Anonymous
Post 04/24/2023 23:37     Subject: Maintaining relationship with XIL’s/grandparents
Anonymous wrote:You keep posting here and no one can tell you what to do. You should get a hotel room and see them outside the house. Simple. You promised a visit and need to follow through. Or, stop the drama, stop all contact and be done with it as you clearly don't want the kids to have a relationship with him or his side of the family.


The drunk father created the drama, and hides it from his own parents. OP doesn’t owe anyone time off work or school to chaperone Ex-in law travel or visits and have kids or her or “dad” pretend everything’s normal.
It’s not normal; he’s an alcoholic who drives drunk, lashes out, breaks things, behaves abusively when drinking. he destroyed his marriage. Does he work?
Anonymous
Post 04/24/2023 23:33     Subject: Maintaining relationship with XIL’s/grandparents
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:It’s not your job to police environments that you think may or may not be good for his recovery. Focus on the children only. If you don’t want to take them then let him take them himself.


This guy has driven drunk with them, and is barely sober. No, he shouldn’t take them himself.

OP, I think you not being sure about divorce makes this decision hard. If you’re leaning toward staying, then go on the trip and just act normally. If not,maybe tell mil why you’re not going. Have you consulted an attorney? You should, you may need to document some things he’s done , to protect the kids.


They are still his children and OP can’t keep him from taking them to see their grandparents. He is currently sober and presents no danger, especially if 2 other adults will be in the home. OP is the one causing an issue here- she needs to suck it up and go along or realize he can take them himself. I assume he’s flying so driving won’t be an issue.


He drove drunk with them within the past few months. He absolutely does present a danger. There’s no way in hell I would be allowing my spouse to go on a visit out of state with my children. He might be flying, but his parents presumably have cars. Their home is not an alcohol-free space.


Agree. I hope Op has a lawyer who houses all the documentation and incidents.

Sounds like a nightmare.
Anonymous
Post 04/24/2023 23:32     Subject: Re:Maintaining relationship with XIL’s/grandparents
Anonymous wrote:ILs should fly to you and stay in a hotel and visit however much they want. Kids could visit in their hotel perhaps - especially if there's a pool, or you can all go to
a park or something. Staying with you, without him in the home, would be awkward for sure. But no reason they can't visit and he can join.


This.

Keep your kids on their stable school and activities routine.

Your husband needs AA and 12+ mos of sobriety and reckoning. None of that is your fault. Not seeing the in laws is not your fault either. Their son is very ill and needs help.

Protect yourself and the kids. Break the cycle. Don’t look back.
Anonymous
Post 04/08/2023 08:18     Subject: Maintaining relationship with XIL’s/grandparents
I think you should call your husband's parents. Let them know what's happening and that you are separated and let them know why. I wouldn't say they shouldn't serve alcohol but would be clear that alcohol is a major problem and your husband their son is in recovery.

Stay in a hotel when you visit so you can set a boundary with your spouse. Refuse to be actors. Let your family knownyour relationship is in trouble. I have a very supportive family and if my family members marriage was in trouble we would donwhat we could to support them (unless we realized it was too toxic). The earlier poster who mentioned secrets is correct.

Also, even if you have full custody of your kids after divorce if your husband wants to excercise his parental rights or give you a bunch of grief he will be able to. I hope your marriage works but just in case it doesn't you will need that family support if a judge doesn't agree to supervised visitation or no overnights etc.
Anonymous
Post 03/06/2023 00:02     Subject: Maintaining relationship with XIL’s/grandparents
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Please clarify: These are HIS children? If so, does the kid’s birth mother want her kids around alcoholic dad and okay with you leaving town? How long has your husband been in recovery? Are grandparents aware that your husband is in recovery? Honestly, a trip to visit people (while separated) seems like more than you should take on.

These questions make no sense. Birth mother?


OP, I’d wait. See how things go over the next couple of months. Once you have clarity in the future of the relationship, it will be easier to figure out how to handle. I would not bring his mom into it for now while things are still up in the air.


Op here. Thanks. I feel bad because they want to see each other and it feels like I’m in the way of that, though I’m in the way because he’s proven to be unsafe. But wait and see is probably the best for this just like everyone else right now.

To the PP, the kids are mine and my husbands. There are no other parents involved. He’s been sober a couple of months - which is great, but no where near long enough.


You are not in the way of his parent’s relationship with your kids. His alcoholism is in the way. His inability to be truthful with them about rehab and his marital separation his in the way. The centrality of alcohol in his parent’s lives is in the way. The fact that you are the only one unwilling to pretend there is an elephant in the room doesn’t make you the problem.

This is what it looks like in a family system not affected by alcoholism - My Dad is the kind of guy who has a glass of wine with dinner. If he is hosting dinner he will offer pre-dinner drinks. There’s an entire closet full of alcohol in his house. But when I asked my parents to stop serving alcohol when we came over with my DH (now Ex) who had a drinking problem, It took one ask and the answer was immediately - sure, no problem. I was never criticized. No one lamented their freedom to drink was being taken away. No one took offense. No one called me controlling. It was as if I had said, I’m allergic to your dog, can you put it in another room while I’m here.

You are not the problem.
Anonymous
Post 03/05/2023 23:48     Subject: Maintaining relationship with XIL’s/grandparents
Anonymous wrote:It’s not your job to police environments that you think may or may not be good for his recovery. Focus on the children only. If you don’t want to take them then let him take them himself.


The issue of the in laws is very hard. BTDT. I agree that it’s not your job to control his drinking or his parents’ drinking but you do get to control what kind of environment you want to be in and what kind of environment you want the kids to be in.

You can say, “I don’t want to visit your Mom because there is alcohol everywhere. Your recovery is so new that *I* don’t want to be around alcohol and you. It’s too stressful for *me*. I also don’t feel comfortable visiting with your parents and lying or hiding our separation and your ongoing rehab. I am not OK with you taking the kids by yourself because you have driven drunk with them. Etc.

You can say what you would be comfortable with - they come here, you go to visit them but don’t stay with them. Go for a day instead of 5. Have more Zoom time. You visit, but make it clear that if your husband drinks at all there, you will leave immediately. Whatever options work for you.

Your husband does not get to have family visits just the same way they were before. That is part of rehab - accepting responsibility for the consequences of addiction. Maybe he can’t stay in parent’s home again. Maybe he can’t appear to others as if he has a marriage that is good. Maybe his kids aren’t gonna have a close relationship with the grandparents because of the way alcohol is so accessible in their home and that no longer works for your family. Acknowledging you’re an alcoholic means acknowledging that there are consequences to your addiction and many things will have to change. He/you can’t just think - well he’ll get sober and then come back and everything will go back to what it was.
Anonymous
Post 02/27/2023 21:21     Subject: Maintaining relationship with XIL’s/grandparents
Anonymous wrote:OP here. The range of perspectives on DCUM is always fascinating. Thanks for all the feedback.

The first part of 17:20’s post really resonated with me. I don’t feel the slightest bit responsible for his sobriety or controlling his environment, but I am 100% responsible for keeping my kids safe. If he insists on taking this trip I’ll go with them in order to do that, but I think it’s a terrible idea. His parents plan everything WAY in advance. I’m guessing they’ve been asking him about it. 7 weeks away is short notice for them. He’s been asking me about it. I asked for time to think about it, which he’s okay with, but it will come up again soon. Surprisingly, no one in my circle of real life friends/acquaintances has dealt with something like this, it’s helpful for me to get different ideas here. It helps me think about it.

I absolutely want him to have a relationship with the kids. I want him to stay sober, make amends, and come home. I want to be able to forgive him. He’s had stretches of being a really good dad, and a good partner. I love him. Then he drinks and it all goes to hell. But even if we do end up divorcing I want the kids to have a relationship with him and with their grandparents.

I have a therapist, I’ve been going to Al anon. I talked to an attorney and I have a fair amount of documentation, with access to more (medical records, etc). I’m well positioned to pursue full custody if necessary. He has totally respected my boundaries since he’s been out of rehab, so I don’t feel like it’s necessary at this point. If that changes, I have a plan in place. I don’t want to take those steps now though, because I’m not ready to divorce. If he relapses again I’m out, but he seems more serious about recovery now than at any other point and I want to be able to tell the kids I tried everything I possibly could to keep our family together.

I don’t think I’m being a drama queen. My life flipped upside down a couple of months ago and I’m navigating a bunch of new and unexpected situations, while focusing on being a calm and steady presence for my kids so they don’t feel like their lives flipped upside down. Im doing pretty well with it, but man this is a tricky time.


OP, I don't think you are a drama queen. You are dealing with a very difficult situations. I think you should re-read 17:30's response and think about it. You haven't answered whether his parents know you are separated. I'd further ask if they know your husband has been in-patient rehab? Do they have some sense of the full extent of them problem here? Are you being asked to be the secret keeper?

Based on the timing of this trip is this a big family Easter celebration? If so, then IMO it is MANDATORY that all of you stay elsewhere/in a hotel. Surely your husband's sponsor/therapist as well as your own have suggested it so your husband can leave if he feels the need to drink. If it's not big family Easter, then I think it's reasonable and advisable to ask his parents to remove all alcohol during his visit. Doesn't mean forever, but for the weekend that their son who just finished rehab is in town with his family and the grandkids that they haven't seen in a year it's reasonable.

Bottom line I guess I am saying don't agree to put yourself and your kids in a situation where you are worried about him relapsing for the sake of keeping up appearances. Only he can truly manage his sobriety, but you can certainly voice your opinion and draw boundaries.
Anonymous
Post 02/27/2023 20:04     Subject: Maintaining relationship with XIL’s/grandparents
Anonymous wrote:OP here. The range of perspectives on DCUM is always fascinating. Thanks for all the feedback.

The first part of 17:20’s post really resonated with me. I don’t feel the slightest bit responsible for his sobriety or controlling his environment, but I am 100% responsible for keeping my kids safe. If he insists on taking this trip I’ll go with them in order to do that, but I think it’s a terrible idea. His parents plan everything WAY in advance. I’m guessing they’ve been asking him about it. 7 weeks away is short notice for them. He’s been asking me about it. I asked for time to think about it, which he’s okay with, but it will come up again soon. Surprisingly, no one in my circle of real life friends/acquaintances has dealt with something like this, it’s helpful for me to get different ideas here. It helps me think about it.

I absolutely want him to have a relationship with the kids. I want him to stay sober, make amends, and come home. I want to be able to forgive him. He’s had stretches of being a really good dad, and a good partner. I love him. Then he drinks and it all goes to hell. But even if we do end up divorcing I want the kids to have a relationship with him and with their grandparents.

I have a therapist, I’ve been going to Al anon. I talked to an attorney and I have a fair amount of documentation, with access to more (medical records, etc). I’m well positioned to pursue full custody if necessary. He has totally respected my boundaries since he’s been out of rehab, so I don’t feel like it’s necessary at this point. If that changes, I have a plan in place. I don’t want to take those steps now though, because I’m not ready to divorce. If he relapses again I’m out, but he seems more serious about recovery now than at any other point and I want to be able to tell the kids I tried everything I possibly could to keep our family together.

I don’t think I’m being a drama queen. My life flipped upside down a couple of months ago and I’m navigating a bunch of new and unexpected situations, while focusing on being a calm and steady presence for my kids so they don’t feel like their lives flipped upside down. Im doing pretty well with it, but man this is a tricky time.


OP, you have been posting for several years, not months. File for divorce, be done with it.
Anonymous
Post 02/26/2023 20:47     Subject: Maintaining relationship with XIL’s/grandparents
OP here. The range of perspectives on DCUM is always fascinating. Thanks for all the feedback.

The first part of 17:20’s post really resonated with me. I don’t feel the slightest bit responsible for his sobriety or controlling his environment, but I am 100% responsible for keeping my kids safe. If he insists on taking this trip I’ll go with them in order to do that, but I think it’s a terrible idea. His parents plan everything WAY in advance. I’m guessing they’ve been asking him about it. 7 weeks away is short notice for them. He’s been asking me about it. I asked for time to think about it, which he’s okay with, but it will come up again soon. Surprisingly, no one in my circle of real life friends/acquaintances has dealt with something like this, it’s helpful for me to get different ideas here. It helps me think about it.

I absolutely want him to have a relationship with the kids. I want him to stay sober, make amends, and come home. I want to be able to forgive him. He’s had stretches of being a really good dad, and a good partner. I love him. Then he drinks and it all goes to hell. But even if we do end up divorcing I want the kids to have a relationship with him and with their grandparents.

I have a therapist, I’ve been going to Al anon. I talked to an attorney and I have a fair amount of documentation, with access to more (medical records, etc). I’m well positioned to pursue full custody if necessary. He has totally respected my boundaries since he’s been out of rehab, so I don’t feel like it’s necessary at this point. If that changes, I have a plan in place. I don’t want to take those steps now though, because I’m not ready to divorce. If he relapses again I’m out, but he seems more serious about recovery now than at any other point and I want to be able to tell the kids I tried everything I possibly could to keep our family together.

I don’t think I’m being a drama queen. My life flipped upside down a couple of months ago and I’m navigating a bunch of new and unexpected situations, while focusing on being a calm and steady presence for my kids so they don’t feel like their lives flipped upside down. Im doing pretty well with it, but man this is a tricky time.
Anonymous
Post 02/26/2023 18:05     Subject: Maintaining relationship with XIL’s/grandparents
Anonymous wrote:You keep posting here and no one can tell you what to do. You should get a hotel room and see them outside the house. Simple. You promised a visit and need to follow through. Or, stop the drama, stop all contact and be done with it as you clearly don't want the kids to have a relationship with him or his side of the family.


+1 Stop with the drama. What does your therapist say about this? You’re wringing your hands over some possible trip in April. Why does this have to be decided today? Why are you posting? Go focus on your kids and your own recovery from this mess. You’re going to have to learn a new normal: not managing every crisis. Are you ready for that—really ready? It may mean you have to actually sit with yourself.

Peace to you.
Anonymous
Post 02/26/2023 17:57     Subject: Maintaining relationship with XIL’s/grandparents
You keep posting here and no one can tell you what to do. You should get a hotel room and see them outside the house. Simple. You promised a visit and need to follow through. Or, stop the drama, stop all contact and be done with it as you clearly don't want the kids to have a relationship with him or his side of the family.
Anonymous
Post 02/26/2023 17:50     Subject: Re:Maintaining relationship with XIL’s/grandparents
If he has been to rehab then honesty should be a part of his recovery right? I would go on the trip and advise him to ask his parents to remove the alcohol since he should be honest with them. Certainly alcohol in the picture is a bad bad idea. If he is unwilling to talk to them, drinks on the trip, your decision about divorce will become clearer but I wouldn’t cancel right now.
Anonymous
Post 02/26/2023 17:38     Subject: Maintaining relationship with XIL’s/grandparents
Just file for divorce. This kind of ambiguity with informal separations is what drives all the awkward situations
It’s still awkward while divorce is in process but less so, and the end is in sight
Signed,
Someone who only started seeing stbxILs again after filing for divorce
Anonymous
Post 02/26/2023 17:33     Subject: Maintaining relationship with XIL’s/grandparents
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:It’s not your job to police environments that you think may or may not be good for his recovery. Focus on the children only. If you don’t want to take them then let him take them himself.


This guy has driven drunk with them, and is barely sober. No, he shouldn’t take them himself.

OP, I think you not being sure about divorce makes this decision hard. If you’re leaning toward staying, then go on the trip and just act normally. If not,maybe tell mil why you’re not going. Have you consulted an attorney? You should, you may need to document some things he’s done , to protect the kids.


They are still his children and OP can’t keep him from taking them to see their grandparents. He is currently sober and presents no danger, especially if 2 other adults will be in the home. OP is the one causing an issue here- she needs to suck it up and go along or realize he can take them himself. I assume he’s flying so driving won’t be an issue.


He drove drunk with them within the past few months. He absolutely does present a danger. There’s no way in hell I would be allowing my spouse to go on a visit out of state with my children. He might be flying, but his parents presumably have cars. Their home is not an alcohol-free space.
Anonymous
Post 02/26/2023 17:30     Subject: Re:Maintaining relationship with XIL’s/grandparents
He wants you to protect the secret. Secrets are toxic. You’re not playing the role of secret keeper anymore. This is part of your recovery, OP.

“I’m not comfortable taking our children to your parents’ home with you. There is alcohol everywhere, and I’m not up for watching you navigate that this early in your recovery. I’m happy to fly your parents here. Or I can take the kids to see them without you. Those are the choices I can live with.”