. Back to academic factors though, Amherst has the 5 college consortium, including UMass Amherst, which Williams, being so remote, does not.

Anonymous wrote:The Fiske Guide To Colleges 2023 edition academic ratings:

Amherst, Williams, Bowdoin, & Wesleyan = 5

Tufts, Hamilton,Middlebury, Colby, & Bates = 4.5

Conn College & Trinity College = 4

Based on prestige & academics:

Williams & Amherst

Bowdoin & Middlebury

Hamilton, Wesleyan, & Tufts

Colby

Bates

Trinity College & Conn College

I think Bowdoin is a clear step above Middlebury academically even though on paper they are sort of similar schools. Not to mention that Bowdoin's endowment per student (around $1M per student) is third after Wiliams ($1.45) and Amherst ($1.29), and the fourth school is Hamilton at less than $500k per kid. That's a big gap that has an effect over time.

Note that the "six college" liberal arts schools that do admissions stuff together are Williams, Amherst, Bowdoin, Swarthmore, Pomona, and Carleton. That's one way Willams and Amherst kind of shows which schools it thinks are its reasonable peers. I think Middlebury is sort of doing its own thing now, especially with admitted 80% of its class via ED.

Hamilton has a lot of money and is trying to use that to move up, but its location and campus is going to be a challenge for it. But a lot of kids are really happy when they go there. Wes is unique and the top of its class is impressive but it isn't that hard to get in comparatively. Tufts is not really NESCAC in feel but is probably the school below Bowdoin now.

All of the differences are small and a kid that is happy and does well at a "lower-ranked" school will likely do better post-college than a kid at a "higher-ranked" school who is unhappy and doesn't do well.

Williams
Amherst
Bowdoin
Tufts
Middlebury
Hamilton
Wesleyan
Colby
Bates
Trinity or Conn College

Anonymous wrote:I know Amherst ranks well but I genuinely don't see how it's equally good as Williams when it comes to academics. If you go by raw academic stats (class sizes, student to faculty ratio, financial spending, etc.) Williams is the front runner. You have oxford style tutorials and some top notch academic centers at Williams too.

The alternate ranking below looks at professor quality, diversity, student happiness, and number of classes offered/class sizes. Unfortunately it only includes schools that required test scores in 2019, but for those in NESCAC that are included Williams placed significantly higher (#6) than Amherst (#39) and all the others. The list, btw, includes universities, too, and is ahead of all Ivies except Penn (#5).

https://lesshighschoolstress.com/blog/6/

The Fiske Guide To Colleges 2023 edition academic ratings:

Amherst, Williams, Bowdoin, & Wesleyan = 5

Tufts, Hamilton,Middlebury, Colby, & Bates = 4.5

Conn College & Trinity College = 4

Based on prestige & academics:

Williams & Amherst

Bowdoin & Middlebury

Hamilton, Wesleyan, & Tufts

Colby

Bates

Trinity College & Conn College

Anonymous wrote:funny thing is that Trinity punches well above it’s weight placing on wall street - very strong career center, alumni loyalty, and pre professionalism vibe. In fact, likely equal to Williams in that regard, and I’ve worked and hired on the street for 30 years. Tucker Carlson and Marc Watters from Fox are two impressive alumni also..

Does it still though? Seems like it’s a school for the bozo prep school kids of Wall Street guys who are willing and able to pay full price for the legacy prestige of that degree.

Tucker and Jesse rip on their alma mater all the time by the way.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tier 1 Amherst and Williams
Tier 2 Tufts, Middlebury and Wesleyan
Tier 3 Bates, Hamilton, Colby
Tier 4 Connecticut and Trinity

switch wes and ham

hamilton is a hard one to figure out - I really wanted to be impressed but the place is just sooo depressing and lacks energy. My DC gave me the high sign to bolt halfway thru the tour. iPretty bleh feeling overall - only school where kids appeared more fake and robotic was Williams. At least Wesleyan has a personality, and the campus felt electric during our tour - kids were passionate, like it or not. Much too woke though end of day, even for an athlete

Hamilton isn't NESCAC. It's in the Liberty League for athletics.

It's Nescac

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tier 1 Amherst and Williams
Tier 2 Tufts, Middlebury and Wesleyan
Tier 3 Bates, Hamilton, Colby
Tier 4 Connecticut and Trinity

switch wes and ham

hamilton is a hard one to figure out - I really wanted to be impressed but the place is just sooo depressing and lacks energy. My DC gave me the high sign to bolt halfway thru the tour. iPretty bleh feeling overall - only school where kids appeared more fake and robotic was Williams. At least Wesleyan has a personality, and the campus felt electric during our tour - kids were passionate, like it or not. Much too woke though end of day, even for an athlete

Hamilton isn't NESCAC. It's in the Liberty League for athletics.

that is incorrect

Whoops, you're right. I saw many Liberty League games versus Hamilton and just assumed otherwise. My mistake.

so I agree it’s strange since it’s not actually in New England!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tier 1 Amherst and Williams
Tier 2 Tufts, Middlebury and Wesleyan
Tier 3 Bates, Hamilton, Colby
Tier 4 Connecticut and Trinity

switch wes and ham

hamilton is a hard one to figure out - I really wanted to be impressed but the place is just sooo depressing and lacks energy. My DC gave me the high sign to bolt halfway thru the tour. iPretty bleh feeling overall - only school where kids appeared more fake and robotic was Williams. At least Wesleyan has a personality, and the campus felt electric during our tour - kids were passionate, like it or not. Much too woke though end of day, even for an athlete

Hamilton isn't NESCAC. It's in the Liberty League for athletics.

that is incorrect

Whoops, you're right. I saw many Liberty League games versus Hamilton and just assumed otherwise. My mistake.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tier 1 Amherst and Williams
Tier 2 Tufts, Middlebury and Wesleyan
Tier 3 Bates, Hamilton, Colby
Tier 4 Connecticut and Trinity

switch wes and ham

hamilton is a hard one to figure out - I really wanted to be impressed but the place is just sooo depressing and lacks energy. My DC gave me the high sign to bolt halfway thru the tour. iPretty bleh feeling overall - only school where kids appeared more fake and robotic was Williams. At least Wesleyan has a personality, and the campus felt electric during our tour - kids were passionate, like it or not. Much too woke though end of day, even for an athlete

Hamilton isn't NESCAC. It's in the Liberty League for athletics.

that is incorrect

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wonder if Bates even deserves to be on same tier as Colby.

It should still be above Trinity and Conn, which really seem non-selective at this point if you are full pay

Bates and Colby are essentially the same.

Not in terms of test scores.

But once you are there, they are very similar. Unless all the Colby a$$es go around stating their test scores as they introduce themselves at crappy Central Maine coast bars only to be laughed at by the stoned Bates students.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wonder if Bates even deserves to be on same tier as Colby.

It should still be above Trinity and Conn, which really seem non-selective at this point if you are full pay

Bates and Colby are essentially the same.

Not in terms of test scores.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tier 1 Amherst and Williams
Tier 2 Tufts, Middlebury and Wesleyan
Tier 3 Bates, Hamilton, Colby
Tier 4 Connecticut and Trinity

switch wes and ham

hamilton is a hard one to figure out - I really wanted to be impressed but the place is just sooo depressing and lacks energy. My DC gave me the high sign to bolt halfway thru the tour. iPretty bleh feeling overall - only school where kids appeared more fake and robotic was Williams. At least Wesleyan has a personality, and the campus felt electric during our tour - kids were passionate, like it or not. Much too woke though end of day, even for an athlete

Hamilton isn't NESCAC. It's in the Liberty League for athletics.

funny thing is that Trinity punches well above it’s weight placing on wall street - very strong career center, alumni loyalty, and pre professionalism vibe. In fact, likely equal to Williams in that regard, and I’ve worked and hired on the street for 30 years. Tucker Carlson and Marc Watters from Fox are two impressive alumni also..