Anonymous
04/10/2023 15:02
Subject: I Cannot Stand My Mother
my FIL was like this. We had him in our home for 18 months, and then couldn't take it anymore. We moved him into assisted living. He made our home totally completely toxic, and he was mean to not only us (his son, me, 2 grandkids) but also our 2 private caregivers we employed.
All i felt when he left was relief. And then when he died 5 years later, I never had any regrets whatsoever. We tried whole heartedly and he still abused us. I have complete peace about our part.
All i felt when he left was relief. And then when he died 5 years later, I never had any regrets whatsoever. We tried whole heartedly and he still abused us. I have complete peace about our part.
Anonymous
04/10/2023 12:27
Subject: I Cannot Stand My Mother
Anonymous wrote:PS she also calls me names, is snarky, says mean things about me in front of the kids, yells at me loudly, etc
That's when I'd tell her she needs to leave.
This is unacceptable behavior. Find a home and kicks her out. No guilt.
Anonymous
04/10/2023 12:21
Subject: Re:I Cannot Stand My Mother
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Play hardball with her. There’s no need to take abuse from anyone, including your mother. As soon as she says something, respond with:
“Stop talking to me that way. It’s rude, and I’m not putting up with it. Either you speak to me with respect or you find somewhere else to live. What’s your choice?”
I’d keep track of what she says. Keep a log. Show it to her. Let her know “When you get to this line (point to a few lines down from her latest comment), this is when you leave. I don’t want any surprises for you.”
I recommend this approach, including keeping the log. She could live for years and years. Better to get it all in hand now.
This. There is another thread about "what do I owe my parents," and for an abusive parent, the answer is unquestionably "nothing." Ignore the trolls who just go around shitting on people.
Anonymous
04/09/2023 19:29
Subject: I Cannot Stand My Mother
You are preaching to the choir, op! To the big choir.
Why they do that? I wish I knew.
One minute on the phone my mom, 76, is telling me how she raised wonderful DDs, and now her grandkids are great young adults, and she has a grand new baby granddaughter at her age that we all adore.
The next minute I joke that my niece will rip the flower headband off her head, as babies do, and she starts ranting about...I do not even know what. It was just a joke that babies do not like some Easter wreaths or anything on their heads.
So I tell mom, you have no sense of humor. She does not. Everything is offensive unless she is labeling sarcasm and criticism on us.
Her response: " Why would I ever have a sense of humor when my life was always suffering and misery and there is nothing good in my life."
Then, it must be that brain injury I had as a child that robbed me of a sense of humor.
Me: Mom, why are you always a victim?
Mom: Of course, I am a victim; I have suffered and never had anything good.
I am exhausted from this victim narc BS. Nothing good, a three-story house with a pool and manicured grounds. Village estate, two dds who are accomplished professionals—three gorgeous grandkids, and a great private business she did on her own.
Vacations in several countries, including a safari in Africa. Zanzibar for swimming with tortoises, Pyramids in Egypt, to mention a few things she did.
But nothing matters except that she was a post-WWII child in Europe and a premie.
She does not even see that she insulted my sister and me; nope, I am mean to hear tell her. It is her old age, but she was always critical and nasty.
It makes me think she is a cover victim narcissist.
Why they do that? I wish I knew.
One minute on the phone my mom, 76, is telling me how she raised wonderful DDs, and now her grandkids are great young adults, and she has a grand new baby granddaughter at her age that we all adore.
The next minute I joke that my niece will rip the flower headband off her head, as babies do, and she starts ranting about...I do not even know what. It was just a joke that babies do not like some Easter wreaths or anything on their heads.
So I tell mom, you have no sense of humor. She does not. Everything is offensive unless she is labeling sarcasm and criticism on us.
Her response: " Why would I ever have a sense of humor when my life was always suffering and misery and there is nothing good in my life."
Then, it must be that brain injury I had as a child that robbed me of a sense of humor.
Me: Mom, why are you always a victim?
Mom: Of course, I am a victim; I have suffered and never had anything good.
I am exhausted from this victim narc BS. Nothing good, a three-story house with a pool and manicured grounds. Village estate, two dds who are accomplished professionals—three gorgeous grandkids, and a great private business she did on her own.
Vacations in several countries, including a safari in Africa. Zanzibar for swimming with tortoises, Pyramids in Egypt, to mention a few things she did.
But nothing matters except that she was a post-WWII child in Europe and a premie.
She does not even see that she insulted my sister and me; nope, I am mean to hear tell her. It is her old age, but she was always critical and nasty.
It makes me think she is a cover victim narcissist.
Anonymous
04/09/2023 09:30
Subject: I Cannot Stand My Mother
You have tried. Your children (if you have them) have seen this. Time to find an alternative, and present it to mom, kindly, gently and with facts, not emotion.
Mom, you've made it clear you are not happy here, despite my trying my best. Here is information about 2 alternatives, we can visit them next week, and then you can decide, move to one of them, or start treating me better and stay here. The choice is yours.
Mom, you've made it clear you are not happy here, despite my trying my best. Here is information about 2 alternatives, we can visit them next week, and then you can decide, move to one of them, or start treating me better and stay here. The choice is yours.
Anonymous
04/08/2023 19:43
Subject: I Cannot Stand My Mother
Anonymous wrote:You are earning your way into heaven. Do you think you deserve a free pass?
SERIOUSLY? You are a loon.
Anonymous
04/08/2023 19:37
Subject: Re:I Cannot Stand My Mother
Anonymous wrote:OP let me share my perspective with you. For background, I was raised by a wolf mother too - actually, that’s an insult to wolves - so I’m acutely aware of the particular cruelty of a psychologically twisted mother. This stuff comes from personality disorder, it is not easy stuff to fix especially because most of these cold critical nasty negative mothers are up there on the bad end of the narcissistic personality traits spectrum, and do not even have the capacity to recognize their behavior is dysfunctional thus no willingness to work on behavior change which requires insight. Narcissists do not progress much in therapy, even if you can get one there.
Now, after spending all my reproductive years on academic and career achievement in law and then having a health breakdown in my early 40s, I have spent the last 7 years working as a caregiver primarily for hospice status patients. Beyond my personal experience of dozens of clients, I have read extensively and shared experiences with other caregivers in support groups - yes, even unrelated caregivers need support groups and other strategies to cope with the harrowing effects of the work, which is too often with angry bitter people who lash out on the regular even at their paid, non related caregivers.
What I’ve seen is that people usually become more of what they always were as they age and decline both physically and cognitively. The Scrooge transformation upon realization of impending mortality is a fantastical imagination - the truth of most of humanity is much more evident in Miss Havisham, and Dickens knew better than most how fraught the parent child relationship could be. Your mom is not likely to get any nicer and is much more likely to be more and more cruel as she becomes more vulnerable in her body and mind. She cannot help but be especially cruel to you, because mothers of this type have spent a lifetime installing our psychological vulnerabilities in us and they can trigger them with very little effort, even if we have the insight and work very very hard, it is toxic to live day in and day out with a bully. If you keep your mother at home she will likely steal at least 5 years from your life expectancy, time you could have with your kids and grandkids at the end of your life. In the meantime the toxic dynamic she exudes into your family home will have effects that you may not even perceive now - children who live with a bully and watch that bully do their bullying to someone they really love are impacted by that, trust me. It will impact them in how they feel about intimacy with family, friends and someday potential partners and their own kids.
I would urge you t set aside any misplaced guilt and research options for your mother to live in assisted living or other similar setting. Take a long, hard realistic look at what she is doing to your mental health and ask yourself how you will feel a few years from now if things don’t change but instead get worse. I have seen adult children eaten alive by caregiving abusive parents. You DO NOT owe that to her. Your primary obligations now are to your own offspring. Think hard about how this impacts them.
This is so wise and so true. I didn't even have my mother in my house, but I allowed abuse. I went to a therapist who had all sorts of techniques to diffuse, or detach or laugh at mom's abuse and none of it did much and it was extremely damaging to my children to witness. I took the high road for years and finally reached my limit and told her off. I told her exactly what i thought of her horrendous behavior and how it impacted me and the family I created. I told her it no longer acceptable if she wanted any relationship with me at all. She was livid and stopped talking to me for a long time. Then she behaved. She talks poorly about me behind my back and I sealed those leaks and made it clear what she says behind my back is NONE of my business. She no longer messes with me and if she is done I simple will make sure she is safe and cared for, but I will turn it over to the caregivers only and will not subject myself to another insult, tantrum, manipulation or ragefest.
Anonymous
04/08/2023 19:22
Subject: I Cannot Stand My Mother
Anonymous wrote:You are earning your way into heaven. Do you think you deserve a free pass?
This is such BS. Often what happens is people do themselves in for an abusive parent and the reward is their own illness at the end.
Start looking into assisted living. Don't make it a punishment or threat. Just let her know the dynamic is unhealthy and it's time to move on. You will visit as long as she can be respectful. Abuse is no longer tolerated.
Anonymous
04/08/2023 18:58
Subject: I Cannot Stand My Mother
DCUM usually tends to tell people to push relatives away, OP. You have it reversed. It tells parents to let their kids suffer the natural consequences of their actions, and push them out if they want to stay past 18; and tells adults to stick their old parents into homes.
I've spent years on this site, so I know.
It sounds as if you'd all be better off separating, with your mother in a nursing home. The problem is affording it!
Anonymous
04/08/2023 18:48
Subject: I Cannot Stand My Mother
Please do not let her destroy your well being or the well being of your family!
Tell her that her actions and words are screaming at you that she is unhappy being with you, it is time to act on finding a new living situation.
Tell her that her actions and words are screaming at you that she is unhappy being with you, it is time to act on finding a new living situation.
Anonymous
04/08/2023 18:42
Subject: I Cannot Stand My Mother
I agree 100% with the kind PP who kindly shared their experience. It is so hard to remove the toxic programming. It’s taken decades to see my mom’s influence and to try to release it. If you can, protect your children from this. You love your mom and want to help, and feel guilty about assisted living. It’s almost impossible to change your mom, and not easy to change your dynamic with her, as hard as you try. If that’s the case, make sure it’s as nice an AL facility as possible and visit regularly.
Anonymous
04/08/2023 16:02
Subject: Re:I Cannot Stand My Mother
OP let me share my perspective with you. For background, I was raised by a wolf mother too - actually, that’s an insult to wolves - so I’m acutely aware of the particular cruelty of a psychologically twisted mother. This stuff comes from personality disorder, it is not easy stuff to fix especially because most of these cold critical nasty negative mothers are up there on the bad end of the narcissistic personality traits spectrum, and do not even have the capacity to recognize their behavior is dysfunctional thus no willingness to work on behavior change which requires insight. Narcissists do not progress much in therapy, even if you can get one there.
Now, after spending all my reproductive years on academic and career achievement in law and then having a health breakdown in my early 40s, I have spent the last 7 years working as a caregiver primarily for hospice status patients. Beyond my personal experience of dozens of clients, I have read extensively and shared experiences with other caregivers in support groups - yes, even unrelated caregivers need support groups and other strategies to cope with the harrowing effects of the work, which is too often with angry bitter people who lash out on the regular even at their paid, non related caregivers.
What I’ve seen is that people usually become more of what they always were as they age and decline both physically and cognitively. The Scrooge transformation upon realization of impending mortality is a fantastical imagination - the truth of most of humanity is much more evident in Miss Havisham, and Dickens knew better than most how fraught the parent child relationship could be. Your mom is not likely to get any nicer and is much more likely to be more and more cruel as she becomes more vulnerable in her body and mind. She cannot help but be especially cruel to you, because mothers of this type have spent a lifetime installing our psychological vulnerabilities in us and they can trigger them with very little effort, even if we have the insight and work very very hard, it is toxic to live day in and day out with a bully. If you keep your mother at home she will likely steal at least 5 years from your life expectancy, time you could have with your kids and grandkids at the end of your life. In the meantime the toxic dynamic she exudes into your family home will have effects that you may not even perceive now - children who live with a bully and watch that bully do their bullying to someone they really love are impacted by that, trust me. It will impact them in how they feel about intimacy with family, friends and someday potential partners and their own kids.
I would urge you t set aside any misplaced guilt and research options for your mother to live in assisted living or other similar setting. Take a long, hard realistic look at what she is doing to your mental health and ask yourself how you will feel a few years from now if things don’t change but instead get worse. I have seen adult children eaten alive by caregiving abusive parents. You DO NOT owe that to her. Your primary obligations now are to your own offspring. Think hard about how this impacts them.
Now, after spending all my reproductive years on academic and career achievement in law and then having a health breakdown in my early 40s, I have spent the last 7 years working as a caregiver primarily for hospice status patients. Beyond my personal experience of dozens of clients, I have read extensively and shared experiences with other caregivers in support groups - yes, even unrelated caregivers need support groups and other strategies to cope with the harrowing effects of the work, which is too often with angry bitter people who lash out on the regular even at their paid, non related caregivers.
What I’ve seen is that people usually become more of what they always were as they age and decline both physically and cognitively. The Scrooge transformation upon realization of impending mortality is a fantastical imagination - the truth of most of humanity is much more evident in Miss Havisham, and Dickens knew better than most how fraught the parent child relationship could be. Your mom is not likely to get any nicer and is much more likely to be more and more cruel as she becomes more vulnerable in her body and mind. She cannot help but be especially cruel to you, because mothers of this type have spent a lifetime installing our psychological vulnerabilities in us and they can trigger them with very little effort, even if we have the insight and work very very hard, it is toxic to live day in and day out with a bully. If you keep your mother at home she will likely steal at least 5 years from your life expectancy, time you could have with your kids and grandkids at the end of your life. In the meantime the toxic dynamic she exudes into your family home will have effects that you may not even perceive now - children who live with a bully and watch that bully do their bullying to someone they really love are impacted by that, trust me. It will impact them in how they feel about intimacy with family, friends and someday potential partners and their own kids.
I would urge you t set aside any misplaced guilt and research options for your mother to live in assisted living or other similar setting. Take a long, hard realistic look at what she is doing to your mental health and ask yourself how you will feel a few years from now if things don’t change but instead get worse. I have seen adult children eaten alive by caregiving abusive parents. You DO NOT owe that to her. Your primary obligations now are to your own offspring. Think hard about how this impacts them.
Anonymous
04/08/2023 15:50
Subject: I Cannot Stand My Mother
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:That's sad but it sounds like she can't stand you either so just find someplace else for her to live. She probably wouldn't treat the residents and staff at an assisted living place the same way she's treating you, or maybe she would, but she doesn't deserve to live with someone who is constantly annoyed by her and you don't deserve to live with someone who is mean to you. Do something soon.
This is your way out. Take her words at face value. Just tell her that it’s obvious that she can’t stand living with you, so you’ve made arrangements for her to live somewhere else. Tell her that you only want her to be happy, and you’re more than willing to make that happen for her. Move her out with zero guilt. Hell, I’d start looking at places today. This isn’t going to magically get better on its own.
100%! It almost seems like she is asking you to make her leave. Is it possible she would like to leave but doesn't know how to ask?
Anonymous
04/08/2023 15:15
Subject: I Cannot Stand My Mother
Psychiatric evaluation is necessary.
Anonymous
04/08/2023 15:08
Subject: I Cannot Stand My Mother
Anonymous wrote:That's sad but it sounds like she can't stand you either so just find someplace else for her to live. She probably wouldn't treat the residents and staff at an assisted living place the same way she's treating you, or maybe she would, but she doesn't deserve to live with someone who is constantly annoyed by her and you don't deserve to live with someone who is mean to you. Do something soon.
This is your way out. Take her words at face value. Just tell her that it’s obvious that she can’t stand living with you, so you’ve made arrangements for her to live somewhere else. Tell her that you only want her to be happy, and you’re more than willing to make that happen for her. Move her out with zero guilt. Hell, I’d start looking at places today. This isn’t going to magically get better on its own.